School Shooting in Connecticut

[BuffyElevated]

For those who haven't seen this on the news:

December 14th, 2012
01:47 PM ET
Children and adults gunned down in Connecticut school massacre

There's been a mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut
We're told there are 18-20 children who have been killed, with a death toll close to 30
Law enforcement tells CNN suspect is named Ryan Lanza
Below are the latest updates as they come to us or you can read our story of the Connecticut school shooting

[Updated at 2:11 p.m. ET] CNN's Susan Candiotti has just reported that a law enforcement official tells her the suspect is named Ryan Lanza and he is in his 20s.

[Updated at 2:09 p.m. ET] We're hearing even more devastating news out of Newtown, Connecticut. CNN's Susan Candiotti has been told that 18 to 20 of the dead are children.

[Updated at 2:07 p.m. ET] CNN's Jessica Yellin is reporting that we're likely to hear from President Obama today on the school shooting, according to a senior administration official. We don't know when or where we may hear from President Obama.

[Updated at 2:04 p.m. ET] Lisa Procaccini, the parent of an 8-year-old at the school, tells CNN that her daughter said school officials kept her calm during the shooting and told her the loud noise was hammering going on.

Eventually police came in and let her daughter and her teacher leave the school building.

"I'm even kind of numb about what's going on," she told CNN's Wolf Blitzer. "I'm in a state of shock. I don't know how Im going to handle having [my daughter] know ... about the whole situation.""I

[Updated at 1:57 p.m. ET] The death toll is closer to 30 than 20, a federal law enforcement source in Washington told CNN's John King. Most of those killed are children, the source said.

The source also said the suspected gunman, who is dead, had a connection to the school. He would not elaborate on that connection. The source is in touch with authorities on the scene.

[Updated at 1:53 p.m. ET] Congresswoman-elect Elizabeth Esty, who was recently won a seat representing a district that includes Newtown, Connecticut, just released the following statement on the tragedy:

As a mother, I can only begin to imagine what the students, parents, teachers and staff of Sandy Hook Elementary must be experiencing. My thoughts and prayers go out to everyone impacted by this horrific tragedy. While details are still emerging, I hope for the safety and well being of the children, teachers and staff at Sandy Hook Elementary and for the Newtown community.

[Updated at 1:51 p.m. ET] We have just learned that the suspected shooter is 20-years-old, a law enforcement source with knowledge of the investigation tells CNN's Susan Candiotti.

[Updated at 1:47 p.m. ET] A few more details from the White House press briefing earlier. White House spokesman Jay Carney said while today is not the day to debate gun policy, an assault weapons ban "does remain a commitment" of President Obama.

[Updated at 1:45 p.m. ET] We are now learning that a male is being questioned by investigators, but he is not being called a suspect, CNN's Susan Candiotti reports.

[Updated at 1:42 p.m. ET] Connecticut State Police Lt. Paul Vance said the shooter is dead inside the school. Vance said there are a number of fatalities that includes both children and adults. He did not add more details about how many people were killed during the school shooting.

[Updated at 1:41 p.m. ET] Police have now begun their briefing on the shooting.

[Updated at 1:32 p.m. ET] We're hearing more from the scene of the massacre through tweets and interviews.

[Updated at 1:23 p.m. ET] President Obama has spoken to FBI Director Robert Mueller and Connecticut Gov. Dan Malloy to get the latest information and express his condolences, White House spokesman Jay Carney said.

[Updated at 1:21 p.m. ET] We're now hearing that it may be a while for the briefing from the police.

Source: http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/14/shooting-reported-at-connecticut-elementary-school/

You can click the source link to see more updates about the situation.

This absolutely breaks my heart. As a parent of two elementary school aged children, this literally makes me sick to my stomach to think that someone would walk into a school filled with innocent little children and do this. Anytime a school shooting takes place, it's a tragedy, but especially when you take into account the ages of these little ones, this is absolutely horrific.

 

[Robb Stark]

I read about this on Yahoo News about five minutes ago.

Honestly, it's just shocking. Beyond shocking. I'm sitting here and my hand is shaking as I'm typing this. Like [MENTION=8356]HisMrs[/MENTION] said, I'm just absolutely sick to my stomach to think that something like this has happened. Terrible doesn't even begin to describe it. To think not only of the children but the parents, at work or at home, who must have heard the news that their child's school was being shot up, that would just be the end of the world. I can't even begin to think of how someone could rationalize this.

All I can say is I'm sorry. I'm just so sorry.

 

[Jodast]

My heartfelt thoughts and prayers to all of those affected by this tragedy.

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

Honestly, it's sad, of course, but Americans kinda bring these things on themselves. No other developed country has to deal with as many shootings as the States, and yet the majority of people still seems to be against better gun control (as in: ban them mostly, like most other countries do). Just think about news stories like these the next time you insist on your 'right to bear arms'.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

It's horrific, devastating how young they are.

It does seem about time America changes it's laws on gun control, it's so outta hand now it's beyond a joke.

 

[Robb Stark]

Honestly, it's sad, of course, but Americans kinda bring these things on themselves. No other developed country has to deal with as many shootings as the States, and yet the majority of people still seems to be against better gun control (as in: ban them mostly, like most other countries do). Just think about news stories like these the next time you insist on your 'right to bear arms'.

I by no means endorse lax gun laws, and I'm very firmly in the "gun control" camp, but to say that Americans bring this on themselves is, frankly, absurd. No one expects or wants something like this. It's the work of someone truly insane, or truly evil, and the vast majority of gun violence in the United States is committed by illegally obtained weapons. Hell, there was a gun incident at my high school in Canada, and we have strict anti-gun laws. If someone is crazy or evil enough to do something like this, they'll find a way to do it, laws be damned.

So as both an American and a Canadian, I can not, and will not, take any sort of responsibility for anything people like this do. And I would expect most people feel that way.

 

[BuffyElevated]

Honestly, it's sad, of course, but Americans kinda bring these things on themselves. No other developed country has to deal with as many shootings as the States, and yet the majority of people still seems to be against better gun control (as in: ban them mostly, like most other countries do). Just think about news stories like these the next time you insist on your 'right to bear arms'.

That is an unfair statement. Shame on you. No one brings this kind of violence on themselves, especially innocent children!! If you truly believe that these kids brought this on themselves because of our country's gun laws, you have serious problems. Evil happens all over the world... It's no one's fault but the person who pulled that trigger.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

the vast majority of gun violence in the United States is committed by illegally obtained weapons.

That may be the case in minor crimes, but I heard them discussing on the news today, that the majority of these shootings have been with legally obtained guns, not illegally obtained guns.

 

[BuffyElevated]

Guns do not kill people. People kill people.

If someone has it in their mind that they want to shoot people, they are going to find a way to get their hands on a gun, no matter how. They can try to obtain it through legal means, or they can do it illegally, such as buying one "under the table" or even stealing it. To blame events like these on gun laws is not right.

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

I by no means endorse lax gun laws, and I'm very firmly in the "gun control" camp, but to say that Americans bring this on themselves is, frankly, absurd. No one expects or wants something like this. It's the work of someone truly insane, or truly evil, and the vast majority of gun violence in the United States is committed by illegally obtained weapons. Hell, there was a gun incident at my high school in Canada, and we have strict anti-gun laws. If someone is crazy or evil enough to do something like this, they'll find a way to do it, laws be damned.

So as both an American and a Canadian, I can not, and will not, take any sort of responsibility for anything people like this do. And I would expect most people feel that way.

Even if it's illegaly obtained weapons (which is NOT always the case...wasn't the one responsible for that Batman shooting legally carrying his weapon, for example), I'd ask myself why it seems to be so easy to illegaly obtain weapons...the obvious answer is because they're everywhere. Here in Europe, I don't know a single person who'd have a gun.

Check out these statistics: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list

Look at the total number of homicides committed by gun violence for the States, and note how the number seems to be in league with some of the most dangerous countries in in the world. Now check the rates for other developed countries, such as Japan or European Union countries.

Of course you don't have to take responsibilty,that's your opinon, but my opinion is that all people who do not support gun control do share some (of couse not all!) responsiblity.
Especially those people that still cling to the long outdated amend. It's your right to bear arms? Tell that to the 9146 gun fatalities in the US a year, I'm sure they're really happy you're still asserting your right.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I understand that if someone wants to kill someone they can, but the gun laws is a huge part of it, easier access to guns make it more likely to happen.

It is pretty widely publicised that the rates of things like school shootings are higher in the US, then somewhere like the UK, because access to them isn't as easy - gun law is a massive factor in the situation.

 

[BuffyElevated]

Tueuse de Vampires disagrees: not the children, but probably their parents who have guns at home. Wasn't the shooter actually a student's father?

No. His mother was a teacher at the school.
I'd love to see you tell one of these grieving parents that it's their fault (if they own a gun) that their child is dead. That kind of mentality is absolute ignorance.

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

Guns do not kill people. People kill people.

If someone has it in their mind that they want to shoot people, they are going to find a way to get their hands on a gun, no matter how. They can try to obtain it through legal means, or they can do it illegally, such as buying one "under the table" or even stealing it. To blame events like these on gun laws is not right.

I really hate that stereotypial "Guns do not kill people, people kill people." . Well sure, but there's making it easy for people. It is just a fact that in countries where guns are more readily available, there is more gun violence.

It's also kinda funny, in an ironic way, how the US is against countries like North Korea having atomic weapons. I thought weapons don't kill people, people kill people? It's so funny because it's really the same thing. Actually, the chances of North Korea actually using these weapons is a lot smaller (based on the serious repercussions they as a country would experience, with the entire world basically going at the then) than some normal average American having a moment of blind range and just getting out the gun once.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I really hate that stereotypial "Guns do not kill people, people kill people." . Well sure, but there's making it easy for people. It is just a fact that in countries where guns are more readily available, there is more gun violence.

It's also kinda funny, in an ironic way, how the US is against countries like North Korea having atomic weapons. I thought weapons don't kill people, people kill people? It's so funny because it's really the same thing. Actually, the chances of North Korea actually using these weapons is a lot smaller (based on the serious repercussions they as a country would experience, with the entire world basically going at the then) than some normal average American having a moment of blind range and just getting out the gun once.

It's not the same thing at all. If North Korea decided to unleash those atomic weapons, people would be pissed at North Korea's leaders, who are the PEOPLE who used them. It still comes down to people using a weapon to harm others. It's not the weapon's fault; it's the person who uses the weapon who needs to take the blame.
And an atomic weapon can do a hell of a lot more damage than a gun. Just sayin.

 

[Kean]

It still comes down to people using a weapon to harm others.

Exactly. Which is exactly why most of the world have strict gun laws. People will do these things. Take the guns out of the equation and it becomes incredibly difficult for people to commit these types of crimes.

---------- Post added at 09:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:21 PM ----------

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFIYLimyRHU

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

It's not the same thing at all. If North Korea decided to unleash those atomic weapons, people would be pissed at North Korea's leaders, who are the PEOPLE who used them. It still comes down to people using a weapon to harm others. It's not the weapon's fault; it's the person who uses the weapon who needs to take the blame.
And an atomic weapon can do a hell of a lot more damage than a gun. Just sayin.

Just as much as a gun can do a lot more damage than just, say, a baseball bat. Also, weapons such as guns or atomic bombs have one goal only, and that's to kill, or at least severely injure. Why make it easy and just give people access, beings who are emotionally unstable and illogial at times? (even the usually sane ones sometimes!).


Also, as a psychologist, I can tell you from research,that people are just really easily influenced. Put a plate of cookies in front of them? More likely to overeat, even when dieting. Make a room smell like cleaning detergent? People more likely to clean up after themselves. Those are real studies. There's thousands of studies about how easily people can be manipulated. I don't have a study on gun violence at hand, but I'm pretty damn sure the same mechanism applies: just having a gun makes people a lot more prone to actually using it, just like with having a plate of cookies sit in front of you.

 

[ILLYRIAN]

I used to be firmly in the gun control camp, but of late I'm not so sure. I was trying to find another country to compare it with, unsuccessfully. Unless you include the Taliban view of girls being allowed in schools.
Even in the south of Ireland and Eire, when the IRA was at its most active, and a heck of a lot of people had guns. From the viewpoint of Catholic verses Protestant, how many kids schools were targeted?
Sure, you can take all the guns of the streets in America. But I don't think that is the answer, mind you, it won't hurt.
To those who say it isn't the guns that pull the trigger it is the people. I think you might be right, so some sort of teaching all Americans is needed.

 

[BuffyElevated]

There was also an attack in China where a man stabbed 22 kids to death. He used a knife, not a gun... My point is that if people want to commit an evil act, they will use whatever they can to hurt others and commit that evil. Laws are not going to change that.

This should NOT be turned into an argument over gun laws, though. My point in posting this was to share my condolences with the victims and their families. This should not have turned so ugly. People need to put their political beliefs aside and have some heart for the families who are going through this horrible time.

 

[Kean]

There was also an attack in China where a man stabbed 22 kids to death. He used a knife, not a gun... My point is that if people want to commit an evil act, they will use whatever they can to hurt others and commit that evil. Laws are not going to change that.

No, people will still be people and do appalling things. But do we have to make it so bloody easy for them do it?

People need to put their political beliefs aside and have some heart for the families who are going through this horrible time.

Personally, I think people should be (and are) expressing their sympathy and horror at today's events but also expressing their desire to see change happen so that in a week/month/year there isn't another day like today. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

 

[EVIL UU]

Tell me Americans, is your government doing anything to prevent those massacres? Federal or state? It's a pattern that keeps repeating itself, a shooting takes place, everybody is sorry for like two days tops, next month another shooting takes place ( average is 20/year ) and nothing changes.

Your society obviously has a problem with violence, is anything being done to solve that problem?

Americans shooting each other? It's not news, it's their lifestyle, a cultural thing, you know.

A friend of mine once said. I want to disagree with him but then I take a look at the raw data and it's like, I don't know anymore. What's the cause of all this violence?