Reversing The Order Of Appearence

[white avenger]

I disagree because Buffy didn't fall in love with the description of Angel, she fell in love with him, who he was as a person. Saying Buffy would fall in love with any tortured vampire type that came along is seriously doing a disservice to her as a character.

Buffy fell in love with a handsome, mysterious,older man who treated her like an adult instead of the adolescent that she was. She didn't know any more about his personality at that time, than she did that he was a vampire, soul or no soul. If Spike were given that same grace period, I believe that she would have felt almost the same way about him as she did Angel by then.

 

[Kean]

Buffy fell in love with a handsome, mysterious,older man who treated her like an adult instead of the adolescent that she was. She didn't know any more about his personality at that time, than she did that he was a vampire, soul or no soul. If Spike were given that same grace period, I believe that she would have felt almost the same way about him as she did Angel by then.

Buffy never fell in love with chipped Spike, so let him have that grace period, heck, let him have some grace decades with her, Buffy still isn't going to fall in love with what amounts to a soulless demon, even if he is neuterd.

 

[xaphania]

I think Angelus formed most of Buffy's opinions about soulless demons - who knows whether without that in her past, she would have had the same prejudices against them.

In this theoretical role-reversal she might more readily have accepted Spike (once she got to know him) because she wouldn't have the Angelus experience behind her.

Not sure if I'm getting across what I want to. :/

 

[Kean]

Wishing Oceans agrees: why won't she, exactly?

She didn't do it in the two years of the show when he was chipped I see no reason why she would given a longer period of time. Countless times she said she couldn't love him because he is a demon, without conscience and without a genuine moral back bone.

 

[Eleftheria]

Buffy fell in love with Angel as a person, I agree with Kean. After she found out she was a vampire she was already in love, but then she could explore his personality better. She found out that it was his choice not to bite humans, and to redeem himself.He had a soul so the demon was well hidden and came out only when Angel was fighting. Angel isn't and never will be evil.

Spike even with the chip, even when he started feeling for the Slayer, he still would want to kill her or harm her in some way.Then he got obsessed. He enjoyed both physical love, and pain.

Angel never wanted to hurt Buffy.EVER.He fell in love with the schoolgirl walking down the stairs in her high school. I have no idea what he saw in her; hope, honesty, beauty,whatever. But still...Angel fell in love with Buffy the person, not just the Slayer.

 

[Lyri]

Buffy fell in love with a handsome, mysterious,older man who treated her like an adult instead of the adolescent that she was. She didn't know any more about his personality at that time, than she did that he was a vampire, soul or no soul. If Spike were given that same grace period, I believe that she would have felt almost the same way about him as she did Angel by then.

Yes, but let's be honest here, Spike was a douche. He didn't CARE about Buffy in S4, and, to be honest, in this scenario, THAT'S the Spike we're gonna see. He has nothing to base his feelings on other than Buffy is a Slayer and he is a master vampire who has killed two Slayers in the past, and therefore he would probably feel a bit pissed off that he can't physically hurt Buffy, and he has to work beside her.

Although, if I being perfectly honest, I know Spike never met The Master, and he probably got all his information about him from Angelus, but I don't really see WHY he would want to team up with Buffy to stop The Harvest or any other event. I think he would be more likely to stand back and watch...and mock...and laugh.

 

[white avenger]

Spike even with the chip, even when he started feeling for the Slayer, he still would want to kill her or harm her in some way.Then he got obsessed. He enjoyed both physical love, and pain.

Angel never wanted to hurt Buffy.EVER.He fell in love with the schoolgirl walking down the stairs in her high school. I have no idea what he saw in her; hope, honesty, beauty,whatever. But still...Angel fell in love with Buffy the person, not just the Slayer.

My opening statement included the conditions that "for whatever reasons, Spike formed an alliance with the Slayer. Alliance cancels out betrayal and desire to kill her. Also, Angel, having never been approached by Whistler, therefore never having seen Buffy, remains what he was before ever laying eyes on Buffy. That means that he is either a brooding recluse, or a rat eating alley dweller.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I am absolutely shocked, and a little speechless how unaware people can be!

Lets just take a moment to look at this, On the one hand you may have THE most annoying, self centered blond guy to ever walk the planet, showing no respect for anyone and annoying everyone whenever he shows up.

I will give you the fact that he is entertaining to watch in that really annoying way, and fine, I will admit it, obviously she has feelings for him, even though he has no soul, but seriously how do people not know who Spencer Pratt is???

Like seriously! You must have heard of his crazyness somewhere!!

😉

My opening statement included the conditions that "for whatever reasons, Spike formed an alliance with the Slayer. Alliance cancels out betrayal and desire to kill her. Also, Angel, having never been approached by Whistler, therefore never having seen Buffy, remains what he was before ever laying eyes on Buffy. That means that he is either a brooding recluse, or a rat eating alley dweller.

Erm, no they had an alliance in S4 and he still kept his desire to kill her, he then went onto try and rape her in S7, so alliance ain't that powerful.

I think this would have been really interesting to see, and I think she would have ended up with Angel.

The way I'd see it, she'd be with Spike, but something wouldn't be 100% becasue he doesn't have a soul, Angel comes to town, he's obviously not mentally there, Buffy would try and help him. Spike would get jealous of him, being that he actually has the capacity to love, he's jealousy would get annoying to Buffy and she would turn away from Spike and into the arms of Angel.
Spike would either go evil (like Angel in S2) or he would go on his own mission to get a soul.

 

[ubi4soft]

Erm, no they had an alliance in S4 and he still kept his desire to kill her, he then went onto try and rape her in S7, so alliance ain't that powerful.

Guess you're watching something else and that's why anything you say doesn't make sense.

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

Actually, what I said was that Angel would be what he would have been without ever having met Buffy, because Whistler never met him. That means that he would be either a brooding recluse or a rat eating alley dweller in possession of a soul.

I think I'm confused.

You're proposing we imagine what would have happened if Buffy had met Spike before she met Angel, right? But...Spike was in this Chipped!Phase?

 

[Wishing Oceans]

Lets just take a moment to look at this, On the one hand you may have THE most annoying, self centered blond guy to ever walk the planet, showing no respect for anyone and annoying everyone whenever he shows up.

I'm SO confused! 😀 Spike, self- centered? Sure, he wasn't too keen on being best buds with his SWORN ENEMIES, but with his family and Dru he was the most selfless person ever! He would've done anything for her. 🙂

Erm, no they had an alliance in S4 and he still kept his desire to kill her, he then went onto try and rape her in S7, so alliance ain't that powerful.

Trying to rape her in S7? What show are you watching? 😉 He tried to rape her in S6, but that's a WHOLE different topic that we could debate 'til the end of time. 😀

The way I'd see it, she'd be with Spike, but something wouldn't be 100% because he doesn't have a soul, Angel comes to town, he's obviously not mentally there, Buffy would try and help him. Spike would get jealous of him, being that he actually has the capacity to love, he's jealousy would get annoying to Buffy and she would turn away from Spike and into the arms of Angel. Spike would either go evil (like Angel in S2) or he would go on his own mission to get a soul.

Angel? The homeless rat eater in alleys? Somehow I don't think Buffy would do anything to help him. 😀 Besides, Spike and Buffy wouldn't jump into a relationship that quick, Spike would think of her as just a 'lil girl, like Dawn. So, if Angel DID for some reason make his presence known, get Buffy to help him, and then somewhere along the way they fall in love... Spike would be there on the sidelines making sarcastic comments, like in Pirates of the Caribbean. 😀 Pretty soon something makes Angel leave his teenage girlfriend, maybe losing his soul? Spike either kills him or finds a way to restore his soul and get rid of him, Buffy goes through a few more bf's, Spike realizes he's in love with her, later on Buffy realizes that Spike's the one who's always just been there for her, yada yada yada...

Second thought it does sound a lot like the actual path of Btvs. 😀

... Oh yeah! If Angel never met Buffy, then Darla would still be alive! I definitely sense some Dangel here... If he loses his soul then he can go off and get back with Darla, and if he just leaves then Darla can come back, re-ensouled. Or Darla could just randomly appear shortly after Angel does and convince him to turn to the Dark Side...

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I'm SO confused! 😀 Spike, self- centered? Sure, he wasn't too keen on being best buds with his SWORN ENEMIES, but with his family and Dru he was the most selfless person ever! He would've done anything for her. 🙂

lmao, that bit was about Spencer Pratt, but funny how you drew that connection! 😛

Trying to rape her in S7? What show are you watching? 😉 He tried to rape her in S6, but that's a WHOLE different topic that we could debate 'til the end of time. 😀

Sorry don't know how that was a 7, was suposed to be a 6. Can be discussed till the end of time, but either way he tried to force himself on her.

Angel? The homeless rat eater in alleys? Somehow I don't think Buffy would do anything to help him. 😀 Besides, Spike and Buffy wouldn't jump into a relationship that quick, Spike would think of her as just a 'lil girl, like Dawn. So, if Angel DID for some reason make his presence known, get Buffy to help him, and then somewhere along the way they fall in love... Spike would be there on the sidelines making sarcastic comments, like in Pirates of the Caribbean. 😀 Pretty soon something makes Angel leave his teenage girlfriend, maybe losing his soul? Spike either kills him or finds a way to restore his soul and get rid of him, Buffy goes through a few more bf's, Spike realizes he's in love with her, later on Buffy realizes that Spike's the one who's always just been there for her, yada yada yada...

Second thought it does sound a lot like the actual path of Btvs. 😀

... Oh yeah! If Angel never met Buffy, then Darla would still be alive! I definitely sense some Dangel here... If he loses his soul then he can go off and get back with Darla, and if he just leaves then Darla can come back, re-ensouled. Or Darla could just randomly appear shortly after Angel does and convince him to turn to the Dark Side...

But the point WA put forward was reversing the roles they met and in his hypothetical scenario, a chipped Spike meets Buffy, and they go from friend to lovers, then in hypothetical season 2 Angel comes in.

And if you think Buffy wouldn't help Angel with a soul (even if he eats rats) you know nothing about the character, she even helped crazy Spike, there would be no reason to not help crazy Angel.

Even following the nature of the show, if Buffy's with Spike in Hypo-Season 1, the entire point of bringing in Hypo-Crazy-Angel in Hypo-Season 2 would be to break them apart. So I totally think it would happen my way.

Buffy would go down the path of not being able to love Spike 100% becasue all he has is a chip, whereas Angel has the soul.

 

[Wishing Oceans]

lmao, that bit was about Spencer Pratt, but funny how you drew that connection! 😛

Haha oops, I guess the blond hair thing led me on... 😀

Sorry don't know how that was a 7, was suposed to be a 6. Can be discussed till the end of time, but either way he tried to force himself on her.

Yeah, I figured. 🙂

But the point WA put forward was reversing the roles they met and in his hypothetical scenario, a chipped Spike meets Buffy, and they go from friend to lovers, then in hypothetical season 2 Angel comes in.

True, and who knows, maybe then Buffy and Angel would end up together. But IMO that world sounds very boring. 😀

And if you think Buffy wouldn't help Angel with a soul (even if he eats rats) you know nothing about the character, she even helped crazy Spike, there would be no reason to not help crazy Angel.

Buffy grew up a LOT over the course of the show. Early Buffy was nothing short of a ditsy, preppy, obnoxious, cheerleader. 😀 Sure, after a couple years she became less self- involved and more of a helpful community person, but in the beginning she was more for shunning vamps and her calling, and wouldn't have sympathized with Angel. But that's just how I see it. 🙂

Even following the nature of the show, if Buffy's with Spike in Hypo-Season 1, the entire point of bringing in Hypo-Crazy-Angel in Hypo-Season 2 would be to break them apart. So I totally think it would happen my way.

Not necessarily. Having a new guy doesn't mean that the main 'ship's gonna break up. Like, what if this different world Buffy is actually bi? Then would any GIRL who appeared be able to break them up? They MAY just all become friends, Buffy and Spike falling farther into love than other. Or maybe Angel, in a moment of blind passion (or anger, or something) might bite Buffy and have to turn her. It's anybody's guess. 😀

Buffy would go down the path of not being able to love Spike 100% becasue all he has is a chip, whereas Angel has the soul.

I don't think it's beyond Buffy to love someone without a soul. She still loved Angel when he lost his soul. A soul doesn't affect anyone's ability to love, IMO. 😀

 

[BuffyElevated]

I have no idea if I'd still feel the same way about the relationships if the roles were reversed and Spike was the one we met first. Part of the main reason I love each ship is because of the character and how those actors played them. By the time Spike came along, I was already so thoroughly convinced that no one could be better for Buffy than Angel, that I never really accepted their relationship til S7. I love both of the ships for different reasons, so I really can't say if Spike had come along first that I would love him with Buffy as much as I love Angel and Buffy together.