Slayer knowledge

[Skanky Vamp]

.the Council didn't want them to be used to fight, at least not yet, so they wouldn't have been able to assisst,

How do you figure they would not be able to assist. Please explain that to me. Even Kendra had knowledge that Buffy lacked. Could they not research ala Willow? Make weapons ala Xander? They were trained to fight. Sure they were not the slayer but to say they could not assist is alittle short-sighted. Even Cordy assisted. When Buffy left town, without training the gang hunted vamps, surely a trained potential with innate abilities above others, could have done a better job. I just cant understand how you can say they could not help.

 

[Lindsey McDonald]

The council didn't want the Slayer to have friends or people she could relate to though. They feared that this would make her emotional and weak. Take Kendra - she was completely without any kind of social interactions.

 

[Lyri]

I'm saying the Council didn't want them to assist. The whole basis of the show is One girl in all the world, that's what the Council believes in, that's their MO for fighting this war. Not One girl, and all the little girls training to take over from her.

And can you really see Giles, back in the early seasons, letting these girls help Buffy, knowing that one day, one of them might replace her? Knowing that these girls have the Potential to be the Slayer?

One slip, one wrong move, one stake too slow, and one girl dies...who do you think is going to get blamed for that? The Council? The girl's Watcher? No, it's going to be Giles, because it was his Slayer the girl was assisting.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

How do you figure they would not be able to assist. Please explain that to me. Even Kendra had knowledge that Buffy lacked. Could they not research ala Willow? Make weapons ala Xander? They were trained to fight. Sure they were not the slayer but to say they could not assist is alittle short-sighted. Even Cordy assisted. When Buffy left town, without training the gang hunted vamps, surely a trained potential with innate abilities above others, could have done a better job. I just cant understand how you can say they could not help.

You didn't get the premise of the show at all did you?

The Slayer wasn't supposed to have all that back up, she was supposed to be alone, save the Watcher.

Buffy was the anomoly by having friends, something The Council didn't quite understand and even checked out (see Checkpoint).

Also, why send The Slayer any potentials when they could, potentially, be the next one called?

 

[Skanky Vamp]

The whole basis of the show is One girl in all the world,

That's why I said with the introduction of the potentials, season seven ruined the premise of the show. That is exactly my point.

 

[Lyri]

The Potentials were, theoretically, introduced the S2 with Kendra, it was not something new that was brought in for S7.

 

[white avenger]

Here's another hypothetical question; If, as Buffy mentioned, without the Slayer the Watchers are just watching Masterpiece Theater, and if they had all these slayers-in-waiting, when Buffy become uncontrollable and quit the council in season three, why didnt they just element her? They proved on more than one occasion that they were less than ethical, so to remove an uncontrollable slayer for one they could control (and have trained, unlike Buffy) doesnt seem like a stretch .

In Season 3 when Buffy stopped working for the Watchers' Council, she wasn't THE Slayer. That distinction had been passed on to Kendra, and, when she died, Faith. What Buffy WAS, was the person with the powers of a Slayer, and who was doing the job of a Slayer by guarding the hellmouth. The only way that the Council could have generated themselves a new Slayer would have been to terminate FAITH, which they tried to do the next season. (Apparently by the time that they learned of Faith's switching over to the side of the bad guys, the Mayor's power and political influence was too much for them to overcome, even after his death, until she actually left the hospital.)

The only thing that killing Buffy would have accomplished in Season Season 3 would have been to assure that the Mayor's plans for his Assention would have succeeded. The Council might not have appreciated Buffy's attitude in Season 3, but they weren't stupid enough to forget that she was the one on site doing their fighting for them. It was to their advantage to see that she stayed just where she was, doing exactly what she was doing.

 

[fly on the wall]

That's why I said with the introduction of the potentials, season seven ruined the premise of the show. That is exactly my point.

I disagree.
I think the Potentials brought the premise of the show full-circle.
Buffy was an outsider...she was the one girl in all the world destined to fight evil...and she was even MORE of an outsider, from that calling, because she had friends and family who were aware of her identity and who helped her. She struggles with this - being alone, being marked different, but being stronger all the same because of the people in her life - throughout the entire series.
What the Shadowmen did was BAD. They chained the First Slayer, and every slayer to follow, to the earth. They commandeered her to fight. THEY chose the girl, her destiny, and she had to obey. Not positive stuff.
I love how in the end, Buffy's not the only one. The Slayer and the Potentials took the power back into their own hands, literally and figuratively. They were no longer puppets, or tools, or alone. And that was a good thing.
I don't think this "ruined" the premise of the show at all.

But, to the thread's original point, I agree with those saying the Council wanted the Slayer to be alone. They were following what the Shadowmen set into place: one girl is chained down to do their bidding. They wouldn't risk any Potentials being killed. I don't think they knew how many there were...for all they knew, the handful that they were aware of were the only ones, until their shelf-life ran out. Time and time again, they frowned upon Buffy's friends - civilians - helping her fight demons. These Potentials were not Slayers. They were civilians with the potential to be Slayers.

 

[ILLYRIAN]

Did anyone try to state any reason why a potentials had experience with a weapon, personally I cannot see what one has to do with the other, so Kennedy knew how to use a cross bow prior to being a slayer - that doesn't mean anything.

 

[JenniferAlice]

Did anyone try to state any reason why a potentials had experience with a weapon, personally I cannot see what one has to do with the other, so Kennedy knew how to use a cross bow prior to being a slayer - that doesn't mean anything.

I agree, that's like saying, "I have ice-cream in the refrigerator", when we all know, it should be in the freezer.

 

[Ulrikke]

Did anyone try to state any reason why a potentials had experience with a weapon, personally I cannot see what one has to do with the other, so Kennedy knew how to use a cross bow prior to being a slayer - that doesn't mean anything.

But since she was eight? Surely that's not normal (especially for a girl)? I think the logical conclusion to such a statement is that she's knew from an early point in her life that she was a potential Slayer. Or I guess at the very least that she had ties to the world of vampires and demons in some other way.
[br][/br]
Edit:
[br][/br]

I agree, that's like saying, "I have ice-cream in the refrigerator", when we all know, it should be in the freezer.

Perhaps (in fact; probably) I'm just slow, but could you please elaborate on that comparison? I do not get it. At all. 😛

 

[sk]

The only way that the Council could have generated themselves a new Slayer would have been to terminate FAITH, which they tried to do the next season. (Apparently by the time that they learned of Faith's switching over to the side of the bad guys, the Mayor's power and political influence was too much for them to overcome, even after his death, until she actually left the hospital.)

I have always wondered how they could fail to kill Faith while she was in a coma. Can't be that hard you would think.
They even had personal there watching her. Seems like a waste to have a slayer just laying there.
A bit unethical perhaps... but that doesn't seems to be much of a concern for the council in general.

The Watcher Council do things in strange (and stupid) ways though...
They really could help their slayer much more, economical if nothing else.

Not sending potentials to the slayers aid I can understand though, as many already pointed out.

Me think that they are very bound to traditions.
They do things the way it as always has been done, period.

/SK

 

[Fusions2]

I have always wondered how they could fail to kill Faith while she was in a coma. Can't be that hard you would think.
They even had personal there watching her. Seems like a waste to have a slayer just laying there.
A bit unethical perhaps... but that doesn't seems to be much of a concern for the council in general.
/SK

I always took it that they wanted Faith alive and kicking to be punished, The Council have some dark tactics like the "coming of age" test where a slayer is stripped of her powers and sent after a vampire. For the council to kill Faith in her sleep was probably not very thrilling compared to killing her whilst alive.

I liked how they introduced Potentials in season 7, although I wish there hadn't been so many. I know Joss and co wanted to show all walks of life but to have so many did take the edge of the whole slayer calling. Then it was good to see more of that side since we only had a slight mention of it from Kendra, I think the writers were looking for new ways to explore the Slayer without it getting boring or repetitive. We'd seen what happens when power corrupts e.g. Faith, we'd seen what a well trained but without emotional contact can do e.g. Kendra, and we'd seen Buffy. It was good to see Potentials who were just waiting not knowing if they'd be called, that had to be worse than just being called so suddenly.

 

[Silum]

Did anyone try to state any reason why a potentials had experience with a weapon, personally I cannot see what one has to do with the other, so Kennedy knew how to use a cross bow prior to being a slayer - that doesn't mean anything.

I believe they explicitly addressed this in Showtime. When The First (as that blonde chick whatever her name was) was talking to them all in the basement. The speech along the lines of "this doesnt make anysense... like any of this makes any sense?". The black potential brought up that this was all new to her but Vi or one of the others brought up that her watcher had shown her a blurry photograph of a vamp once. ...They all implied their different familiarity with slayerville.

Note: You'll realize my dislike of the potentials in the fact that I made an effort not to remember any of their names. And btw, Showtime was possibly the worst "potential" episode of the lot...endless "Were gonna die" "what we doing here?" "Your brought us here...why here?????" ....In the words of evil willow...."Waaaa Waaaaa... We'll all be a lot happier without having to listen to all your constant whining". I actually found myself wanting the potentials to die... egging Buffy on into more and more reckless plans!

 

[Primal Slayer]

I always took Kennedys statement of knowing how to use a cross-bow since she was 8 as someone in her family just taught her how to do it. Since we dont know that much about her except she is rich, its possible that her family could be into hunting, and Kennedy was most likely a tomboy and into all of that stuff.

The WC wouldnt want to kill Buffy during S3 since they knew it would be a mistake. Sure she quit on them but they knew that she was doing a mighty fine job of keeping the hellmouth at bay and they accepted that even if they never admitted it. Plus they still had Faith to worry about at the time and she wasnt doing that much to help out.

Kendra most likely came from a family that was into the whole mystical thing. They probably knew what a Slayer was. Someone in her family could have been a watcher or they probably told the council of Kendra themselves.

Buffy came from a fairly upper class family, she didnt fit any kind of potential mold, and the council didnt even think anything of her. Nothing is 100%.

And why would they send in an army of potentials to help Buffy out when they know that one of them could take Buffy or Faiths place had one of them died? It would just jepordize them in the long run. Dont send them into battle until they are ready and that means until they have the whole Slayer packa.ge

 

[AndrewCrossett]

Here's my understanding from the sum total of my watching of the series and reading of canonical comics and other background info:

* The Watchers aspired to identify each Potential and train her in preparation for possibly being called. But they had no universally effective way of locating Potentials. Maybe they had some way of assessing those most likely to be called? Clearly, there were more Potentials than Watchers.

* In "The Origin" comic story (which trumps the movie as the canonical version of Buffy's origin), we see Buffy being "Slayerized" (it wakes her up in the middle of the night). Shortly thereafter her watcher, Merrick, arrives and apologizes for not locating and training her sooner because there were "complications" (which I don't believe are ever spelled out in detail). So the Watchers already had Buffy pegged as a Potential (perhaps even a likely potential) before she was activated.

* It's unclear exactly when a person becomes a Potential, and when they stop being one. The baseball-playing girl in "Chosen" is identified in the script as being 12 years old, and she is AFAIK the youngest Slayer/Potential ever shown in canon. This suggests that girls are not born as Potentials... you couldn't have, say, an 18-month-old girl being activated as Slayer. One guess might be that one becomes a Potential upon reaching physical womanhood (i.e., menstruation). That age varies from girl to girl.

* It's also unclear when a Potential stops being eligible to be called as a Slayer. Kennedy was 19 or 20 when she was activated and is, I think, the oldest girl we ever saw activated. Presumably the Slayer magic wants someone in the physical prime of life.

* Kennedy grew up in a wealthy family and may have therefore had access to unusual kinds of training to fit her interests. Doesn't necessarily mean she was a Potential already at the age of 8.

* We still don't know if new Potentials are being created following the activation of all the existing ones in "Chosen." If they are, then the First Evil's plan was flawed from the beginning...killing all the Slayers and Potentials would only end the line until a new girl became a Potential and then a Slayer. But the First seemed pretty poorly informed in general (e.g., it thought Buffy's death would activate a new Slayer, which it wouldn't and, in fact, didn't when she died at the end of S5).

 

[Ulrikke]

ILLYRIAN agrees: I can only guess you had a sheltered life 'cos I knew several girls who used bows and arrows at 6 years old, more money would have meant we'd have used cross bows. And Kennedy's family was wealthy.

Sheltered? Not really, but thanks judging - that's helpful. 🙄 Really, I wasn't saying that she couldn't possibly have learned to use a crossbow without ties to "Buffy's" world. I suppose she could have been from a wealthy family into hunting etc. and she learned that way. But where I come from girls don't learn to use a crossbow at 8 - and I'm assuming the same holds true for the average American. That and the fact that Kennedy acts like she knows everything just lead me to believe that she had previous knowledge of vampires and demons.

But I guess your original point was that weapon skills didn't have to mean anything, one way or the other. And well - I agree. Just that in the case of Kennedy I always assumed she'd known she was a potential for a long time - not particularly because of the cross bow line though. But I'm no season 7 expert, so what do I know.

Wow, this got kind of long-winded. 😛

Edit: Now that I've had a chance to read AndrewCrossett's post above, I'm actually pretty convinced that Kennedy learning to use the cross bow at 8 has nothing to do with anything (although she could have parents who were demon hunters / had ties to the council / something else), since it seems unlikely that she was a potential at age 8 already (what if she got called? An 8-year-old Slayer?).

 

[disturbedvanity]

I'm not sure if I made that up for credibility reasons or I actually read it, but from 'Pretty maids all in a row' I got the impression that the Watcher's Council had a system to recognize potentials, but not every single potential. So I guess when they know a girl could be the next slayer someday they start training them, in other cases they just find out when it's 'too late'.

Is Pretty Maids canon though?
[br][/br]
Edit:
[br][/br]

Did anyone try to state any reason why a potentials had experience with a weapon, personally I cannot see what one has to do with the other, so Kennedy knew how to use a cross bow prior to being a slayer - that doesn't mean anything.

Yes, but she knew how to use it because she had been taught by her Watcher. My question was why did she even HAVE a Watcher at such a young age. Especially because she lived with her family. (her sister lived in a different wing etc.)Back to the original inquiry....why did some slayers have knowledge of their destiny and others never would have known if The First never came into play.
[br][/br]
Edit:
[br][/br]

I have always wondered how they could fail to kill Faith while she was in a coma. Can't be that hard you would think.
They even had personal there watching her. Seems like a waste to have a slayer just laying there.
A bit unethical perhaps... but that doesn't seems to be much of a concern for the council in general.


/SK

I've always considered that too. If they wanted her dead, they could have offed her while she was in the coma. But then again it would have completely changed the show.

 

[CharmedSlayer85]

My thought is it is another reason (along with spike) why Season 7 ruined the series; the premise was that here was a normal ordinary girl who one day gets a strange man knocking on her door saying she is the slayer. Though there was Kendra who said at an early age she was sent to live with her Watcher, but that was do to the family taking the "calling" seriously, therefor it was downplayed that that happened en masse, possibly as a result of her nationality. The idea that there were dozen of girls all being trained as vampire slayers for nothing, that the world never knowing of vampires or slayers as a result, as well as the isolation factor of being a Slayer ruined the entire thematic focus of the series. Buffy was never alone per se, there were always more potentials being trained with whom she could hang out. Why wasnt she ever introduced to all these potentials that were being trained? It was crap by Mr. Whedon in my opinion to give the show a big finish and negate everything that came before.

Not really even if you take into account the Buffy movie, most girls were suppose to be trained BEFORE their calling, however they had a hard time locating Buffy until it was too late. So she didn't start training until she became the slayer, and I would guess you could say the same thing about the potentials. Kendra was a potential slayer and that's why she was trained as such until her powers hit her after Buffy died.

Also on top of that I doubt Buffy could really hang out with the other potentials as you say, because most of them were scattered throughout the world, with the exception of Amanda, none of them lived in Sunnydale, and Amanda was pretty young so I doubt she'd be hanging out with Buffy.

Finally the slayer is suppose to work alone, that's what made Buffy such an anomly and also considered the greatest slayer of all time, because she did not give up her human life to only focus on slaying. Even The First Slayer criticized Buffy for this and Spike made mention of it in Season 2. "A Slayer with family and friends. That sure as hell wasn't in the bloody brochure" And it's that unit of Buffy keeping her friends and family close that have kept her alive all these years, otherwise she would have been dead and stayed dead in Season 1.

 

[wehappyfew]

i enjoy critical thinking as much as the next buffy fan but it is a story...and i just feel like authors and writers...like it's impossible for them to ruin their story....it's THEIR story. they have their reasons.

i don't think the watcher's council really care if buffy had assistance...these are the descendants of a bunch of dudes who chained a girl to the earth.

in that vein...it's like they'd want her to be alone. to minimize her power in some way...to disconnect her.
because look at sineya (the first slayer sp?)...she was all primal and fierce...complete opposite of dainty, sprightly buffy.
if that's who the watcher's want....then the slayer having assitance is going to be the least of their concerns. they want a warrior to do it alone. maybe if buffy had gotten assistance she wouldn't have been so into it? it would have been like "oh well, there's many more like me so who really cares?"
if 16 year old buffy knew there were other girls like her she wouldn't have cared about being a slayer one bit. 22 year old buffy's a little different though....well, way different.

i like the potentials...not personally but as a whole, i think what they did for the show (and now the comics) is really compelling.