Kennedy and Willow's past

[EVIL UU]

Would Kennedy still have been interested in Willow if she had known the whole truth?

You know, mostly about what Willow had done to Tara, as in months of brainwashing and rape? Don't you think it's troubling that nobody has the guts to clue her in? Now, I'm obviously not expecting Willow to do that, she's completely rotten nor Buffy because she clearly has zero problems with dating abusive monstrosities and rapists, it probably turns her on or something but maybe Xander? He did tell Riley about Buffy's past after all. No, of course not, he keeps his mouth shut.

Why doesn't anybody have enough backbone to tell Kennedy what she's getting into? She does have the right to know.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I wondered about this, too. Kennedy pursued Willow so hard without knowing much about her, and it always bugged me that no one ever brought up the fact that Willow mind-raped not only Tara, but all of them (Tabula Rasa). I mean, loving someone means loving the good, the bad, and the ugly, so she should have been told.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

I think they all assume by mid season 7 that Willow has reformed, turned over a new leaf and is now one of the good guys. Only Anya questions whether she came back from England too early - but that is before Kennedy arrives on the scene and Anya is really no criterion for judgement, herself. Willow herself warns Kennedy that she would not like to see Dark Willow, so it's not as if she is trying to hide her past. You don't see the ravages of magic addiction as with Rack nor the murder of Warren, although Kennedy does get introduced to that in "The Killer in Me". And of course, there is a ridiculous amount of forgiveness in the entire Buffy series - but that is what allows for recurring drama with the same characters. Besides, Kennedy is the Potential with the most potential - if Buffy could keep going with all the bad decisions she made, Kennedy should be able to do the same.

There is also a limit to how much you should interfere in someone else's relationship - I know of several couples who I would think really don't belong together, but I don't say anything about it because why should my point of view as an outsider matter? Live and let live.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I think they all assume by mid season 7 that Willow has reformed, turned over a new leaf and is now one of the good guys. Only Anya questions whether she came back from England too early - but that is before Kennedy arrives on the scene and Anya is really no criterion for judgement, herself. Willow herself warns Kennedy that she would not like to see Dark Willow, so it's not as if she is trying to hide her past. You don't see the ravages of magic addiction as with Rack nor the murder of Warren, although Kennedy does get introduced to that in "The Killer in Me". And of course, there is a ridiculous amount of forgiveness in the entire Buffy series - but that is what allows for recurring drama with the same characters. Besides, Kennedy is the Potential with the most potential - if Buffy could keep going with all the bad decisions she made, Kennedy should be able to do the same.

There is also a limit to how much you should interfere in someone else's relationship - I know of several couples who I would think really don't belong together, but I don't say anything about it because why should my point of view as an outsider matter? Live and let live.

It's true that Willow did warn her that Dark Willow was bad news, but was Willow really "Dark Willow" at the time she mind-raped her friends and girlfriend with the spell? No.

Sorry, I just don't buy the live and let live excuse when it comes to Willow. And it's not interfering if you share information with someone that is vital to the relationship. For instance, if I ever divorced and started dating again, would I want to know a potential new husband was a child molester? Hell yes I would, because I have children and that kind of thing is vital to know before starting a relationship.

 

[Xin Rong]

Would Kennedy still have been interested in Willow if she had known the whole truth?

You know, mostly about what Willow had done to Tara, as in months of brainwashing and rape? Don't you think it's troubling that nobody has the guts to clue her in? Now, I'm obviously not expecting Willow to do that, she's completely rotten nor Buffy because she clearly has zero problems with dating abusive monstrosities and rapists, it probably turns her on or something but maybe Xander? He did tell Riley about Buffy's past after all. No, of course not, he keeps his mouth shut.

Why doesn't anybody have enough backbone to tell Kennedy what she's getting into? She does have the right to know.

To be fair, it's easy to forgive something you didn't see, and considering kennedy's lack of belief in magic coupled with the forgiveness of willow's friends, it always seemed like she didn't really understand how bad Willow was

 

[tec]

Wait months of brainwashing? that forget spell lasted a few days at best

 

[white avenger]

Maybe it sounds cold blooded of me, but my take on Season 7 Kennedy was that she basically on her own for the first time (was it ever mentioned whether or not she had ever been approached by the Council or had a Watcher assigned to her?) and anxious to finally come out of the closet. I'm not exactly sure just how she picked Willow as her potential partner, but I seriously doubt that knowing about her past would have mattered that much. We're talking here about the girl who "always got what (her) way," here, and she obviously wanted Willow from the moment that she laid eyes on her.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

Were the rest of the gang fully aware of what she had been doing to Tara, I can't actually remember?

Maybe it sounds cold blooded of me, but my take on Season 7 Kennedy was that she basically on her own for the first time (was it ever mentioned whether or not she had ever been approached by the Council or had a Watcher assigned to her?) and anxious to finally come out of the closet. I'm not exactly sure just how she picked Willow as her potential partner, but I seriously doubt that knowing about her past would have mattered that much. We're talking here about the girl who "always got what (her) way," here, and she obviously wanted Willow from the moment that she laid eyes on her.

I think it's mentioned she knew her watcher and he was killed, so I think she's been in training for awhile, she was the most advanced of the girls.

And I always got the exact opposite feeling about her, She mentioned she knew she was gay since she saw Gone with the Wind, I think she's always been out, it's just her personality is very forward.

 

[white avenger]

And I always got the exact opposite feeling about her, She mentioned she knew she was gay since she saw Gone with the Wind, I think she's always been out, it's just her personality is very forward.

Knowing that she was gay and being ready to let anyone else know it is two different things, but I freely admit that this is pure conjecture on my part.

I do, however, fail to see what there might be in "Gone With The Wind" that would have brought about such an epiphone.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

Knowing that she was gay and being ready to let anyone else know it is two different things, but I freely admit that this is pure conjecture on my part.

I do, however, fail to see what there might be in "Gone With The Wind" that would have brought about such an epiphone.

True, it's very open to speculation. I have to say I always thought she was always out, it hadn't occurred to me that she might only recently be out and thats were her brass comes from. I think if that were the case she'd be considered cocky, I've always take it she was just in your face, there is a fine line between the two. Could be something to do with why so many people didn't like her, taking her as cocky rather then just as having an 'in your face' personality.

I think she said it was seeing Scarlet O'Hara in the film as a kid.

 

[Robb Stark]

Would Kennedy still have been interested in Willow if she had known the whole truth?

You know, mostly about what Willow had done to Tara, as in months of brainwashing and rape? Don't you think it's troubling that nobody has the guts to clue her in? Now, I'm obviously not expecting Willow to do that, she's completely rotten nor Buffy because she clearly has zero problems with dating abusive monstrosities and rapists, it probably turns her on or something but maybe Xander? He did tell Riley about Buffy's past after all. No, of course not, he keeps his mouth shut.

Why doesn't anybody have enough backbone to tell Kennedy what she's getting into? She does have the right to know.

Because just about everything to do with Willow from the midway point of S6 on didn't make a whole lot of sense. She went from being one of the sweetest, most charming characters on the show to an arrogant jerk. They redeemed her in S7, a bit, but not in a way that was terribly smart.

Willow never has to answer for her crimes. She tries to end the world, goes ballistic, murders a guy while he's tied up, attempts to murder Dawn, Buffy several times and everyone else whose tried to help her. At the very, very least, she should never be allowed to do magic again. Ever. But the writers obviously didn't consider Willow to be an interesting enough character to explore that route (which would have been FAR more interesting than her just doing magic again because "it's a part of her now", which was about the dumbest thing they ever did), and just basically whitewashed everything that had happened in S6. I mean, "Tablua Rasa" might as well never had happened. The Dark Willow arc was minimized so much that it was pretty much written off as a simple mistake. No one calls her on anything, not really. I mean, Willow tries to slaughter Buffy's little sister, she's proven twice that she completely folds when using magic, and Buffy's just okay letting her back in the club? Huh?

So Kennedy isn't really unique in that regard. When you think about it, Willow probably commits the worst crimes of anyone in Buffy and Angel's groups (well, except Anya, but that's another mess that just gets ignored), and yet her sins just get ignored and waved away.

 

[white avenger]

Willow never has to answer for her crimes.

That's another one of Joss' favorite themes. No matter how terrible a character's crimes might be, one simple "Gee, really sorry about that," wipes the slate clean. Murder, rape, attempted world destruction, all just water under the bridge.

 

[Evil Angelus 95]

Wait months of brainwashing? that forget spell lasted a few days at best

That was the impression I had as well, that Willow only did the spell twice (In Once More, With Feeling and Tabula Rosa) If I'm wrong, please correct me

 

[tec]

I dont think your wrong I been going over my scripts and theres only those two times
and those two eps happen back to back

 

[Robb Stark]

That's another one of Joss' favorite themes. No matter how terrible a character's crimes might be, one simple "Gee, really sorry about that," wipes the slate clean. Murder, rape, attempted world destruction, all just water under the bridge.

You know, I don't think he intends it like that. I think it's just a weakness he has a writer. Joss is really, really good at creating compelling drama, but more often than not he has no idea where to go with his characters in a way that makes sense after the arc is over.

I think he paints himself into a corner at times and doesn't have either the patience or the talent to get himself out of it. Willow with magic is an easy fix to problems like the Turok-Han storming the house. He just didn't want to take the time and tell what could have been a really good story of Willow not being allowed to use magic again but still contributing, like she did in the first two or three seasons. And really, it was pretty silly. From a logical standpoint, why would the Scoobies just permit that? At least with Angel and Spike they told redemption stories and explored different angles (and the argument can easily be made that they aren't even responsible, while Willow is completely responsible). I just felt it could have been done so much better.

 

[EVIL UU]

[MENTION=12163]tec[/MENTION]

Wait months of brainwashing? that forget spell lasted a few days at best

I dont think your wrong I been going over my scripts and theres only those two times and those two eps happen back to back

We see it for the first time in "All the Way" and it's pretty obvious from the way the scene's played out that it's not been the first time and that Willow's been doing it for some time. How long? Since not long after Buffy's death would be my guess.
[MENTION=11975]Always Bangel[/MENTION]

but more often than not he has no idea where to go with his characters in a way that makes sense after the arc is over.

This, a thousand times.

 

[tec]

I just watched the ep and read the script+transcript nothing there indacates that the forget spell at the end of the ep has been done before this one I dont bleave Willow has been brainwashing Tara for months

I meen yeah what she dose is not right and Tara finds out and does the right thing at the end of Tabula Rasa but theres no way Willow would have been doing it for awile

And the end of All the way directly bleeds into OMWF

 

[Buffy Summers]

I honestly don't think it would have made one bit of difference to Kennedy had she known about it.

 

[Taake]

I don't think it would have made a difference to Kennedy. She wasn't only a teenager but also very "I want it, I get it" - finding out Willow's past - to me, would only have made her think that Willow wouldn't/couldn't do that to her.

However... did she have a right to know?

Yes, since she is in a relationship with Willow there are things she might want to know about the person in question but that's not exactly the kind of thing you bring up on a first date. Willow and Kennedy didn't date for that long. When and if they got serious (I'm nt counting the comics right now cause I can't remember much of the portrayal of their relationship in it) Willow should have informed Kennedy. However I can't say that I think any of Willow's friends should have told... it's between Willow and Kennedy and though I think it would be okay for somene like Buffy or Xander to hint that "they should have a talk", out right telling about Willow's and Tara's personal business would have been way out of line in my book.

 

[brinkster130]

Interesting question...


I do think Kennedy had the right to know about Willows past with Tara but I doubt it would have made a difference about her decision to pursue Willow. I always thought part of Kennedy's attraction to Willow had to do with Willow being a leader of the group. Kennedy did what she wanted and really seemed to want to be in the loop and one of the "leaders" or important so her being close with Willow have her that.


Also, my guess is that Kennedy would have thought of herself as stronger than Tara; so she would have figured that she wouldn't have put up with that type of behavior from Willow.

As to why no one told Kennedy - they were probably preoccupied and/or didn't care. Another possibility is that none of them wanted to see Willow lose anyone else; they could have been worried about what she would do.