Revelations - Interesting Facts

[PrincessBuffy16]

Revelations​

Writer: Douglas Petrie
Director: James A. Contner
Aired: November 17, 1998

Trivia:

- The title refers to the last book of the Christian Bible that deals with the events surrounding the end of the world.

- Xander alludes to the zombies Buffy killed in "Dead Man's Party" and Larconis, the sewer-dwelling demon Buffy incinerated in "Band Candy."

- Giles does have a copy of Twilight Compendium by Sir Robert Kane, but doesn't have either Howe's Paranormal Encyclopedia or The Labyrinth Maps of Malta (although he insists the latter is on order).

- There are twelve cemeteries within Sunnydale's city limits, two of which are the Restfield Cemetery and the Shady Hill Cemetery.

- Faith's past boyfriends have included guys named Ronnie, Steve and Kenny, who was a drummer.

- The lightning that shoots from the Glove of Myhneghon in this episode was drawn frame by frame by an artist per Joss's request.

- The Glove was included in DST's Weapons Accessory Pack for its range of Buffy action figures. It's solid rather than hollow so figures cannot actually wear it.

Arc significance:

- Angel's resurrection divides the Scooby Gang.
- Xander and Willow continue their secret relationship, actually engaging in a lengthy kiss.
- Faith finds someone to depend on, only to find that person a liar. This compounds her distrust of others. Gwendolyn Post also reinforced Faith's feeling of distance from the rest of the gang.
- Buffy cuts off Gwendolyn's arm in the same fashion that Angel cut off Lindsay's hand.

Goofs:

- At 36:14, as Buffy says, "Faith, we can figure this out," you can see the tip of the boom microphone dipping into the top of the frame.

- When Post is putting on the glove the skin on her arm becomes broken *before* the spike touches it.

References:

- "Excuse me, Mary Poppins, you don't seem to be listening." Mary Poppins was the impeccably British, charming, magical and no-nonsense nanny of the Banks children.

- "The emotional Marathon Man?" Marathon Man was a 1976 John Schlesinger movie starring Dustin Hoffman as a young student who becomes unwittingly involved in the hunt for a former Nazi, played by Academy Award® nominee Laurence Olivier.

Body count:

- Lagos, Gwendolyn Post, 2 Vampires.

Best Quotes:

- Giles: I won't remind you that the fate of the world often lies with the Slayer. What would be the point? Nor shall I remind you that you've jeopardized the lives of all that you hold dear by harboring a known murderer. But, sadly, I must remind you that Angel tortured me... for hours... for pleasure. You should have told me he was alive. You didn't. You have no respect for me or the job I perform.

- Buffy: You would just love an excuse to hurt him, wouldn't you?
Xander: I don't need an excuse. I think lots of dead people actually constitutes a reason!

- Gwendolyn Post: The fact is, there is talk in the Council that you have become a bit too... American.
Giles: Me?
Buffy: Him?

- Giles: That was bracing.
Buffy: Interesting lady. Can we kill her?
Giles: I think the Council might frown upon that.

- Faith: You can't trust guys.
Buffy: You can trust some guys. Really, I've read about them.

- Cordelia: Hello, Miss Not-Over-Yourself-Yet?

Soundtrack:

- "Run"
Four Star Mary

- "West Of Here"
Lotion

- "Silver Dollar"
Man of the Year



Source: http://imdb.com

 

[BuffyElevated]

I really liked this ep... I absolutely hated Gwendolyn, so I was happy that she was evil and had to be killed, but the Angel arc in it was good for the characters... When Giles says

I won't remind you that the fate of the world often lies with the Slayer. What would be the point? Nor shall I remind you that you've jeopardized the lives of all that you hold dear by harboring a known murderer. But, sadly, I must remind you that Angel tortured me... for hours... for pleasure. You should have told me he was alive. You didn't. You have no respect for me or the job I perform.

it always breaks my heart... In that moment, I really did see that Buffy should have told them all as soon as she found out Angel was back. Because Giles was completely right.

 

[PrincessBuffy16]

I really liked this ep... I absolutely hated Gwendolyn, so I was happy that she was evil and had to be killed, but the Angel arc in it was good for the characters... When Giles says

it always breaks my heart... In that moment, I really did see that Buffy should have told them all as soon as she found out Angel was back. Because Giles was completely right.

In one hand I can understand Giles, but in the other, I'm with Buffy. I mean, Giles was right, Buffy should've told him, because Buffy didn't know how Angels was doing and maybe Giles could've help her. But I think Giles should've been proud of her, because she acted good when she saw him, especially emotionaly. I think I can really understand Buffy better, because I'm her age now, and in real life you can see that situation in the way, like your dad forbid you to see this boy, but you love him so you have to keep it a secret :/

 

[GrrArghx]

This episode pisses me off just like Dead Man's Party & Empty Places, lol.

Giles was really harsh. I was expecting the Giles from Innocence, but nope. He mentions that Angel tortured him, and I think that's a big reason Buffy didn't tell him. I think he should've understood that.

Buffy had so much to deal with; with Angel dying, getting framed for murder, being kicked out of her house, coming back to another Slayer and a very not-warm welcome. Then, Angel comes back and that's yet another thing on her plate. I can totally get why she didn't tell anyone. She said herself they wouldn't understand and it was true. They totally flipped.

 

[BibliophileAnn]

Revealations - Interesting Facts

If Buffy had told them Angel was back they would have freaked which is exactly what they did. Angel with his soul intact and doing better was not at this point a threat to anyone and if he had become a threat Buffy would have dealt with him again.

 

[Vengeance]

For me, I always think of Angel and Angelus as seperate people. So when Giles says "Angel tortured me" I think, no that's wrong, Angelus tortured you. And when Xander says "I think lots of dead people actually constitutes a reason" that's also wrong, because Angel hasn't killed anybody. I understand why she didn't tell them (she did try to tell someone in ep 4 but he was dead), but she probably should've. Maybe they would've freaked but at least then it would've been on her terms.

 

[Icarium]

If Buffy had told them Angel was back they would have freaked which is exactly what they did. Angel with his soul intact and doing better was not at this point a threat to anyone and if he had become a threat Buffy would have dealt with him again.

You mean like she dealt with him in S2? After he had murdered an untold number of people and was on the loose for like half a year? Yes, I am sure Giles and the rest would be very comforted by that prospect...

Sarcasm aside, Buffy and Angel were incredibly irresponsible, IMO. If Angel is to lose his soul again it should be a child's play for him to learn his lesson from the last time and simply pretend to be good until he manages to murder Buffy, Willow and Giles, possibly Faith too if he can manage to make her trust him a bit. So it's not like if he loses his soul or decides that killing is "an easy way to live" Buffy would be able to stop him just like that or even know it until it's too late. The curse is an enormous risk. What should have happened is everybody researching and trying to find a way to remove the "true happiness" loophole but I guess that would have made the spin-off potentially less exciting so it was a no go.

I think Revelations is the only episode of Doug Petrie's that I would rate as really good, the rest range from "not bad" to "appallingly bad". But Revelations is all kinds of awesome. A great quote that wasn't mentioned: "Faith! A word of advice - you are an idiot.". Gwendolyn Post rocked indeed.

 

[GrrArghx]

You mean like she dealt with him in S2? After he had murdered an untold number of people and was on the loose for like half a year? Yes, I am sure Giles and the rest would be very comforted by that prospect...

I don't think it's fair at all to imply or assume Buffy would have dealt with it the same way she did the first time. She was young, in love, and had just lost her virginity. She was extremely vulnerable. She definitely learnt from the experience though and I believe 100% had it happened again, the second time around she would have handled it a hell of a lot better.

 

[BibliophileAnn]

For me, I always think of Angel and Angelus as seperate people. So when Giles says "Angel tortured me" I think, no that's wrong, Angelus tortured you. And when Xander says "I think lots of dead people actually constitutes a reason" that's also wrong, because Angel hasn't killed anybody. I understand why she didn't tell them (she did try to tell someone in ep 4 but he was dead), but she probably should've. Maybe they would've freaked but at least then it would've been on her terms.

Buffy always thought of Angel and Angelus as two separate people and I always think of them as separate people too because they do different things and talk different. Angel would never kill anybody while Angelus does etc. Yet on the show in season 2 after Surprise they keep calling Angelus Angel. I have been going but that's not Angel. That's Angelus. I guess you could say Angel has to bear the brunt of Angelus'kills.

---------- Post added at 07:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:15 PM ----------

I don't think it's fair at all to imply or assume Buffy would have dealt with it the same way she did the first time. She was young, in love, and had just lost her virginity. She was extremely vulnerable. She definitely learnt from the experience though and I believe 100% had it happened again, the second time around she would have handled it a hell of a lot better.

You misunderstood me. That is not what I was implying at all. I meant if it came down to it that Buffy had to kill him for real there would not be acathla this time and she might have to resort to staking or taking off Angelus's head this time. Literally kill him. Which Giles brought up in Amends.

---------- Post added at 07:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:34 PM ----------

I don't think it's fair at all to imply or assume Buffy would have dealt with it the same way she did the first time. She was young, in love, and had just lost her virginity. She was extremely vulnerable. She definitely learnt from the experience though and I believe 100% had it happened again, the second time around she would have handled it a hell of a lot better.

You misunderstood me. That is not what I was implying at all. I meant if it came down to it that Buffy had to kill him for real there would not be acathla this time and she might have to resort to staking or taking off Angelus's head this time. Literally kill him. Which Giles brought up in Amends.

 

[Icarium]

Even Spike and Drusila call Angel, well, Angel, not Angelus is season 2. Probably because nobody uses Latin any more, so Angelus sounds rather old-fashioned.

I don't think it's fair at all to imply or assume Buffy would have dealt with it the same way she did the first time.

Well, that's the thing, we don't know what Buffy would have done. You implied she would have death with him, presumably quickly, before he had killed anyone, I merely disagreed. And as I said, it is very likely that Buffy wouldn't have noticed him losing his soul until it's too late. It's not like she walks around with a soul detector or something = like that. 🙂

She definitely learnt from the experience though and I believe 100% had it happened again, the second time around she would have handled it a hell of a lot better.

I would love to believe that since I love S2 but later events seem to point otherwise. For instance Buffy's continual refusal to slay Spike after he had proven again and again that chip or no chip he still posed a threat. Or Buffy leaving Anya grant wishes under her nose for months in between S6-7.

 

[BibliophileAnn]

For me, I always think of Angel and Angelus as seperate people. So when Giles says "Angel tortured me" I think, no that's wrong, Angelus tortured you. And when Xander says "I think lots of dead people actually constitutes a reason" that's also wrong, because Angel hasn't killed anybody. I understand why she didn't tell them (she did try to tell someone in ep 4 but he was dead), but she probably should've. Maybe they would've freaked but at least then it would've been on her terms.

I think of Angel and Angelus as separate people as well. All the characters though in the season 2 after surprise kept calling Angelus Angel. That is why i typed Angel instead of Angelus.I have been watching season 2 a lot.

---------- Post added at 08:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:41 PM ----------

You mean like she dealt with him in S2? After he had murdered an untold number of people and was on the loose for like half a year? Yes, I am sure Giles and the rest would be very comforted by that prospect...

Sarcasm aside, Buffy and Angel were incredibly irresponsible, IMO. If Angel is to lose his soul again it should be a child's play for him to learn his lesson from the last time and simply pretend to be good until he manages to murder Buffy, Willow and Giles, possibly Faith too if he can manage to make her trust him a bit. So it's not like if he loses his soul or decides that killing is "an easy way to live" Buffy would be able to stop him just like that or even know it until it's too late. The curse is an enormous risk. What should have happened is everybody researching and trying to find a way to remove the "true happiness" loophole but I guess that would have made the spin-off potentially less exciting so it was a no go.

I think Revelations is the only episode of Doug Petrie's that I would rate as really good, the rest range from "not bad" to "appallingly bad". But Revelations is all kinds of awesome. A great quote that wasn't mentioned: "Faith! A word of advice - you are an idiot.". Gwendolyn Post rocked indeed.[/QUOTE/]

Oh you mean that Buffy and Angel were irresponsible kissing again when Xander saw them in Revealations season 3 which didn't result in Angel losing his soul. Or did you mean the first time in Surprise. Of course neither Buffy or Angel could have forseen that happening. Angel proved that he could kiss Buffy and not lose his soul when he kissed her in Enemies outside the move theater. I thought it was awesome when Buffy stopped Faith from staking Angel.

 

[GrrArghx]

Well, that's the thing, we don't know what Buffy would have done. You implied she would have death with him, presumably quickly, before he had killed anyone, I merely disagreed. And as I said, it is very likely that Buffy wouldn't have noticed him losing his soul until it's too late. It's not like she walks around with a soul detector or something = like that. 🙂 I would love to believe that since I love S2 but later events seem to point otherwise. For instance Buffy's continual refusal to slay Spike after he had proven again and again that chip or no chip he still posed a threat. Or Buffy leaving Anya grant wishes under her nose for months in between S6-7.

I don't think at all she would have immediately killed him, either. But I do believe she would have tried to get him his soul back before anything bad happened. But, if it came down to it, I don't think she would take so long, like she did last time, because like I said she was vulnerable before.

I like that in S4 of Angel, Wesley said it had to be Faith to help Angel, because she wasn't willing to kill him. He knew Buffy would be, and he wasn't even around the first time Angel lost his soul.

Either way, I do think Buffy would've handled it better the second time. Yeah, she doesn't have a soul detector, but I think she would be able to tell that it wasn't really Angel.

As for the Spike and Anya thing, it's not the first time she's done that. There are tons of instances where a threat wasn't dealt with immediately. She's even spared your average run-of-the-mill vamps before. Besides, Anya didn't really grant anything bad until S7 and then Buffy was more than willing to deal with her. Spike, well, she did say she didn't want to kill him because he was basically helpless.

 

[Vengeance]

Don't they kinda have to sleep together for him to lose his soul? It'd be really hard for that to accidentally happen. I don't think Buffy/Angel are that much slaves to passion that they'd sleep together again. (unless of course it's destiny sex in s8..lol)

 

[BibliophileAnn]

Revealations - Interesting Facts

Don't they kinda have to sleep together for him to lose his soul? It'd be really hard for that to accidentally happen. I don't think Buffy/Angel are that much slaves to passion that they'd sleep together again. (unless of course it's destiny sex in s8..lol)

Yes they do. I think they can still kiss and it doesn't cause Angel to lose his soul. I brought the kiss up that Xander witnessed in Revealations to point that Xander, Willow, Oz, Cordelia, and Giles were over-reacting to them kissing. lol :biggrin3:

 

[sosa lola]

Don't they kinda have to sleep together for him to lose his soul?

No. It says a moment of true happiness. And that doesn't have to be sex. Though I think Angel only reaches his true happiness during sex. Heh.

I think Giles is as justified in his anger as Buffy for hiding Angel. Giles lost his girlfriend, knew about it in the worst most disgusting way possible, been tortured for hours, had to deal with Buffy running away, didn't know if she were alive or dead for a whole three months, was blamed for that by her mother... he also suffered a lot.

 

[Icarium]

No. It says a moment of true happiness. And that doesn't have to be sex. Though I think Angel only reaches his true happiness during sex. Heh.

Actually even in S2 the soul-loss didn't happen during sex, it happened afterwards. But much more importantly, just because one time true happiness was sex or post-sex cuddling or whatever doesn't mean that nothing but a repetition of it can possibly activate the curse. Thinking liek that is a logical fallacy.

I don't think at all she would have immediately killed him, either. But I do believe she would have tried to get him his soul back before anything bad happened. But, if it came down to it, I don't think she would take so long, like she did last time, because like I said she was vulnerable before.

Fair enough but even if it takes long enough for Angel to kill "just a few people", it's still a very big risk. That's why I find Buffy saying that she wouldn't put her friends in any danger a load of bullshit. Not staking Angel is already dangerous enough, kissing him is pretty much begging for something bad to happen.

Either way, I do think Buffy would've handled it better the second time. Yeah, she doesn't have a soul detector, but I think she would be able to tell that it wasn't really Angel.

She didn't manage to do it with Anya with Entropy and Anya's the worst liar in the world. 🙂 Also, if the loss of soul happens while Angel is not around Buffy, he probably would be smart enough to get rid of Willow and Giles before meeting Buffy, so whatever detector skills Buffy they won't do her much good.

 

[Vengeance]

Fair enough but even if it takes long enough for Angel to kill "just a few people", it's still a very big risk. That's why I find Buffy saying that she wouldn't put her friends in any danger a load of bullshit. Not staking Angel is already dangerous enough, kissing him is pretty much begging for something bad to happen.

I don't see why that is. Unless he experiences true happiness he's not going to lose his soul. Later in the season they do get together romantically and nobody has a problem with it.