Legalization of Drugs

[david4wt]

But taking drugs and harming yourself... that's pretty victimless. You're the only victim but you're also the one making the decision and therefore the crime is victimless.

If even one person ends up addicted and dies of overdose of a heavy drug, then there's a victim and the State failed. Maybe I say this because I'm european, but it's the State's duty to garantee physical and psychological health to everyone. I do not blame a drug addict of being addict, it's too easy to say "Well if they are addicts then it's their problem cause they started it".

Recreational drugs as marijiuana aren't physically addictive and the do the same harm as cigarettes, therefore they should be legalized and controlled by the state in my opinion.

 

[Taake]

I agree with this. I think the bad outweighs the good in this case. As long as drugs like Marinol can be used for cancer patients and other people who are so sick they need the drug's effects to make them feel better, I see no reason to legalize marijuana or any other drugs. It's obvious that people who want to use drugs are going to get them, one way or the other, so there's not much that can be done to stop that. But making it easier for them to get it is only going to cause problems, in my opinion.

I agree with this.

For me legalizing drugs would only be like throwing gasoline on a fire. I don't see a reason for it at all, if anything I'm of the opposite camp preferring for alcohol and tobacco to be more limited as well as they are also drug substances.

(I'm not saying remove them completely by the way, for me in Sweden I just wish we had more of a 21 age limit then 18 as I don't think you're ready to handle it that soon. Here you even have to be 15-18 (? TYG help me out) to buy energy drinks like RedBull or Burn which I'm all for)

So legalizing drugs for me isn't going to help anyone, nor creating a law where selling it would be illegal but using it wouldn't be... for me drugs are illegal, should stay illegal and unless you have some kind of medical need for them there's no reason why the government should pave way for you to more easily get to them.

 

[This Year's Girl]

I think the biggest problem with drugs being illegal is that it creates stigma and that abusers are regarded as criminals. So there it's definately room for improvement. I still think that drugs should continue to be illegal though.

I've seen that a few of you have said that since drugs are easy to come by anyway making it legal wouldn't increase the use of it. I don't agree. I haven't grown up in a sheltered enviroment and drugs wasn't easy to come by for me and my friends at all. If they were and there wasn't any legal consequenses I think a lot of us would've started using them. If one wants as few people as possible to begin with drugs and as many as possible to end, I think it would be a better way to continue to try to make it as difficult as possible to abuse drugs. Increasing the availability seems kind of counter-productive for me.

 

[sisterofmercy]

I'm for the legalisation of cannabis and ecstasy, but not for other drugs. Although long term abuse of them can lead to significant health problems, it's the same with alcohol and tobacco and those who want to take drugs to such an extreme will do it whether it's legal or not. If it were regulated and taxed then people would be more aware of the effects as I would imagine there'd be better drug education.

Saying that though, I'm not a fan of drugs and would be more in favour of making smoking tobacco illegal if anything. However, I'm all for human liberty so I don't think stopping someone from doing things like that would be a good idea. If they seek solace from things like smoking or beer or a spliff every now and again then that should be up to them. Perhaps going to the root of the problem, i.e. why people feel the need to use these substances to take refuge from their lives will be more beneficial than simply treating people like criminals.

---------- Post added at 02:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:02 PM ----------

If even one person ends up addicted and dies of overdose of a heavy drug, then there's a victim and the State failed. Maybe I say this because I'm european, but it's the State's duty to garantee physical and psychological health to everyone. I do not blame a drug addict of being addict, it's too easy to say "Well if they are addicts then it's their problem cause they started it".

Recreational drugs as marijiuana aren't physically addictive and the do the same harm as cigarettes, therefore they should be legalized and controlled by the state in my opinion.

I agree that it's not addictive but as most people mix it with tobacco the conditioning is still there as people associate the two together. So while weed may not strictly be addictive on its own, it's not hard to see how it can happen.

Also while tobacco causes things like lung cancer, long term weed use can be a factor in psychological disorders like Schizophrenia (though admittedly it's not conclusive as of yet). That's not to say that weed is worse as I definitely don't think that's true, but it would be wrong to believe that there are no effects at all.

I think the key to these things though is balance and if it were legalised and regulated then perhaps moderation would be more encouraged. I say perhaps as they tried to do that with alcohol and yet you can go into any A&E department in the UK on the weekend and see what people have done to themselves while being anything but moderate.

 

[SlayerFest]

This Year's Girl disagrees: But you can get addictive to marijiuana.

You can not become physically addicted to marijuana. You can become mentally addicted to anything. For instance, I'm pretty sure I'm addicted to cheese.

---------- Post added at 09:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------

I think the biggest problem with drugs being illegal is that it creates stigma and that abusers are regarded as criminals. So there it's definately room for improvement. I still think that drugs should continue to be illegal though.

I've seen that a few of you have said that since drugs are easy to come by anyway making it legal wouldn't increase the use of it. I don't agree. I haven't grown up in a sheltered enviroment and drugs wasn't easy to come by for me and my friends at all. If they were and there wasn't any legal consequenses I think a lot of us would've started using them. If one wants as few people as possible to begin with drugs and as many as possible to end, I think it would be a better way to continue to try to make it as difficult as possible to abuse drugs. Increasing the availability seems kind of counter-productive for me.

Haha it's the complete opposite for me...I wasn't sheltered by my parents, but I grew up around a lot of kids who were. My friend's mom is insanely overprotective...and my friend smokes weed occasionally. I don't believe that I know one person who hasn't tried it. Well, maybe my mom (I'm not sure if I believe her though 😉). It's really easy to get marijuana here. It's actually pretty easy to get just about anything, especially at my high school. It was kind of known as the "drug school". A lot of people were pretty wealthy which means 1) Their parents were kind of oblivious as to what they were up to and 2) They could afford the hard stuff.

So many people went to rehab, it became trendy. Ugh. I am not for the legalization of hard drugs, but I don't have a problem with weed being legal because I just don't believe that it is any worse than tobacco. A lot of the kids who smoked it are now at great schools and they played sports. Haha they were more involved than I was, and I never touched the stuff. Also, I'm talking about casual smokers, not the stoners who got high every day and skipped school.

 

[david4wt]

[MENTION=11629]Ripper666[/MENTION] What does "Ripper666 agrees: Controlling and legalized? Decide!" mean? 🙂

And I agree with Fredikins about the addiction factor.

You can not become physically addied to marijuana.

[MENTION=10446]sisterofmercy[/MENTION] mentioned that cannabis could "trigger" a psychosis. Well it's not that simple. In certain individuals that are predisponed to develop some kind of psychosis, then the use of certain substances (if light drugs were part of them I really don't know) can be the ambiental factor that determines the psychosis itself. Just saying marijuana=psychosis can sound a bit terroristic and misleading 😉

 

[brinkster130]

I have mixed feelings on the issue. I don't like drugs, so part of me wants to see them remain illegal but as others have said, them being illegal really doesn't keep people from using and abusing them.

One concern I have with making drugs legal, is that while it may make things more safe for recreational users I don't see how it would do anything positive for those seriously abuse them and are addicted. If someone is addicted to drugs, and so much so that they have trouble properly functioning ion society, then whether the drugs are legal or not they still can't be a productive member of society and crimes to get money and drugs would still exist.

Another thought, at what point do we draw the line with what people are allowed to do to themselves? If drugs become legal them what about prescription medication? I think by making drugs legal you are headed down a slippery slope.

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

Also while tobacco causes things like lung cancer, long term weed use can be a factor in psychological disorders like Schizophrenia (though admittedly it's not conclusive as of yet). That's not to say that weed is worse as I definitely don't think that's true, but it would be wrong to believe that there are no effects at all.

There's also studies that show a link between smoking weed and less risk to develop Alzheimer's, but strangely you rarely see people bring that up.

The Schizophrenia thing is usually taken out of context. If you are already predisposed for schizophrenia, then yes, you might be at a higher risk to develop it, but not everyone is predisposed for it. There have been studies showing that there is a predesposition for schizophrenia, but the exact factors behind actually developing the disorder are not well understood. In identical twins (thus, identical brain structures) there are a lot of cases where only one twin develops schizophrenia, although they were both predisposed. You can tell if somebody is predisposed by some genetic markers, and some brain structures (most prominently enlarged ventricle I think).
If you do not have a predisposition for schizophrenia, you won't develop it from smoking weed, just like somebody with naturally low blood pressure won't get hypertension from eating salt.

 

[white avenger]

The only time that I have taken anything that falls into the category of "drugs" as it is being used here is the 24 hours after a major surgery, whei I was on morphine for the pain. Beyond that, my experience is nil, but my opinion on the legalization of the drugs in question is, yes, within reason, and under strict regulation, they should be legalized. My reason for saying that is that at the moment there is an entire industry, untaxed and unregulated, that is turning out products in home basements, abandoned houses, and anywhere else that the manufacturers can find to work in secret. There is no quality control, no inspection by experts to assure purity, and no control over who gets what or how much they get. As long as these drugs are sold on the streets and in alleys, anyone with the money can buy even the strongest drugs, just as long as they can produce the money. A 6 year old can buy heroin or crystal meth just as easily as any adult, just as long as he can produce the cash. If those drugs were legally produced, with strict quality control, and definite regulations concerning dosage, quantity, and price, there would be at least be a greater safety factor in place. Right now, pushers can knowingly sell what amounts to poison.

And let's talk about those dealers. They are getting rich off of illegal drug sales, encouraging their clients to steal, kill, or sell their bodies in order to pay for their habit. If they can't pay, they don't feed their addiction. The dealers work for the distributes, who are have no compunction about committing murder in the operation of their business. The distributors work for the producers, who have their own private little army, with corrupt officials on their payrolls, allowing them to do anything that they desire.

Remember Prohibition in the '20's in the United States, when there was an entire illegal industry revolving around the importation or manufacture, distribution, and sale of illegal alcohol? The same thing is happening now as was happening then, only it's illegal drugs instead of illegal alcohol, and, not surprisingly, the people most opposed to the legalizing of either one are the criminals, who stand to lose the most from that legalization.

Morality is something that can not be legislated. It's been tried, many, many times, in many, many countries, and always with the same results. Those determined to indulge in their own form of debauchery are going to find a way to do so. If there is no legal way, then they will do it illegally. By legalizing drugs, we would at least attain some level of control over the situation, regulating the purity and dosage level available to the age groups deemed able to make the decision as to whether or not to use the them. Beyond that, there is nothing that the government could, or should do. Good sense and responsible actions should be taught in the homes, the schools, and the churches.

 

[Bluebird]

I think a lot of people, in general, get too mixed up with the difference in legality between drugs. There's too much of a simplistic 'legal equals good, illegal equals bad' syndrome. Or at least that's what I've experienced irl.

The only reason tobacco and alcohol are legal in the UK is because they are highly taxed and make a lot of money for the government. Which is ironic considering the amount the NHS has to spend on the numerous health problems they create. Everyone knows the incredible number of people that die every year from smoking cigarettes and drinking alcohol. Weed is one of those drugs that has no recorded deaths, and there are recent reports that say ecstasy has no long term effects. A lot of time when people die from ecstasy, it's a polluted drug, it's been bulked up with more dangerous chemicals. One thing I'm sure everyone would agree on, is that for people who do take recreational drugs, it would be safer for them if it was controlled - knowing what was really in it.

I'm not saying there should be a drug free-for-all, just that the reason these drugs are illegal and tobacco and alcohol are legal, has NOTHING to do with the public's wellbeing. When it comes to drugs, governments are a business. For example, if weed were made legal, it would be controlled and taxed just like tobacco. It would become a business, as that's what legal drugs are. Even if it was made legal (and even though it's a natural plant), you would not be allowed to grow it yourself.

I don't know my full opinion on the legalisation of drugs, since I don't know everything about every drug and its effect, and I'm unsure of the subsequent effect legalisation would have on society. But the reason for drugs being illegal isn't to do with keeping the public healthy. And tbh I'm more of the opinion of being responsible for yourself, and having the freedom of choice to do what you want to your own body.

 

[Washburne]

If drugs (any drug that's now are illegal) was to become legal and get taxed would that make them cheaper, more expensive or would it cost roughly the same as now? Not easy to say I know and I'm not expecting an answer. I just wonder if they get more expensive would people in general buy the legal stuff or buy it as they do now? Since it's so easy to get. Safer vs cheaper isn't always an easy choice on safer. I guess some definitely would buy the legal since they don't have to think about money. But the rest?

Just a thought, not trying to make a point. Obviously since I don't know the answer.

I'm not a fan of "everyone is doing it anyway so lets make it legal". About anything. With that said I'm breaking the law more or less every day. Not drug related.

If making drugs legal would make crime go down and make the world safer that's a deal I wouldn't mind making. If the difference to how it is now is big enough. Although I'm not sure what I mean by big enough if you want specifics.

 

[zobothehobo]

If even one person ends up addicted and dies of overdose of a heavy drug, then there's a victim and the State failed. Maybe I say this because I'm european, but it's the State's duty to garantee physical and psychological health to everyone. I do not blame a drug addict of being addict, it's too easy to say "Well if they are addicts then it's their problem cause they started it".

Recreational drugs as marijiuana aren't physically addictive and the do the same harm as cigarettes, therefore they should be legalized and controlled by the state in my opinion.

But the same could be said for something like food. Fast food has a lot of addictive chemicals pumped into it... And even if you're not eating food with addictive chemicals pumped in, it is possible to get addicted to food. Has the state failed if someone eats too many burgers and has a heart attack?

I think it is the responsibility of the state to provide help to addicts... but forbidding addictive drugs is NOT solving the problem.

 

[SlayerFest]

[MENTION=10446]sisterofmercy[/MENTION] mentioned that cannabis could "trigger" a psychosis. Well it's not that simple. In certain individuals that are predisponed to develop some kind of psychosis, then the use of certain substances (if light drugs were part of them I really don't know) can be the ambiental factor that determines the psychosis itself. Just saying marijuana=psychosis can sound a bit terroristic and misleading 😉

Well I do kind of agree with this, which is why I choose to stay away from it 😉 because I've done research and I have a pretty good idea that weed + me and my...mind just = badness. People should definitely do research before trying any type of drug. I know people who just pop pills without a second thought and I find that...unsettling. People just need to be informed of the actual facts. I don't believe that a person who chooses to try drugs is a bad person, go for it I don't care...however, it's important to be responsible and to just do your freaking research. That's kind of why I hate when they show us those "Drugs are bad!" videos in health class. I won't try drugs but there was a point in time when I considered it.

However, I spoke to people who had done quite a bit of...stuff and they informed me of the actual facts. They didn't use scare tactics, they were just completely honest. They don't regret anything that they have done, but they were just kind of like, "Hey, this is what it's really like. Can you handle it?" My answer was a solid, "No." haha. My mind is already pretty, erm, active. Anyway, it's important that people know how to be responsible when it comes to drugs because some kid is going to see that "Drugs are bad" video and not give a kitty, he or she is going to try acid or ecstasy anyway, and it's better that they know what they are getting themselves into and how to go about it responsibly, than to be yelled at and told that "drugs will kill you! they're bad!"

Also, I agree that illegal = bad, legal = good in most people's minds but to be completely honest...if my little sister was in high school, and she told me she smoked a cigarette, I'd probably slap her haha but if she told me she tried weed, I'd be pretty calm. But that's just me 😉.

 

[Washburne]

it would make it cheaper in most situations.

If that's true then it should be a time when people don't mind playing taxes. 😉

 

[prophecygrrl]

Yes, actually the prostitution law has worked really well. I read the rapport after it had been inforced for 10 years (2009). I don't have any exact numbers, but I know that actual buying of sex and trafficking had decreased a lot. If you want I can try to get the rapport in english for you!

Cool! 😀 I'd love to know more about prostitution in other countries. What you said about it has made me think about how to apply this approach to this drug debate right now, though with some changes to how it is applied. I agree with the general principle behind it, to reduce problems by favoring decriminalization over incarceration.

I think the sentense (is that the word?) for drug related crimes should be less severe. I am in general very critical to jail, I think there are better solutions. But that's another debate. 🙂

I agree that sentences should be reduced for jail time or other approaches to drug abuse or violence can be implemented. We had a guest speaker in one of my classes once on US drug policy and he was once sentenced 15 years for carrying a couple grams of marijuana! He served 4 of those years before he was released by the governor of California, and even that seems like too much time. FIFTEEN years, for possessing marijuana at 20 years old? That's ridiculous.

another note...I can't stop seeing the world "cannibal" when I read "cannibis" in this thread, lol. Cue giggling like a twelve year old when I think abou BBers arguing about the rights of cannibals. Monsters, all of you. 😉

 

[randiann]

[MENTION=8013]Washburne[/MENTION], you might be interested in this article.

So in case anyone doesn't know, Portugal decriminalized ALL drugs. Cannibas, heroin, cocaine, meth, whatever. Instead of putting people in jail and ruining their lives further, they decided to instead put rehabillitation programs in place and help people beat their addictions. And it's working. Crime has gone down. The amount of people using drugs has gone down. By making something less "taboo" the country has helped to allieviate their drug problem. I think the rest of the world should take note.

There are several problems with the drug war, at least in America, today. NUMBER ONE is the fact that there are thousands and thousands of people dying at the boarders because of cartel related violence. By making something illegal and making it a black market commodity, the United States is contributing to those deaths.

Number 2 is the prision system. When someone is, for example, convicted to prision for 15 years for posession, thye are put into the prision system, and are more likely to become lifelong criminals. Our tax dollars are paying for that person to be housed and fed for 15 years (or however long the sentance is) at the cost of thousands of dollars per year per "criminal". In prision, people have to learn how to simply survive. They become entangled in the gang system. They learn how to commit crimes from other violent offenders. They are more likely to end up back in jail because of these things. Why not instead invest this money into rehab programs that do not mix non-violent offenders in with the rest of the prision population and instead help them to overcome addictions?

Number 3 is we are a economically strapped country. Yet we spend $1,700 PER SECOND on the war on drugs. When I looked this up today (12:45 PM CST on 5/1/2012) the United States has spent so far this year $18,020,395,624 on this war on drugs. And what have we accomplished? Jack poop. That's what. (Drug Clock Source)

This war on drugs isn't working. Regardless of whether or not it's "cool" to smoke/snort/shoot up/act a fool what the US is doing is NOT WORKING. For these reasons, the US needs to look for an alternate solution to what it calls the drug problem.

Take a moment to read this article from forbes.com: Drug Use Down by Half in Portugal

A few facts since Portugal has decriminalized all drugs a decade ago from an article from TIME:
"The Cato paper reports that between 2001 and 2006 in Portugal, rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%; drug use in older teens also declined. Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8% (although there was a slight increase in marijuana use in that age group). New HIV infections in drug users fell by 17% between 1999 and 2003, and deaths related to heroin and similar drugs were cut by more than half. In addition, the number of people on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040, after decriminalization, and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well"Source