Slave labor and Nazi ties

[Skanky Vamp]

Since it was announced that
"The family that owns well-known consumer brands like Krispy Kreme doughnuts, Keurig, Dr. Pepper and Panera Bread say their Nazi ancestors used slave labor during World War II. The Reimann family, which owns the controlling stake in JAB Holdings and is reportedly one of the richest families in Germany, will donate €10 million, or $11 million, to a yet-undisclosed charity after a three-year investigation that it commissioned discovered details of their ancestors' behavior.

A family spokesperson said Albert Reimann Sr., who died in 1954, and Albert Reimann Jr., who died in 1984, used Russian civilian prisoners and French prisoners of war as forced labor in their factories during the war, and that they were anti-Semites and avowed supporters of Adolf Hitler.

The investigation also found that Reimann Sr. donated to Hitler's paramilitary SS force as early as 1931. Investigators also found a letter from Reimann Jr. to a local mayor complaining that the French prisoners of war weren't working hard enough and should be in prison."

does it affect how you view their corporate brands?

 

[white avenger]

I still drink Dr Pepper and eat Krispy Kreme Doughnuts whenever my wife isn't around to give me a hard time about excessive sugar. Nothing that happened two generations ago effects my judgement or tweeks my conscience to do so. If the current family used slave labor, that would make a difference, but, since that isn't the case, I see no reason to boycott these products.

I live in Georgia, and some of my ancestors almost certainly owned slaves. I have a Great Great Grandfather who died in a Union prison camp rather than swear allegiance to the United States after the Civil War ended. I'm pretty sure that my Grandfather was a Klan member. At the end of the day, the truth is, they were them, and I am me. I don't own slaves, I'm not a member of the Klan, and I am a U S Navy veteran. I am neither a racist nor a sexist. And I have no intention of apologizing for what those people did, because I had nothing to do with it, and I don't feel any desire or duty to make restitution to the descendants of people my ancestors might have offended.

I'm what you might call an ornery old man.

 

[thrasherpix]

I'm more concerned with their behavior today than I am with what they did long before I was born. I could think of the horrid things many business tycoons and big name corporations did in the early 20th century, including child exploitation as well as hiring armed thugs (and the government) to strike at unions and the like as well as countless other horrible practices (just as they do today if they can get away with it).

How do you feel that Japanese war criminals remained in power (unlike the Nazis) and somewhat whitewashed so the US could have another Cold War ally against the Soviet Union? (Personally I think MacArthur did the right thing for the wrong reasons, but I understand why plenty in that part of the world are less than pleased, and I'd have been bitterly opposed to it if I were alive at the time when it happened having no idea how well it would work out.) If I can overlook that, and acknowledge that Japan is a very different nation today than it was in WW2, then I can surely overlook a corporation from the same time that used the system as they all would, and would today if they could.

ETA: the Lutheran Church back then were still anti-Semitic and anti-Catholic (as Martin Luther was), and this was a major factor that allowed the Nazis to do what they did given their social influence in Germany. But the Lutheran church, at least most of them, aren't like that today, and I'm not going to hold that history against them. Same for many other denominations and Christianity itself despite its own horrid past, as those Christians back then don't define Christians today.

 

[November]

If we are judging all things by outdated behaviours, the governments of the world are probably the worst offenders. But we still obey their laws.

The brands mentioned are not brands I consume anyway. Dr Pepper is foul. I don't think krispy kreme got to this side of Oz until the 7/11's started popping up. Man, I hate 7/11, seriously one of the things that drove me out of the city! Wasn't cos of their ancestors though, was cos of their obnoxious shops. I dread the day they discover rural towns 🙁

 

[Ethan Reigns]

The world doesn't care and certainly does not favour reparations for sins committed by those long dead except in some liberal arts classes that act like Willow in "Pangs". Prescott Bush (George H W Bush's father) was trading with the Germans well into WWII but no one, not even the Anti-Defamation League, ever said a word against him. As far as soft drinks are concerned, no one tries to get Fanta Orange off the shelves and it was originated in wartime Germany when the supply of ingredients for Coca Cola was shut off in 1940.

And has anyone forgotten the Volkswagen? People have been buying them in droves since 1949. Indeed, the reputation for German quality came from Nazi Germany - they made 100,000 engines for Messerschmitts and even today, it is difficult to hold the tolerances required for that engine.

 

[thetopher]

Doesn't matter. What your family history is about can inform something about you as a person but it has nothing to do with anyone else.

Still, given the sensitive nature of that period of history I think its nice that the company is making a financial contribution. Nice (and savvy in the business sense) but not in any way necessary. Demands for reparations nowadays tends to be nothing but weaponized victim-hood.
And given today's standards I wouldn't be surprised if somebody demanded that they apologize to France.

 

[Buffy Summers]

I'm not usually bothered by stuff like this, but I still won't use Bayer aspirin because they developed it by testing on people in concentration camps. Do I think the Reimann's needed to make reparations? No. Do I think it's a good thing they are doing it? Yes.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I'm not usually bothered by stuff like this, but I still won't use Bayer aspirin because they developed it by testing on people in concentration camps.

But is it really that much different when you are using prisoners of war as forced labor and then complaining they aren't working enough and withholding food? Just wondering where the line is drawn.

Also at what age does the past become acceptable. If these actions were 20 years ago would they be dismissed as in the past?

 

[Ethan Reigns]

I'm not usually bothered by stuff like this, but I still won't use Bayer aspirin because they developed it by testing on people in concentration camps. Do I think the Reimann's needed to make reparations? No. Do I think it's a good thing they are doing it? Yes.

Bayer started selling aspirin in 1899. I don't know of any concentration camps back then. The Nazis may have experimented with aspirin during WWII but it existed long before that.

I agree that the Reimann family did not need to make reparations but it appears to me to be more of a public relations decision than a good thing they are doing. I don't go along with the victimhood politics that is endorsed in many liberal arts universities. Other German manufacturers have not done the same - Volkswagen was not only a German brand, it was initiated by Adolph Hitler himself yet the company has never attempted to pay any reparations. I have a number of German radios in my collection whose manufacturers have never made any reparations. And a lot of people in Israel drive Mercedes Benz cars and Mercedes has never made any reparations. But it might be cheaper to put out a news release offering reparations than to buy the same amount of advertising coverage so this may be nothing more than a publicity stunt.

 

[Buffy Summers]

Bayer started selling aspirin in 1899. I don't know of any concentration camps back then. The Nazis may have experimented with aspirin during WWII but it existed long before that.

While you were fact checking me on the date of aspirin, you could have just googled the important part of the story: Popular Pharmaceutical Company Bayer Bought Concentration Camp Victims in WWII

But is it really that much different when you are using prisoners of war as forced labor and then complaining they aren't working enough and withholding food? Just wondering where the line is drawn.

Also at what age does the past become acceptable. If these actions were 20 years ago would they be dismissed as in the past?

I wasn't saying it was different. Just that that one stuck.

 

[thrasherpix]

There was a time I thought of essentially boycotting and eschewing services that I found morally and/or ethically objectional...and that was just for modern practices. I then realized I'd have to go live in a cave, and also eschew the internet. Thankfully, I lightened up, and started living more by a secular version of the Serenity Prayer. And perhaps making what little difference I can by my volunteer work makes it unnecessary for me to find causes to tweet about to make myself feel better for not actually doing something real.