Question Normal Again, Buffy in the institution

[Fredsicle]

In Becoming Part 2 of Season 2, Joyce is very shocked to learn that Buffy is the "slayer of the vam-pyres'. Buffy told Willow in 'Normal Again' that she had been in an institution because of her trouble with her parents and their disbelief. Why was Joyce so shocked, wouldn't she remember Buffy's "craziness"? If she didn't believe her three years before, why did she believe her later? This sounds like it may have been a plot hole or something.

 

[JohnnyThunders]

I can't remember if the episode was before or after but when Spike and his gang attack the school it'd be more likely believable for Joyce to believe Buffy because she had seen real vampires.

 

[white avenger]

I think Joyce's reaction in "Becoming Pt 2" was at first concern and fear that her daughter's "delusion" was returning, and then disbelief when she was told, and had it very graphically illustrated to her, that those things called vampires weren't just in movies and books, they were real, and Buffy's job was to fight and destroy them, even at the cost of her own life. At that time, we didn't know about Buffy having had psychological help because of her seeing demons and monsters in the real world. That was revealed later.

 

[bloodflower]

she might believe her now because she doesn't really have a choice. when buffy 1st told them hank was there as well and both of them refused to believe. the
2nd time spike was pacing around the room and they where discussing how to kill her angel, joyce never really had a chance to actually refuse to believe what was happening.

 

[Fredsicle]

She sounded like it was all new to her though, like when she asked Buffy, "Have you tried not being a vampire slayer?"
as if this were the first time she'd heard the phrase. When Buffy was a freshman and made a slayer, surely she would have told her mother "Vampires! I'm the slayer!" or something like that, so hearing the phrase would have reminded her of what had occurred before.

 

[fly on the wall]

I've always believed that this was a plot inconsistency. The writers during Season 2 simply didn't know at the time that they would be making an episode in Season 6 that Buffy was in an institution. Because I agree with you - Joyce's reaction doesn't make sense in regards to Buffy's previous "delusions."

You'd think she would have said, "Oh no, not again" or "I thought we were done with this" or "I can't believe this is happening again" etc. But she didn't and I've always found that incredibly strange.

 

[Lindsey McDonald]

I like to justify it to myself by treating the memory of the institution as Dawn induced. It's the only way it sits right for me, even though it does deviate from the path of least resistance style of the other memories. Still, it just doesn't make sense otherwise. We know that Joyce is queen of all things denial, but she's not that good at repressing stuff.

 

[littlehippie]

I always looked at them as too completely separate realities. That way there was the least plot inconsistency. Maybe that doesn't fit in with the episodes in question. While I have seen Becoming a lot, I have only seen Normal Again once, so I may be forgetting some line that makes my way of looking at it mute, but still, this is what made the most sense.

 

[bunchofmulch111]

I think you've all forgotten that Joyce actually saw a vampire explode into dust in front of her eyes in Becoming. I'm sure that played a huge role in her eventual acceptance of the truth.

She sounded like it was all new to her though, like when she asked Buffy, "Have you tried not being a vampire slayer?" as if this were the first time she'd heard the phrase.

I simply don't see it that way. I know you posted this two months ago, but just let me ask: what makes you think that she said this in such a manner? How does the fact that Joyce has placed Buffy into an institution before disallow Joyce from trying to get Buffy to not be a slayer?

There are inconsistencies in Buffy, of course, but I don't notice any here.

 

[faeriegrrl27]

I think looking at it as a Dawn-induced memory makes the most sense. One of the comic books (Origins, I think) goes into detail about Buffy's time in the institution. While Buffy was off doing something, Dawn read her diary and showed it to their parents, causing them to lock her up. In Becoming, Dawn hadn't been implemented yet and so she never could have shown Joyce the diary.

 

[bunchofmulch111]

"what makes you think that she said this in such a manner? How does the fact that Joyce has placed Buffy into an institution before prohibit Joyce from trying to get Buffy to not be a slayer?"
God, the things I post sometimes. Did I even make sense?

Anyway, I think making it a fake memory lessens the emotional impact of the entire thing. Just my two cents; I just find it important and just incredibly sad how much Buffy's parents weren't willing to accept this whole thing. Besides, what does this alternative version of the story say about when Dawn figured out that her sister slayed vampires? Methinks Dawn followed her sister everywhere, and therefore must have found out early on. Though I guess I don't have much to base that on.

 

[Crashing Doors]

I haven't watched the episode in a while, but since I'm too lazy to look things up right now, here it goes...

I'm assuming here that Buffy mentioning the mental institution to Willow was a "side affect" of the delusion. IE: Demon shoots up Buffy, Buffy goes crazy; crazy-land Buffy (due to the crazy-demon-fluid) thinks she had been in a mental institution, thus, in between slips, tells Willow "oh yeah, I actually was in an institution."

It was all the crazy-demon-influence talking. Buffy, real-world Buffy, never was in an institution? Eh, eh? Eh... I don't know.

 

[caitaintdead]

I like to justify it to myself by treating the memory of the institution as Dawn induced. It's the only way it sits right for me, even though it does deviate from the path of least resistance style of the other memories. Still, it just doesn't make sense otherwise. We know that Joyce is queen of all things denial, but she's not that good at repressing stuff.

Completely, 100% agree.

I'm sure with the amount of times Buffy has mentioned vampires in a jokey way that Joyce would have been more worried if it was for the institution thing.

I also like to think that Dawn knew about Buffy being a slayer before Joyce. After all, I can't see Buffy chasing around Dawn with chopsticks Season 3 and beyond. It seems much more like a before Angelus thing for her to do.