Official Discussion: 7.17 - Lies My Parents Told Me

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Veruca

Can't Stand the Light.
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No one's started a thread yet, so I guess I'll do it.

So yeah, tonight's episode, what did you think?

Personally, I don't like the direction they've taken with Giles' characterization. He's one of my favorite characters and although I appreciate his darker sides when they do come up, Buffy's rejection of him at the end seems somewhat hypocritical to me. She's had to sacrifice so much in her life, she should at least see where he's coming from. And she states that she needs as many people on her side as possible, alienating Giles won't keep him on her side.

I felt really bad for Wood. "The mission is everything" was shoved in his face all night long. Awww, poor him.

The William/ his mother dynamic was truly awesome to me. I loved their chemistry and how sweet they were together and was truly able to feel his pain when she ended up turning on him. I was glad that even she noticed the whole Oedipus complex he had. I was a bit squicked out by that though.

Lastly, I thought that Giles complaining about the library and Dru finding it weird that William/Spike wanted his mom to come along were hilarious scenes.
 
I thought tonight's episode was very good.. FINALLY the wood/spike storyline is resolved, plus we got to see more of William's history.

I love how S7 uses a lot of standalone episodes to solve things; the standalones are always great to watch.

although i don't understand why the epp is called "lies my parents told me".... someone give me some suggestions?

--mmmmdonuts
 
Personally, I think the most interesting effect this is gonna have, will be the change in the relationship between Buffy and Giles. I see him going back to Britain real soon.

On a personal note, I loved this episode. I like Spike even more than before 🙂
 
I was hoping that they'd resolve the whole Joyce/Dawn thing, but I guess we have to wait more for that.

Firstly: when they showed the part with Nikki fighting Spike in the park I got mad because I thought that he was going to kill her there, which would be COMPLETELY different from the train scene. thank god the didn't mess that up.

2. Poor William... he was so cute and pathetic. I wish they had shown Cecily/Hallie. I still want that resolved, though I know it won't happen. And his mother was just ick. *shudder* I don't know ho he could have said to Wood that his mother loved him though...

3. OOOOH BABY. when wood took off the shirt and was wearing that tank top. DAMN he looked fine. *wipes off drool*

4. Andrew talking about Fred, and how he sounded really feminine... the LOOK on his face, I just laughed.

5. Giles was pissing me off big time. and I don't even really know why. I mean, on one level he and Wood were right. But on another level, Buffy's right too. and of course, I support Buffy because I'm hoping that at one point she and Spike will at least have a "moment."

6. for a moment there I thought that Spike actually WAS going to kill Wood, which would, of course, prove Wood and Giles right. Good for him. And the thing is, it was a natural response. After all, Wood had just tried to kill him. Spike let him off.

As a stand alone episode, it resolved a lot of things, but I wish it had been a bit more fast paced. As for the meaning of the title, the only lie I can really think of is that Spike's mother lied about liking his poetry.

and I don't think he DID have an Oedipus complex. He loved his mother, yes. But when she did the sick thing and taunted him about it he shoved her away, hating her for it, himself thinking it was disgusting.
 
Yeah.. the title wouldve worked as "Lies My Mother Told Me" since there are no fathers on the show...

---them donuts.
 
I think that this episode, rather than the retrieval of the duster, marks Spike's re-emergence as a bad-ass.

The scene with Nikki in the park reasserted Spike as a powerful vampire to be feared, something viewers haven't been exposed to in forever, ever since the chip was put in. And his threat against Wood didn't seem to be an idle one. I think Wood has to be careful from now on.

It also marked a turning point in the characterization of Spike. He is no longer following Angel's path, but setting out on his own. When he told Wood that "she was a Slayer, I was a vampire. It's how the game is played" it showed that he isn't into the self-flattulation that Angel has put himself through. He lives in the moment, not attempting to redeem himself for the past. I'm not saying that is a better way to go about things than Angel has, I'm just glad that there is a clearer separation of their two motivations and characters.
 
I agree, I don't think Spike did have Oedipus complex...his mother, as a vamp with a demon in her, just said that to disturb him and he was obviously disgusted by it. Also it was the vamp that told him she never liked his poetry...his real mother, pre-vamp, actually DID like his poetry. That was the whole POINT. Spike was cured of his trigger because he realized that the things his vamp-mother said to him were NOT the feelings of his real human mother. That's why the ep was called Lies My Parents Told Me; because vamp-mother lied to Spike and made him think that his mother felt things about him that she didn't really feel.
 
It was a very good ep, as much as I love the character of Spike, I felt a little sorry for Wood, that he lost, but then again, this wasn't really the way to get over the death of his mother.

As for Giles, he gave away a good inspirational speech, Buffy must be willing to make sacrifices, well poof! there goes Wood!

As for Buffy, well, she's still just a *****!
 
Man I missed the first half of this episode because I forgot to tape it while watching the Canucks game (they lost to Dallas 4-3 in a killer game if anyone's interested). Does anyone have a really long description of what happened?

I came in just as Buffy was freeing Spike from the basement and Wood and Giles were conspiring to kill Spike. I have to say seeing Giles agree to that was quite a surprise and I think they are trying to make him appear more dark as of late.

I think Buffy wants to keep Spike around because she feels guilty and inadequate for not taking the power that was offered to her by the three dudes with the early slayer mojo. She's hoping he'll make the difference, but as Wood pointed out and as I of course called it looks like the First has bigger plans for Spike.

They could be down the drain however if Spike really has gotten over his trigger, and how in the hell did Wood figure out what it was!?
 
The name of the episode I'm guessing comes from how Nikki told Wood that she loved him, but the mission comes first. Spike's mother told him she loved his poetry because she loved him. In both cases, each mother told a little fib to make the prodigal son feel better.

As far as the episode... I absolutly loved it. I wished I would have recorded it. I know alot of people will gripe because it didn't have hardly any Anya/Xander, Willow/Dawn, or Andrew for that matter. This was an episode i've been looking forward to for awhile. Finally, the inevitable conflict between Wood and Spike occured. It will be very interesting to see how Giles and Wood approach Buffy now. Could this be the beginning of Joyce's prediction? Will Buffy's friends turn on her? ARGH I can't wait to find out 🙂
 
Spike centric eps are never going to set my world on fire but I kinda liked this one.
Good Flashbacks (Even Spikes mother didn't like his poetry ) and always good to see Drucilla back.

My estimation of Wood went up in this episode. I felt sorry for him. I was a bit annoyed that the rest of the Scoobies got approximatly 1 line each though Although Andrew's was a classic. Nice last scene too. Giles and Buffy aren't as solid anymore.
Can't wait for the next ep! Have to wait another 3 weeks though!
 
I read somewhere that in the 3rd act, something changes the way of the series or something, i havent seen it can someone explain what this is?
 
I loved this episode to a point i was like crying the whole fighting scene i so didn't want spike to be dusted... as for Wood i think he got what he deserved! and Giles is really starting to make me mad, he should have never even tried to stall buffy that was wrong of him. Buffys seventh season is going to go out in a bang thats for sure always does! 😀
 
If the show had another season coming (sniff) it would have been amazing for Spike to not have staked his mother and have some eps with her in Sunnydale... I think she would have made a great villian.
 
This episode was fun.

Even thoug Spike's mom probably didn't like his horrible poetry, before she was turned, she did truly love him for what he was trying to do. It's a mother's job to love their kids, no matter how bad their poetry is. 🙂

Whoa! Giles is a jerk. This is the first time since the show started that I have actually HATED Giles. Buffy knows what she needs to do, you don't need to hurt her and lower her morale by killing off someone that she feels she needs in the biggest fight of her life.

I think the Joyce/Dawn thing was resolved. Buffy told Giles that if she had to, to save the world, she would kill Dawn... so I'm wondering now if the ghost was really Joyce.

And Wood better watch his back.
 
I really loved this episode. Probably 'cause my fave character is Spike. I really do dislike Wood now. I think that this ep has shown us that not every vamp with a soul is gonna end up like Angel. As someone else already mentioned, Spike obviously isn't really trying to make up for his past deeds. He knows he's killed people, and he obviously feels some kind of remorse, but, it seems different than Angel. I think the only indication of his remorse is when he didn't kill Wood. But I believe him when he says he'll kill Wood if he "even looks at him funny".

My favourite part -- can you guess? Spike and Dru making out! Aww, how much I miss those two! They were so good together. I loved the whole Spike flashbacks in general -- what a geek William was. And I noticed that Spike obviously loved his mom, but not in a sexual/romantic way, 'cause he was visably creeped when she started coming onto him after she was vamped. His mom was seriously creepy though, I didn't like her one bit.

And.. can I mention how much I hate Giles right now? Okay, he had a good point.. Buffy's got to be able to make sacrifices, but, seriously, he was making me mad. I think the Buffy/Giles relationship is going to go downhill for a while, but Giles will do something to make it up to her.
 
oh--- one thing I forgot.

Um... Spike biting Wood? What's up with that? I'm thinking that it was just a 'love' bite, you know. Not love, of course, but maybe to warn Wood that he'd better watch out.

What does anybody else think, cuz I'm just wondering about that.
 
The episode was good. Even though I hate Spike, I like the relationship he had with his mother. Sweet and caring.

I like the part when Giles got angry that the new library all got
computers and not books!
 
GILES, how could you?! he let wood poison him so easily! he knows as much as buffy why they havent killed him yet, i'm pretty dissapointed with him, buffy was right to slam the door on him!

and buffy says she'll kill dawn to save the world, where did that come from?! two seasons ago she was gonna kill her own friends if they tried to kill her. i mean i know 2 seasons is a long time, but i figured she'd be even MORE fond of her now that they've lived together and made some REAL memories and stuff.

and to SPIKEDBUFFY, i totaly believe it was the real joyce talking to dawn. it's starting to make me think that's exactly what's gonna happen, buffy might let dawn die to save everybody. that would SUUUUUUUUCK!
 
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