Rant about (Doris)!

[T.I.P]

Em... whats the legal age in America for people to move out? Over here it 16, so im just going by that.
When i was 16 i would have totally understood this situation, and well, if i went to a foster home at that age id simply walk out.
And also you could tell what doris was all about before she even opened her mouth.

 

[hidden]

thats a good point whats to stop dawn from leaving her new home?

but thats not really the point because doris was just doing her job

 

[Washburne]

Em... whats the legal age in America for people to move out? Over here it 16, so im just going by that.

I´m not really sure what that mean. But here you´re considered an adult then you turn 18. So until then you´re your parents responsibility. That doesn´t mean you can´t move out of the house before. But I don´t think you can get your own place without your parents permission/signing for the contract. But I´m not totally sure. I´ll have to ask my sister. She moved out just before she turned 16.

Now let someone tell how it´s in America. Does it varies between states?

When i was 16 i would have totally understood this situation, and well, if i went to a foster home at that age id simply walk out.

Of course you can walk out, and if you have the legal right to get your own place (if that´s that you mean by legal age) they can´t do anything to stop you.

But if you aren´t allowed to get your own place it would make things worse (It would take me to long trying to expain it all it in english, sorry). You could however get by on your own, but you´ll have to rely on someone else. Living with friends an so on, not getting any support from social services and stuff like that.

But maybe there just differences between our countries.

And also you could tell what doris was all about before she even opened her mouth.

I think that was kind of the point.

 

[T.I.P]

Over here you can move out your parents house at 16 and leave school at 15, but you cant drive till 17, or drink alcohol until 18.
But i imagine in America as they have to stay in school til 18 then they probably have to be 18 to move out,

 

[Old Master 3.0]

Here in the United States, the legal age of consent and majority is a state, territorial jurisdiction....but it is generally the age of 18.

At 18 here, you have the complete legal right to move out, enter into contracts, vote, drive, etc. On the flip side you can be tried as an adult, be sued, etc.

Once a child turns 18 here in the States, a parent no longer has any legal control over the child. Of course, the drinking age here (21 in most states) is different than the age of majority.

But of course, if you're still living in your parents house at that age, you're still bound by any set house rules. :: tu ::

 

[DrusillaDarling]

In all honesty, Dawn should have been put into foster care.
Many of the red flags have already been mentioned, but think about it. Buffy is pretty neglectful of Dawn. She doesn't do anything about Dawns grades or the fact that she's always late for school. She leaves Dawn alone in the house for hours to go have sex with Spike. And it takes months for anyone to realize Dawns shoplifting problem. And i'm sure there is more.

The Buffybot was a better mother. And Tara is the only thing near to a parental figure to dawn. I'm sure Dawn would have been a hell of a lot better off if she had lived with Tara. Buffy just doesn't have a lifestyle in which she can take care of other people.

 

[fly on the wall]

I've skimmed over the posts here so this may have been said...but Doris didn't leave Buffy's house to go get the paperwork to take Dawn away. As far as I understood it, she was just going to write a bad report and do some follow-up visits, and if things didn't improve, THEN she'd take action. This, of course, was bad for Buffy but I feel Doris was justified. She was a little judgmental, yes, but that's what social workers are supposed to do: come into a home and judge the situation for the child in question's sake.

That being said, while I don't think living with Hank or in a random foster home would have been better for Dawn, living with her sister wasn't a suitable home either. Buffy, her sole guardian and family member, outright ignores her. She had her reasons, yes, but I don't think it can be justified.

 

[VisionGuy]

I gotta go with Blondie Bear on this one. Of course, that's a usually usual thing because she's smart.

Social workers are here to try and spot what could be a problem to make sure children aren't being raised by the wrong people. Surely, you'd have to agree that plenty of people DON'T deserve to raise children or that there are homes a child shouldn't be in.

If we look at the scenerio from an outside view, there are issues.

Dawn's absenteeism is a red flag for a lot of things. Think about it. A child being raised by a "capable" person can USUALLY insure they actually show up to school. When they find out said kid is NOT going to school, they would take steps to remedy that.

Buffy is all scatterbrained when she shows up. Sure, that happens to the best of us. On the other hand, it can also be a red flag for other things. Substance abuse for one. Probably ALONE the scatterbraininess wouldn't have been so bad.

Then you have Spike. Who's obviously acting EXTREMELY weird and, although I love him, NOT the man I'd want influencing MY teenage daughter...just on site. The fact that he was acting like a mad man switching from one personality to another and carrying a "blankey"...not too coool.

Buffy should NOT have lied about Willow. She should have just said one of her friends lived there to help her out. By lying, she looked like she was hiding something.

In the end, you have THREE grown adults in a house all lying and acting totally bizarre. The normal thought? They're hiding something. And they WERE hiding something. Since Doris doesn't know about Vampires, witches and Slayers, she had to assume they were hiding something normal. Like, perhaps, "magic weed".

Under NORMAL non-mystical situations, this would all be a HUGE red flag to anyone. This would NOT be a scenerio where I would walk away assuming I misread everything if I were the CPS woman.

To be totally honest, if I were her and DID know and believe about mystical things going on, but not where Dawn came from, I'm not sure I would think it's a good place for Dawn. We have a Slayer who's not always able to be around, a witch going crazy and a vampire who's in the process of going less crazy and danger surrounding all three of them. Dawn WAS getting lost in the shuffle. She's not the picture of stability even though she got to stay. Strickly from a parenting stand point, it's not the best environment for her...and her father probably SHOULD have been tracked down and forced to take Dawn. (He SHOULD have been sending Child Support if nothing else.)

Not to mention the fact that Buffy was dressed sluttier than normal. The shirt was see through right? I always found that her oufit in this scene screamed. "Hey look at me! I'm an irresponsible crack whore who sleeps with rock star wannabees that carry blankies." I know that's judgemental but still...

 

[palabravampiress]

I think I'm going to disagree with the majority on this one. A lot of kids are raised in a lot more abusive and/or neglectful situations. People fail to provide their children with adequate medical care all of the time, often even stooping so low as to steal or sell their childrens' prescription medications. People lose their jobs and their homes, carting their children from unstable situation to unstable situation. Sometimes, people live out of their cars or simply on the streets. People live with partners who abuse them and their kids. People do and sell drugs. People get arrested, get in bar fights, etc. Kids fail classes or drop out of school. Kids commit petty crimes and get arrested, too. My aunt has three kids, none of whom have ever been taken from her despite the fact that most of the things that I just listed are part of her life. It takes *a lot* to remove a kid from her home, especially an older kid who is on the brink of adulthood. Usually, kids are only removed from those situations in pretty extreme circumstances and after a lot of investigation and intervention.

I think the whole process seemed too fast. Doris may have been right to question something, but she was wrong to recommend foster care. In a situation like that, a real social worker would probably recommend parenting courses, counseling, and perhaps a little bit of supervision. She wouldn't have recommended immediate removal; that's just jumping the gun. Kids aren't removed from houses because the inhabitants look a little weird or shady or even because the inhabitants are suspected (but not proven) to be in possession of marijuana.

 

[Jordan]

Ah well bottom line is Dorris crapped her bloomers when Invisi-Buf launched an attack on her. lol

 

[fly on the wall]

I think I'm going to disagree with the majority on this one. A lot of kids are raised in a lot more abusive and/or neglectful situations. People fail to provide their children with adequate medical care all of the time, often even stooping so low as to steal or sell their childrens' prescription medications. People lose their jobs and their homes, carting their children from unstable situation to unstable situation. Sometimes, people live out of their cars or simply on the streets. People live with partners who abuse them and their kids. People do and sell drugs. People get arrested, get in bar fights, etc. Kids fail classes or drop out of school. Kids commit petty crimes and get arrested, too. My aunt has three kids, none of whom have ever been taken from her despite the fact that most of the things that I just listed are part of her life. It takes *a lot* to remove a kid from her home, especially an older kid who is on the brink of adulthood. Usually, kids are only removed from those situations in pretty extreme circumstances and after a lot of investigation and intervention.

I think the whole process seemed to fast. Doris may have been right to question something, but she was wrong to recommend foster care. In a situation like that, a real social worker would probably recommend parenting courses, counseling, and perhaps a little bit of supervision. She wouldn't have recommended immediate removal; that's just jumping the gun. Kids aren't removed from houses because the inhabitants look a little weird or shady or even because the inhabitants are suspected (but not proven) to be in possession of marijuana.

Well, I agree, that was kinda my point...I don't think Doris could have had Dawn taken away just like that.
I do think, however, that Dawn would have been more likely to be taken away, since she wasn't living with a parent. She was living with her sister, who was only six years older than herself, who happened to be unemployed. She also had a living parent elsewhere, so I think it's very likely that it wouldn't have been as difficult to remove Dawn from Buffy's care as it would be to remove her from a parent's. Probably, they would have changed the primary caretaker from Buffy to Hank...although I agree, it would have required a lot more time, work, and investigation than Doris put in.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I definitely see why Doris felt the way she did about the situation. Honestly if you remove yourself from the fan mindset, you'd think the same thing Doris thought: that Buffy was an unfit mother figure for Dawn, and that Dawn needed to be placed somewhere better for her needs.
And look at it... Besides the times when she had to directly interact with Dawn, such as saving her life, she was a HORRIBLE "parent" to her... How many times was Dawn left with someone else while Buffy went out to screw Spike, on the premise that she was "patrolling"? She was never around for her, and she didn't notice anything that was going on with her. No wonder social services wanted to take her out of the picture...

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

Honestly if you remove yourself from the fan mindset,

You're on the wrong board for that honey.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

From what I saw, Doris came, saw, took notes and left. She did her job. She could have called the cops about the weed, and frankly, she should have, but she didn't.

I understand why Buffy did what she did, making people think Doris was crazy. She didn't want to lose Dawn. But think of poor Doris. Perhaps, her whole life she'd wanted to help people. She saw that the Summers had a bad time and would have to report it and maybe try to work something out with them, maybe send Dawn away for a few weeks so her unemployed marujana-using sister would realize the seriousness of the situation. And then hopefully, like Doris always wanted for families, they'd re-unite.

Or maybe Doris got into the business to break up families for fun. We don't know.

Point is, I wouldn't be surprised if she got fired. I sure hope she doesn't have a daughter that was taken away because her mom kept talking about flying cups.

 

[Revolver]

My father is a social worker so I can understand why Doris would be critical of Buffy. It isn't about wanting to break up families. Dawn's grades were falling, Buffy forgot the appointment, she was lying about who lived in her house, she appeared to have an unstable boyfriend, she was unemployed and unable to provide for Dawn, she wasn't Dawn's parent in the first place, Dawn was injured, she had what appeared to be drugs in the house. It's a lot of things for a social worker to discover in five minutes.

Being old enough to understand the situation doesn't make Dawn a responsible adult. Being 18 doesn't even really make someone a responsible adult or being 25 for that matter. Just because, for instance, someone is old enough to quit school doesn't mean it is in their best interests to do so because they would like to at the time. There are a lot of decisions 16 year olds make that they wouldn't even a year or two later. I remember being 16, and MOST 16 year olds are not as responsible as they'd like to think they are.