Knives On Planes

[white avenger]

As of the 25th of his month, for the first time since 9/11, air lines in the United States will allow passengers to bring certain specific knives on board with them, a ruling which is, I think, something that has been allowed on European flights for years without incidents,

For those not familiar with this issue:

http://kdvr.com/2013/03/14/tsa-chief-stands-by-decision-to-allow-knives-on-airplanes/

I'm curious as to what the members here might think of this situation.

As for myself, I grew up in a culture where all men and most boys over the age of 10, habitually carried a pocket knife to use for such mundane tasks as cutting cordage, peeling apples, sharpening pencils, or just plain whittling. To me, not carrying a knife of some description simply feels unnatural. To me, my pocket knife isn't by any interpretation of the word a weapon, it is a useful tool, something that I use each and every day. I see no threat whatsoever coming from the passengers in a plane having Swiss Army Classics, or anything similar. I think that all of the furor about this new ruling is totally unfounded.

 

[Buffy Summers]

I'd rather have the no-liquid rule rescinded than the no knife one lol

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I don't think it makes sense to lift that rule, there's no need to have them on a plane, they serve no useful purpose up there other then to be used as a weapon.

Granted I have done some of my best whittling work while soaring through the clouds, and when my iPad battery dies I do do need to sharpen my pencil to keep writing, but I've been getting by without it thus far... 😉

 

[Robb Stark]

I don't really see why you would need a knife as a carry on. I mean, you're allowed to pack it in luggage.

However, symbolically, I'm really happy about this. It's nice to see that the culture of fear around airplanes, which so understandably arose following 9/11, is beginning to cool down. I don't know if it'll ever fully die away, or even if it should, but I like this.

 

[white avenger]

I don't think it makes sense to lift that rule, there's no need to have them on a plane, they serve no useful purpose up there other then to be used as a weapon.

I'm not going to get an argument started about "need/don't need" in reference to this subject beyond my original statement above, but the reason Mr Pistole gave was that by relieving his people of the time and effort required to search for these small, relatively harmless items, it gave them more time to search for the much threats, like explosives and flammable liquids. Something like a choice to ignore a possible minor threat in order to spend more time searching for a far greater threat. (I just KNOW that I'm gonna get lynched for that comparison)

 

[Ethan Reigns]

Flying might be safer if the airlines issued knives to everyone as they boarded and collected them at the end of the flight, like headphones. After all, one 9/11 attack was foiled by passengers as have all the subsequent ones.

And I am in favour of all pilots having guns on board.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I'm not going to get an argument started about "need/don't need" in reference to this subject beyond my original statement above, but the reason Mr Pistole gave was that by relieving his people of the time and effort required to search for these small, relatively harmless items, it gave them more time to search for the much threats, like explosives and flammable liquids. Something like a choice to ignore a possible minor threat in order to spend more time searching for a far greater threat. (I just KNOW that I'm gonna get lynched for that comparison)

Ha ha, no that makes sense. I understand that you've also kinda said they don't need them on a plane, but if you are used to having it, it will be nice not to have to pack it.

It makes sense that they'd want to cut down on the time it takes to search people, although I don't think it will save that much time, the knives are picked up by the scanners. The argument sounds like he wanted to have a positive spin on it, but he makes it sound like all these liquid bombs are getting through because they had to take away a guys pen knife, which isn't the case.

I agree with Rob Stark, it's a nice sign of a calming in the fear of flights. I just don't think it's a necessary change as there's no practicable need to have them in the plane with you beyond personal reasons.

I'm also don't think we can have pen knives on a plane in Europe. I'm almost certain we can't even have things like nail clippers, I think I remember scoffing at that when I saw it last summer when I flew from Ireland to England then to Turkey.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I don't understand why people need to carry a knife on a plane. Those little bags of peanuts aren't THAT hard to open...

 

[white avenger]

I don't understand why people need to carry a knife on a plane. Those little bags of peanuts aren't THAT hard to open...

Wait until you have arthritis in your hands and THEN say that.

But, seriously, it's more a question of habit as anything else, and I freely admit that. But there are any number of other things that ARE allowed on board that are potentially more lethal than a folding knife with a 2 1/2 inch blade. Pencils, and pens come to mind immediately. Both have been proven in tests (yes, there are people who perform tests like this, and our tax dollars pay them to do it) to have more potential as a lethal weapon that any knife with a blade of the length we're talking about. A 6" or 12" plastic ruler can be sharpened, both point and edge, and be just as lethal as any knife of any size. Then here's the steel support shank in your shoes, Large belt buckles, and any number of other potential weapons. My Swiss Army Classic or Leatherman Micra pose no threat to anyone, and they CAN AND HAVE BEEN useful if the screws holding my glasses together work loose. We're not talking about 12" Bowie knives or samurai swords here.

 

[This Year's Girl]

I'm from europe and when I have been flying within europe knives haven't been allowed either. Although to be fair, the last time I was on a plane was 4 years ago 😀

I think it's a good rule, the potential harm they can do trumphs the freedom to carry them in my book, because you are allowed to bring them as carry on. 🙂

 

[sk]

I agree with Buffy.
Would rather they skipped the liquid ban.

It's annoying when you have to throw away your toothpaste when trying to travel light, for a quick trip, with just a small hand luggage.

/SK

 

[Washburne]

Ah, you got me thinking about the time I did walk around with a pocket knife. I miss that. Never in the purpose as a weapon/protection. Anyway, that wasn't the point. Personally I don't see why knives should be allowed to be carried onboard. The "hassle" of having to pack it properly is nothing. I can see the point of less work for the people at the airport searching for them but I'm not familiar enough with how things work to know the difference it'd make.

Not that I've been flying, ever, but the whole liquid thing has annoyed me anyway.

As for allowing pilots having guns it's difficult for me to imagine. But if they ever do allow it they better make sure the pilots get more than a little education and practice. Weapons in the hands of the not well trained is in my opinion more dangerous than no weapon at all. Add the stress that come to play in situations when they'd be needed.

 

[white avenger]

Personally I don't see why knives should be allowed to be carried onboard. The "hassle" of having to pack it properly is nothing.

That's all fine and good if toy check luggage in, but if you only have carry on items, it's not an option. As I said, we're not talking about 10" Bowie knives or Samurai swords here, just knives for the most part so small that someone would almost have to tell you that you were cut before you even knew it. Or, at least that's what I intend to carry on our coming trip to New York City.

By the actual description of what will now be allowed, there are very few, if any, knives with blades much more than 1" long that don't have locking blades and/or serrations on the blade, both of which are still banned. I would be inclined to worry more about the hockey sticks, pool ques, and golf clubs that will be allowed than my Leatherman Micra.

 

[Robb Stark]

[MENTION=12171]Ethan Reigns[/MENTION],

I don't see how you could arm pilots. I mean, I get the principle, but taking a profession that has nothing whatsoever to do with firearms and then expecting them to suddenly be able and expected to actively defend an aircraft and its passengers in that way seems a bit unrealistic to me. I suppose it could be grandfathered in, and years down the road just become a part of the job, but there are major, major risks to it as well.

I mean, what if a jumpy pilot misfires and punctures the hull? Then people are in serious, serious trouble. I don't know if, on a plane, I'd trust a cop, marshal (even though I know they're allowed weapons on board) or military personnel to make a shot on a plane, let alone someone who doesn't perform it as a function of the job.

 

[Washburne]

That's all fine and good if toy check luggage in, but if you only have carry on items, it's not an option.

Yeah, I always forget about that. Of course you're right about that. Can I blame it on my inexperience when it comes to flying. 😉

I would be inclined to worry more about the hockey sticks, pool ques, and golf clubs that will be allowed

Those would be allowed to take on as carry ons? I'm so clueless on this subject.

 

[ILLYRIAN]

Isn't the reasoning for not allowing the swiss army knife more about them being a concealed weapons on a person.
And about pilots having guns, isn't that about if an intruder gets into the cockpit?
Are we just talking about America here?

 

[white avenger]

Yeah, I always forget about that. Of course you're right about that. Can I blame it on my inexperience when it comes to flying. 😉


Those would be allowed to take on as carry ons? I'm so clueless on this subject.

I make a point of NEVER flying anywhere it can be avoided. Sitting "cheek to cheek" with strangers for hours isn't my idea of a relaxing travel mode.

Reclaiming bags an be a nightmare, and the amount of luggage lost in transit is positively criminal. My wife and I are planning a weekend trip to NYC with a church group this spring, and we plan to take only carry on luggage.

And, yeah, the same ruling that allows small non-locking (why the locking feature is prohibited is beyond me, since that's a safety feature entirely) folding knives allows all that other stuff, far more potentially lethal than the knives, but all that you hear about is the knives.

 

[Blaze]

Knives aren't really my concern when here in Canada they decided to take away the plane inspections :S Now I'm pretty sure a mechanical malfunction if more dangerous then a knife 🙄 Anyway that was my Canadian rant, not that's it relevant.

But on the knife issue, I don't really see why they should be allowed. I might make it a habit to always walk naked around the house but I'm still gonna put cloths on when I go out....well that was a bad comparison, but all in all it doesn't take much to just put the knife in your luggage. I get that they aren't dangerous, but you're also no suppose to carry any sharp object like nail fillers etc. Better safe then sorry I guess!

Also, I'm STRONGLY against pilot having guns, just like they want teachers to have guns at school now in the US. You don't solve gun violence with more guns!

 

[white avenger]

You don't solve gun violence with more guns!

On hr contrary, the only way that CAN you stop gun violence IS with guns, either in the hands of the police or in the hands of an armed citizen. I read somewhere that the actual average time that it takes for the police to respond to a shooting is just over 2 minutes, as opposed to less than 30 seconds by an armed citizen on sight.

But, please, I know from experience where this discussion is going to lead. I;ve had it too many times before with too many people. PM me if you want to have a debate on gun control or if you would like to see some web sites that feature more provable facts than snappy phrases and useless rhetoric. I'll tell you in advance, though, that you're not going to convince me, and I'm not going to convince you. The only outcome of such a discussion is raised blood pressure, something that, at my age, I simply can't afford anymore

Just about anyone here can tell you about my tendency to go off subject very easily in these discussions, but I honestly am trying to at least cut down if not stop entirely. This is about whether the knives as described by the TSA Director, not 10 inch Bowie knives, samurai swords, or battle axes, can be allowed in the passenger area with no or at best (or worst) a minimal acceptable risk to the passengers in general or the aircraft itself.

 

[Bexieh]

I can't really comment on the idea of having guns on board because I don't really have any experience when it comes to guns or the gun debate but I can tell you guns scare the crap out of me and I would not feel safe with guns on board, no matter who the heck has them. But I'm from England and I've glimpsed a real gun like once in my life (we have an unloaded or something 'university gun' for film prop 😛 ) so the idea of having them around is alien to me. But wouldn't it be a hazard to have them on board? Like if one got fired in that tiny little airplane space when you're high in the air could it not cause problems or break something?

As for knives I don't really get the need to have them on board but I'm not gonna argue, I wish they'd do something about the liquids though, it's such a faff 'cause it's always stuff you take for granted and don't realise isn't allowed and you have to throw it out.

I never understand airport security though. I've been abroad with my cousin who takes a box of needles and stuff on board (he's a haemophiliac) and no ones even raised an eyebrow, (like literally, he didn't even have to show all his proof that he needs it and stuff) but they'll not let you on with your nail file. Just WHAT. This was a while ago now, but still :/