Questions About the Series and Season 5

[LadyLavinia]

Questions:

1. Was the Shanshu prophecy merely a hoax, since Angel first discovered the scrolls in "Blind Date"? If so, who perputrated it?

2. Was the episode "Destiny" supposed to be the final word on the Shanshu prophecy? If so, what was that final word?

3. Why did Angel think it was necessary to go after the Circle of the Black Thorn? What did he hope to accomplish?

4. After five years in Pylea, Fred finally reconciled with her parents . . . for about ten to twenty minutes. So why did she decide to remain in Los Angeles after being separated with her parents for so long? What was her reason?

5. Why was Connor strong enough to defeat Sajhan, and not Angel - who is stronger than his son?

6. What was Spike's purpose to Angel's story in the latter half of Season 5?

7. Why did Fred decide to join Wolfram & Hart, when she had misgivings about the firm in the first place?

8. Why was Lindsey so upset over Angel becoming head of Wolfram & Hart's L.A. Branch, after turning his back on the firm, some three-and-a-half years ago?

9. Was Lindsey the reason why Eve turned against the Senior Partners?

10. What did Angel hope to accomplish by destroying the Circle of the Black Thorn?

11. Was "Origin" the last word on the whole mindwipe/Connor's destiny thing?

12. Why did Wesley remembered his affair with Lilah Morgan, despite having his memories of Connor erased? Especially since Connor's presence in his life had led to his affair with Lilah in the first place. Did Whedon and ME want the fans to forget Lilah, after Wes got involved with Fred?

13. Who was behind the cyber robots' attack against W&H and especially, Angel?

14. Was Nina's purpose in Angel's life, during Season 5?

 

[Ninjalizer]

I'll take the first five.

Questions:
1. Was the Shanshu prophecy merely a hoax, since Angel first discovered the scrolls in "Blind Date"? If so, who perputrated it?

Merely a hoax? Did you watch the last episode? He signs it away, giving up all hope for the Shanshu.

2. Was the episode "Destiny" supposed to be the final word on the Shanshu prophecy? If so, what was that final word?

Final word?

3. Why did Angel think it was necessary to go after the Circle of the Black Thorn? What did he hope to accomplish?

Again, where were you in the last two episodes. Angel himself explains that the Circle is the direct "puppets" for the Senior Partners. Taking them down will deal a great blow to the Partners, to show them that they arent going to play their game.

4. After five years in Pylea, Fred finally reconciled with her parents . . . for about ten to twenty minutes. So why did she decide to remain in Los Angeles after being separated with her parents for so long? What was her reason?

To stay where she was needed. Angel Investigations.

5. Why was Connor strong enough to defeat Sajhan, and not Angel - who is stronger than his son?

This question doesn't make sense. You're asking who is stronger than Connor? Umm Hamilton, Illyria, probably a lot of people...

 

[Mason]

This question doesn't make sense. You're asking who is stronger than Connor? Umm Hamilton, Illyria, probably a lot of people...

I believe the question meant, why was Connor able to beat Sajhan, but not Angel (who is supposedly stronger than Connor).

1. Was the Shanshu prophecy merely a hoax, since Angel first discovered the scrolls in "Blind Date"? If so, who perputrated it? No, it wasn't a hoax. Angel signed the prophecy away in Not Fade Away.

2. Was the episode "Destiny" supposed to be the final word on the Shanshu prophecy? If so, what was that final word? No, the final word so to speak was in Not Fade Away, where it was signed away.

3. Why did Angel think it was necessary to go after the Circle of the Black Thorn? What did he hope to accomplish? To show the Senior Partners that no matter how much evil there is, there'll always be good to fight against it and no matter how strong evil gets, good cannot be owned by it.

4. After five years in Pylea, Fred finally reconciled with her parents . . . for about ten to twenty minutes. So why did she decide to remain in Los Angeles after being separated with her parents for so long? What was her reason? She felt she was more needed with Angel Investigations. Also, from a flashback (I think it was in Shells?), Fred wanted to be independent, away from her parents.

5. Why was Connor strong enough to defeat Sajhan, and not Angel - who is stronger than his son? I think we'd have to assume it's something to do with the fact that Connor was the son of two vampires. Maybe Connor was stronger than a vampire against Sajhan. Who knows.

6. What was Spike's purpose to Angel's story in the latter half of Season 5? Not really sure. I think he just realised that was where he was meant to be, to help Angel because he knew something big was coming up.

7. Why did Fred decide to join Wolfram & Hart, when she had misgivings about the firm in the first place? Perhaps it was the huge science department offered to her. Home probably has some more answers, but I can't remember it to be honest.

8. Why was Lindsey so upset over Angel becoming head of Wolfram & Hart's L.A. Branch, after turning his back on the firm, some three-and-a-half years ago? Jealousy? His main rival (who fought against the company) became the head of the LA branch with no effort after Lindsay had been fighting to get to the top for years.

9. Was Lindsey the reason why Eve turned against the Senior Partners? I'd think so.

10. What did Angel hope to accomplish by destroying the Circle of the Black Thorn? To delay The Apocalypse and to show the Senior Partners that they aren't in control of everything.

11. Was "Origin" the last word on the whole mindwipe/Connor's destiny thing? Unless you don't count Connor's return where he revealed he knew about the mindwipe in Not Fade Away, yes.

12. Why did Wesley remembered his affair with Lilah Morgan, despite having his memories of Connor erased? Especially since Connor's presence in his life had led to his affair with Lilah in the first place. Did Whedon and ME want the fans to forget Lilah, after Wes got involved with Fred? I think everybody just forgot Connor, not necessarily everything else that happened. Wes probably remembered being exiled from the group and being with Lilah, but didn't remember why.

13. Who was behind the cyber robots' attack against W&H and especially, Angel? I don't think we ever found out. We have to assume that would be one of the issues that would have been wrapped up had there been a sixth season commissioned.

14. Was Nina's purpose in Angel's life, during Season 5? To provide some hope for Angel? Not really sure. I'm sure she would have had a bigger part if the show wasn't cancelled.


Anybody feel free to correct any errors I've made.

 

[LadyLavinia]

More Responses

Angel's Resolve to Defeat the CotBT:

Again, where were you in the last two episodes. Angel himself explains that the Circle is the direct "puppets" for the Senior Partners. Taking them down will deal a great blow to the Partners, to show them that they arent going to play their game.

That's it?


To show the Senior Partners that no matter how much evil there is, there'll always be good to fight against it and no matter how strong evil gets, good cannot be owned by it.

Again . . . ::change:: Considering that there is an army of Slayers in the world, couldn't there have been a better reason for Angel to go after the demonic circle?


Fred's Remains in L.A.:

To stay where she was needed. Angel Investigations.

Why did Angel Investigations needed her? They did fine without her for two years.

She felt she was more needed with Angel Investigations. Also, from a flashback (I think it was in Shells?), Fred wanted to be independent, away from her parents.

But after five years in another dimension, with no contact with loved ones? She couldn't even hang around in Texas for a few months?


Connor, Angel and Sahjan:

This question doesn't make sense. You're asking who is stronger than Connor? Umm Hamilton, Illyria, probably a lot of people...

I'm not asking who's stronger. I'm asking why Angel couldn't defeat Sahjan and Connor could . . . especially since Angel rarely lost to Connor in a fight.

Lindsey's Return:

Jealousy? His main rival (who fought against the company) became the head of the LA branch with no effort after Lindsay had been fighting to get to the top for years.

But why? Not only had he turned his back on W&H and Los Angeles, several years ago, Lindsey had even given Angel advice on how to defeat the Senior Partners. So why bother coming back to plot against the SPs and Angel?

Wesley's Memories of Lilah:

I think everybody just forgot Connor, not necessarily everything else that happened. Wes probably remembered being exiled from the group and being with Lilah, but didn't remember why.


I think this whole situation was badly handled by the ME writers and turned out to be one of the biggest disappointments for me.

 

[Xander]

Connor was prophecised to kill Sahjan, hence why Sahjan tried to kill Angel and all.

 

[Mason]

Again . . . ::change:: Considering that there is an army of Slayers in the world, couldn't there have been a better reason for Angel to go after the demonic circle?

He's a champion. He did what a champion would do. From what was said about the Slayers not trusting Angel because he joined Wolfram and Hart, I'd theorise that they knew about the Senior Partners, but we didn't hear of them doing anything against them. Also, the Black Thorn was a secret society and the only way to truly know about it was to join - I don't see a Slayer being able to get into the Circle, somehow.

Why did Angel Investigations needed her? They did fine without her for two years.

As I recall, Wes wouldn't have even been able to open the portal back from Pylea without Fred's help. You can't deny the knowledge she brought to the group. Maybe she just felt safe with Angel Investigations. Maybe there was some element of vengeance in her, waiting for an opportunity to meet the person who sent her to Pylea in the first place.

But after five years in another dimension, with no contact with loved ones? She couldn't even hang around in Texas for a few months?

I would agree with that, but again she felt she was needed more at Angel Investigations. I know in reality I'd have gone back to my family, but this is a TV show, these things tend to happen.

I'm not asking who's stronger. I'm asking why Angel couldn't defeat Sahjan and Connor could . . . especially since Angel rarely lost to Connor in a fight.

As AshSan said, Connor was the one prophesised to kill Sahjan, not Angel.

But why? Not only had he turned his back on W&H and Los Angeles, several years ago, Lindsey had even given Angel advice on how to defeat the Senior Partners. So why bother coming back to plot against the SPs and Angel?

He was a deprived child who didn't have a lot for himself...perhaps, ultimately he wanted power, to make up for his childhood.

I think this whole situation was badly handled by the ME writers and turned out to be one of the biggest disappointments for me.

I'd agree, I'd have liked to have seen that explained more. It was vague.

My answers are mainly theories.

 

[Ninjalizer]

Angel's Resolve to Defeat the CotBT:

Again, where were you in the last two episodes. Angel himself explains that the Circle is the direct "puppets" for the Senior Partners. Taking them down will deal a great blow to the Partners, to show them that they arent going to play their game.

That's it?

Yes, that's it. If you wanted more information, then you shouldn't have been watching the show. That was the reason. It was a good reason. You sound like a little kid asking 'why?' after every answer an adult gives them. I didn't mean that as a bash on you. But accept the answer. Quit looking for more.

To show the Senior Partners that no matter how much evil there is, there'll always be good to fight against it and no matter how strong evil gets, good cannot be owned by it.

Again . . . ::change:: Considering that there is an army of Slayers in the world, couldn't there have been a better reason for Angel to go after the demonic circle?

Are you serious? What does the army of slayers have to do with 'Angel'? No wait, I'll answer it. Nothing. They have nothing to do with it. You're watching the wrong show. Angel had to deal with everything in L.A. The SP were unstoppable. The only way they could deal a good blow to them was to take out the 'circle'. There didn't need to be a better reason.

Fred's Remains in L.A.:

To stay where she was needed. Angel Investigations.

Why did Angel Investigations needed her? They did fine without her for two years.

Oh, right. Just like they were doing fine without Wesley. Without Gunn. Without Spike. Did you watch the series? Fred helped out a lot. That's why they needed her.

Also, from a flashback (I think it was in Shells?), Fred wanted to be independent, away from her parents.

But after five years in another dimension, with no contact with loved ones? She couldn't even hang around in Texas for a few months?

That's what Fred chose. It's too bad you can't deal with that.

Connor, Angel and Sahjan:

This question doesn't make sense. You're asking who is stronger than Connor? Umm Hamilton, Illyria, probably a lot of people...

I'm not asking who's stronger. I'm asking why Angel couldn't defeat Sahjan and Connor could . . . especially since Angel rarely lost to Connor in a fight.

Stronger doesn't mean that you will win. Ever heard of David and Goliath?

Wesley's Memories of Lilah:

I think everybody just forgot Connor, not necessarily everything else that happened. Wes probably remembered being exiled from the group and being with Lilah, but didn't remember why.

I think this whole situation was badly handled by the ME writers and turned out to be one of the biggest disappointments for me.

It was handled very well. People just tried to overanalyze it. The memories of Connor were erased. Just Connor. Exactly what Mason said. When thinking about events that were associated with Conner, they were unsure of how they happened. But if the writers were to go into that, they would be wasting so much time.

It's too bad that you have to try and pick apart little things like this to make your viewing of the series so disappointing...

 

[LadyLavinia]

I'm sorry folks! Late Season 5 was total bullsh*t for me! I ended up very disappointed. Not only that, I DO NOT consider Angel to be a champion. Not after what he had done to his friends and Connor for an entire year - along with ordering Lorne to murder Lindsey. And to make matters worse, ME had the Powers to Be willing to still give him the Shanshu . . . after all the crap he had pulled. I ended up disgusted.

For the person who believed that the whole matter regarding Wes' memories of Lilah was handled well. . . that's an opinion I do not share. Someone once told me that sooner or later, ME will reveal why Wes remembered his affair with Lilah and not Connor. THEY NEVER DID.

 

[Ninjalizer]

I'm sorry folks! Late Season 5 was total bullsh*t for me! I ended up very disappointed. Not only that, I DO NOT consider Angel to be a champion. Not after what he had done to his friends and Connor for an entire year - along with ordering Lorne to murder Lindsey. And to make matters worse, ME had the Powers to Be willing to still give him the Shanshu . . . after all the crap he had pulled. I ended up disgusted.

It's awesome that we have such strong opposing opinions. Honestly.

For the person who believed that the whole matter regarding Wes' memories of Lilah was handled well. . . that's an opinion I do not share. Someone once told me that sooner or later, ME will reveal why Wes remembered his affair with Lilah and not Connor. THEY NEVER DID.

Again, I respect your opinion on the matter. I just think that you're looking too far into it. Just take it like it was. It all makes sense to me. And to millions of others. And there are some like you, who think otherwise. That's ok. But it looks like you had a bad source of info...this person who told you that they would explain it, got your hopes up. Now you're angry.

 

[skital]

Wow. What a nit picker.


PS: Late Season 5 ROCKED!

 

[THE BLUE]

1. Was the Shanshu prophecy merely a hoax, since Angel first discovered the scrolls in "Blind Date"? If so, who perputrated it?

I have a feeling that all prophecies in Buffyverse are hoax. Life's what you make it, so to speak.

2. Was the episode "Destiny" supposed to be the final word on the Shanshu prophecy? If so, what was that final word?

The final word? Do you think Buffyverse gives a damn about it? It never did.

3. Why did Angel think it was necessary to go after the Circle of the Black Thorn? What did he hope to accomplish?

He wanted to know the limits of evil. As he found out in the series final, there is no limit.

4. After five years in Pylea, Fred finally reconciled with her parents . . . for about ten to twenty minutes. So why did she decide to remain in Los Angeles after being separated with her parents for so long? What was her reason?

She felt she was a part of the Angel Investigations and wanted to stay that way. So she stayed.

5. Why was Connor strong enough to defeat Sajhan, and not Angel - who is stronger than his son?

I guess it was an excuse for writers to write Connor's return.

6. What was Spike's purpose to Angel's story in the latter half of Season 5?

Comic relief?

7. Why did Fred decide to join Wolfram & Hart, when she had misgivings about the firm in the first place?

Why did others decide to join? Greed for power.

8. Why was Lindsey so upset over Angel becoming head of Wolfram & Hart's L.A. Branch, after turning his back on the firm, some three-and-a-half years ago?

I have a better question; why did Lindsey return?

9. Was Lindsey the reason why Eve turned against the Senior Partners?

Yes.

10. What did Angel hope to accomplish by destroying the Circle of the Black Thorn?

They were evil and Senior Partners would never think that Angel would kill them all. A surprise effect, at best.

11. Was "Origin" the last word on the whole mindwipe/Connor's destiny thing?

I guess that was it.

12. Why did Wesley remembered his affair with Lilah Morgan, despite having his memories of Connor erased? Especially since Connor's presence in his life had led to his affair with Lilah in the first place. Did Whedon and ME want the fans to forget Lilah, after Wes got involved with Fred?

I guess he couldn't make the connection between himself and Lilah and the road to their affair so he had thought it as being insignificant. And without feeling remorse or anything he concentrated on Fred.

13. Who was behind the cyber robots' attack against W&H and especially, Angel?

I think it was The First.

14. Was Nina's purpose in Angel's life, during Season 5?

What was the purpose of his one night stand with Eve? Relief.