Most hated Buffyverse character? Kennedy or Justine?

[Bop]

How did Kennedy make her "realise" she shouldn't support Buffy other than having a go at her? It is none of Kennedy's business who Willow supports but yet again Kennedy has to insert her opinion because she wants to get her own way.

Kennedy said "Why are you always sticking up for her?!" making Willow question why she is always sticking up for Buffy only to get hurt, in reference probably to the first cellar trip in which her other best friend lost his eye.

Willow made to leave until Kennedy told her she just wanted to talk. Willow was happy just talking then Kennedy kissed her and Willow turned into Warren.

Yeah, and then Willow did sit down and happily had a drink and conversation with Kennedy. Nobody was forcing her to stay. And Kennedy did keep her promise, they only talked at the Bronze. Then when they get back to the bedroom, yes they kiss but Kennedy does not pounce on Willow, she hovers by her face for a while before slowly kissing her. Willow was given every opportunity to slip away from the kiss but she wanted to kiss Kennedy so she didn't.

By that point Willow had already given in. Willow's worried that she is betraying Tara, it's a classic sign that she's not over Tara yet. If Willow was ready to move on, then she wouldn't feel like she is betraying her dead lover to the extent that she turns into Warren.

And it's a bad thing that Willow feels like she can't move on, she makes peace with it by the end of that episode thanks to Kennedy. So yes Willow "gave in" to being kind of happy again.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

Kennedy said "Why are you always sticking up for her?!" making Willow question why she is always sticking up for Buffy only to get hurt, in reference probably to the first cellar trip in which her other best friend lost his eye.

Have you watched that scene? Kennedy didn't calmly ask Willow why she was always sticking up for Buffy, she ROUNDED on her and jumped down her throat before Willow uttered a word. Nobody knows what Willow was going to say, she didn't get chance. Kennedy assumed she was going to side with Buffy and had a go at her. Whichever way you play it, either Willow was going to support Buffy or she wasn't, Kennedy does not come out of that scene in a good light.

Yeah, and then Willow did sit down and happily had a drink and conversation with Kennedy. Nobody was forcing her to stay. And Kennedy did keep her promise, they only talked at the Bronze. Then when they get back to the bedroom, yes they kiss but Kennedy does not pounce on Willow, she hovers by her face for a while before slowly kissing her. Willow was given every opportunity to slip away from the kiss but she wanted to kiss Kennedy so she didn't.

Willow was initially going to walk away and then Kennedy asked her to stay which she did. Willow had a nice evening and got caught up in the moment but if you asked her beforehand if she wanted to date Kennedy, she would've said no.

And it's a bad thing that Willow feels like she can't move on, she makes peace with it by the end of that episode thanks to Kennedy. So yes Willow "gave in" to being kind of happy again.

Willow would've moved on when she was ready to move on, she didn't need Kennedy making that decision for her.


Another reason to hate Kennedy: She pretends to be sick to get out of going to the desert with the other potentials yet she then bosses them around in the back yard.

 

[Bop]

Have you watched that scene? Kennedy didn't calmly ask Willow why she was always sticking up for Buffy, she ROUNDED on her and jumped down her throat before Willow uttered a word. Nobody knows what Willow was going to say, she didn't get chance. Kennedy assumed she was going to side with Buffy and had a go at her. Whichever way you play it, either Willow was going to support Buffy or she wasn't, Kennedy does not come out of that scene in a good light.

I didn't say that Kennedy calmly asked Willow, but the point is still the same, she asked Willow why she's always sticking up for Buffy and when Willow heard that she decided not to stick up for Buffy, realising that she didn't actually want to.

Willow was initially going to walk away and then Kennedy asked her to stay which she did. Willow had a nice evening and got caught up in the moment but if you asked her beforehand if she wanted to date Kennedy, she would've said no.

Yeah, she got caught up in the evening and decided that she actually wouldn't mind kissing Kennedy. Willow still made a choice to kiss Kennedy, and evidently she liked it seeing as she stayed with her for the rest of the season. All Kennedy did was have Willow give her a chance and once she did Willow discovered that she liked Kennedy.

Willow would've moved on when she was ready to move on, she didn't need Kennedy making that decision for her.

Kennedy didn't make any decision for Willow, all she did was offer to be Willow's support and partner. Willow accepted, nothing was forced on her at all beyond an offer. A persistent offer okay, but it's still an offer not a demand.
 

Whichever way you play it, either Willow was going to support Buffy or she wasn't, Kennedy does not come out of that scene in a good light.

I don't think Kennedy came off in a good light in that scene, nobody was in a good light in that scene. I'm just defending her because she doesn't deserve to be hated on or like burnt in hell for asking Willow a question loudly.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

I didn't say that Kennedy calmly asked Willow, but the point is still the same, she asked Willow why she's always sticking up for Buffy and when Willow heard that she decided not to stick up for Buffy, realising that she didn't actually want to.

Kennedy did not "ask" Willow, she practically screamed at her. At what point is it stated that Willow WAS going to stick up for Buffy before Kennedy jumped down her throat? What I saw in that scene was Willow got up to say something and Kennedy had a go at her before she got a word out. Everyone assumed she was going to stick up for Buffy but that doesn't mean she actually was. It's not like Willow and Kennedy had a rational discussion during the mutiny.

Whichever way you look at it, Kennedy does not come out of that scene looking good. She either intimidates Willow into not siding with Buffy via her angry reaction or she jumps down Willow's throat because she thinks Willow is going to side with Buffy.
 

I don't think Kennedy came off in a good light in that scene, nobody was in a good light in that scene. I'm just defending her because she doesn't deserve to be hated on or like burnt in hell for asking Willow a question loudly.

It's the way she "asked" her, if you can even call it "asking". Generally when you ask someone a question, you don't scream at them angrily from across the room.

 

[Bop]

At what point is it stated that Willow WAS going to stick up for Buffy before Kennedy jumped down her throat?

Well it's not crazy for Kennedy to assume that Willow would be sticking up for Buffy and it wasn't stated that she wasn't going to either. I just think it's definitely cynical to take what Kennedy said and then jump to the worst possible conclusion. The scene wasn't Buffy vs Kennedy and Kennedy forcing Willow to side with her. There were other reasons and upsets so I can get why Kennedy is raising her voice and why Willow doesn't know how to behave that doesn't include Kennedy muzzling her.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

Well it's not crazy for Kennedy to assume that Willow would be sticking up for Buffy and it wasn't stated that she wasn't going to either. I just think it's definitely cynical to take what Kennedy said and then jump to the worst possible conclusion. The scene wasn't Buffy vs Kennedy and Kennedy forcing Willow to side with her. There were other reasons and upsets so I can get why Kennedy is raising her voice and why Willow doesn't know how to behave that doesn't include Kennedy muzzling her.

But the point still stands, Willow got up to say something and Kennedy had a go at her before she even got a word out. It is not Kennedy's place to have a go at Willow AT ALL particularly when it comes to either Buffy or Xander since Willow has known them for 7+ years whereas she has only known Kennedy for a few weeks. (I'm aware Kennedy never had a go at Willow about Xander but I'm just saying Kennedy has no right to have a go at Willow for defending her friends even if Kennedy doesn't agree with the friend.)

 

[Bop]

But the point still stands, Willow got up to say something and Kennedy had a go at her before she even got a word out. It is not Kennedy's place to have a go at Willow AT ALL particularly when it comes to either Buffy or Xander since Willow has known them for 7+ years whereas she has only known Kennedy for a few weeks. (I'm aware Kennedy never had a go at Willow about Xander but I'm just saying Kennedy has no right to have a go at Willow for defending her friends even if Kennedy doesn't agree with the friend.)

I think Kennedy thought that Willow would be making a terrible mistake and in a way betraying the rest of them by defending Buffy. You could see that as Kennedy being controlling but I don't think she saw it that way, I think she saw it as protecting Willow and making a decision that Willow wasn't prepared to make, which was going against Buffy. Xander barely says a word throughout the whole mutiny because it's hard for him, Willow was also quiet until she was going to say something and yes Kennedy shut her up but as I've said it's because she assumed that Willow would defend Buffy, and refused to let that happen. It wasn't kind of her, but that whole scene was full of people saying unkind things.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

I think Kennedy thought that Willow would be making a terrible mistake and in a way betraying the rest of them by defending Buffy. You could see that as Kennedy being controlling but I don't think she saw it that way, I think she saw it as protecting Willow and making a decision that Willow wasn't prepared to make, which was going against Buffy. Xander barely says a word throughout the whole mutiny because it's hard for him, Willow was also quiet until she was going to say something and yes Kennedy shut her up but as I've said it's because she assumed that Willow would defend Buffy, and refused to let that happen. It wasn't kind of her, but that whole scene was full of people saying unkind things.

It wasn't Kennedy's place. Kennedy only cared about what she wanted to happen. She practically admitted to Faith that her calling for a change in leadership was because she thought she'd get more of a say with Faith than she did with Buffy. If Willow wanted to defend Buffy, she should be allowed to defend Buffy, not have Kennedy "refuse to let that happen". That whole scenario you've written out features Kennedy taking agency away from Willow.

 

[Bop]

It wasn't Kennedy's place. Kennedy only cared about what she wanted to happen. She practically admitted to Faith that her calling for a change in leadership was because she thought she'd get more of a say with Faith than she did with Buffy.

True, Kennedy did want more power and thought she deserved it but I disagree that she was intentionally doing anything bad to Willow. It seems to me that Kennedy had developed quite a narrow minded view on Buffy and thought that they would be best without her leading. She may have made Willow's decision but it wasn't malicious, Kennedy just thought she was doing the right thing for everyone and to her she was 🙂

 

[Antho]

At least Kennedy isn't evil. She didn't cut the throat of someone. That's a good point for her.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

True, Kennedy did want more power and thought she deserved it but I disagree that she was intentionally doing anything bad to Willow. It seems to me that Kennedy had developed quite a narrow minded view on Buffy and thought that they would be best without her leading. She may have made Willow's decision but it wasn't malicious, Kennedy just thought she was doing the right thing for everyone and to her she was 🙂

Kennedy was only looking out for herself. No doubt she cast herself in a "hero of the people" kind of role in her own mind but she did not do herself any favours with the audience. She was a new character amongst old ones, god only knows what the writers were thinking. Did they look at ways to make a new character likable then just decided to do the complete opposite with Kennedy?

Did they try and take traits from other characters and give them to Kennedy but the actress didn't have the skill to carry them off unlike the original characters?

At least Kennedy isn't evil. She didn't cut the throat of someone. That's a good point for her.

One good point in a sea of bad.

 

[Antho]

One good point in a sea of bad.

And what about putting a smile on Willow's face.. That's not so bad.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

And what about putting a smile on Willow's face.. That's not so bad.

A lot of things put a smile on Willow's face. Ted put a smile on Willow's face when he gave her those computer program disks.

 

[Antho]

A lot of things put a smile on Willow's face. Ted put a smile on Willow's face when he gave her those computer program disks.

I don't think Willow is the same person at the beginning of the season 2 and at the beginning of the season 7. And of course I was talking after tara's death.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

I don't think Willow is the same person at the beginning of the season 2 and at the beginning of the season 7. And of course I was talking after tara's death.

Not being eaten by the Gnarl put a smile on Willow's face.....

 

[Bop]

Kennedy was only looking out for herself. No doubt she cast herself in a "hero of the people" kind of role in her own mind but she did not do herself any favours with the audience. She was a new character amongst old ones, god only knows what the writers were thinking. Did they look at ways to make a new character likable then just decided to do the complete opposite with Kennedy?

I think Kennedy was really eager, and sometimes that was a good thing, like when she offers to help Buffy fight that Uber vamp while everyone else just stands there. And Kennedy is great in every fight scene because she holds nothing back. But then when it comes to her wanting control, I think she's just got so much confidence in herself that she really does think she'd be a good leader. I don't know why anyone is squabbling over being the leader tbh it's not a good thing to be a leader in this case.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

I think Kennedy was really eager, and sometimes that was a good thing, like when she offers to help Buffy fight that Uber vamp while everyone else just stands there. And Kennedy is great in every fight scene because she holds nothing back. But then when it comes to her wanting control, I think she's just got so much confidence in herself that she really does think she'd be a good leader. I don't know why anyone is squabbling over being the leader tbh it's not a good thing to be a leader in this case.

Kennedy is very full of herself which is not a good way to endear a character to the audience. Kennedy needed to "earn her stripes" so to speak, not once did she do that. She starts sleeping with Willow and all of a sudden she's bossing the other potentials around as if she's so much better than them when she's not. She's a spoilt brat. Cordy was a spoilt brat, but through a combination of good writing and good acting, Cordy was reasonably likeable. Kennedy had none of that.

 

[Bop]

Kennedy is very full of herself which is not a good way to endear a character to the audience. Kennedy needed to "earn her stripes" so to speak, not once did she do that. She starts sleeping with Willow and all of a sudden she's bossing the other potentials around as if she's so much better than them when she's not. She's a spoilt brat. Cordy was a spoilt brat, but through a combination of good writing and good acting, Cordy was reasonably likeable. Kennedy had none of that

Kennedy's from a very privileged home she was used to getting her way as she said and that did transfer onto the screen. It's not like Kennedy had seasons to develop in like Cordy did 🙂
But still, say that Buffy and Faith passed out in the battlefield, out of all the potentials Kennedy's arrogance would come in handy and she'd soon be taking on the role of leader and sorting everybody out like she did in 'End of days' bless her 😀

 

[DeadlyDuo]

Kennedy's from a very privileged home she was used to getting her way as she said and that did transfer onto the screen. It's not like Kennedy had seasons to develop in like Cordy did 🙂
But still, say that Buffy and Faith passed out in the battlefield, out of all the potentials Kennedy's arrogance would come in handy and she'd soon be taking on the role of leader and sorting everybody out like she did in 'End of days' bless her 😀

I think she'd end up getting herself and everyone else killed because of her arrogance.

 

[Bop]

I think she'd end up getting herself and everyone else killed because of her arrogance.

It worked in 'End of days' as best it could 🙂 I'm not saying Kennedy would be able to save the day (she's only human after all) but she'd try and that's all that counts.