Spike and his demon

[Firstina]

So, in a short sentense - where is the manifestation of a demon part in Spike after he got his soul back?

It's not like a situation with Anyanka (everyone expected the word Angel - but not yet😉) when she can be either a demon or a human. So in her human state there is no demon in her - she is mortal, fragile, she ages.

When we first see ressurected Darla even in her human form she was experiencing problems with identification of herself. She identifies herself as a demon although she doesn't have it inside of her - like kiss Lindsey or bite him. In another words she is conflicted about her nature. She wears crosses, she breakes mirrors.
In her second appearance when she is pregnant and has a soul of her unborn child inside her she is also very conflicted about everything. Demon wants to kill inocent children as it used to do. Soul, on the other hand, allows her to feel love for her child.
In both cases she has a bloodlust, demonic urges, twisted desires - everything that defines her as a demon, as a vampire.

And finally - Angel.😛
Good God, the man is a walking and talking conflict.
He despises his demon part but he knows that it's still inside of him.
He has a problem with human blood like in every season - in 1 season he is still recovering from tasting Buffy's blood, in 2 season we have Kate's blood, in 3 season it's Connor's blood. His demon urges for the fresh human blood and it's only natural because demon is a part of him. Even in 1 season of Buffy he confesses that he wants to kill her and although he doesn't drink Joyce's blood when Darla throws her to him he still wants to. After a 100 years demon is still as strong as ever Angel just controls it better now.
He can slip on every step because of his unusual state of having both a demon and a soul in a same body. A little dreams from Darla and he starts to act in a very disturbing way towards Cordy, a little happy pill -and hello Angelus!
And also Angelus works just fine as a defensive mechanism for a people around Angel but not for the man himself. Because his crew maybe can forget about it but Angelus will be always a part of Angel. He is like a bomb ready to explode every minute.

So, finally, here is a question - where the hell is Spike's demon?
Where is a bloodlust?
Where is desire to kill Slayers like he used to like?
How does he feel about the demon side of him?
Like, he had some of that when he got a chip but after the soul we got nothing. And just in theory it should be even worse than in Angel's case after removing the chip because Spike's demon was artificially supressed.
Why AI team in LA is so calm about Spike? He is like a ticking bomb. They are already experienced some of Angel's demon on themselves so why do they suddenly think that Spike is harmless?

 

[Silverspike]

He's no more a ticking bomb then Angel. His demon is part of him and he deals with it in his own way.

 

[Firstina]

He's no more a ticking bomb then Angel. His demon is part of him and he deals with it in his own way.

Yeah, that's my whole point - they are both ticking bombs. But Angel gives everybody a warning - hey people don't relax too much around me, demon is still here and it wants to rip your heads off, have a nice day.
Spike what, is so confident about himself? The last time he thought that way and people around him loosened up a little it ended up very nasty.
So, what is the difference now?

 

[Silverspike]

He has a soul and thats what reins him in. Neither Angel nor Spike were a danger to anyone imo whilst they were souled.

 

[Firstina]

He has a soul and thats what reins him in. Neither Angel nor Spike were a danger to anyone imo whilst they were souled.

But it's no fun that way😉
For me the most interesting part that a vampire with a soul is so conflicted that even the Great Big Prophecy can't tell exactly on which side he will end up.
Oh, but Angel even with soul is a huge danger, IMO. I wouldn't even allow to approach people to him when he is dark. Thank God he had Darla at his last really dark period - she can handle him. That's why I think AI team is a little bit careless and both stupid and brave sometimes. Like at least at Sunnydale they got a Slayer just in case.

 

[EVIL UU]

This is a great question. I have some ideas:

1. Every demon is a hybrid so it makes sense that it's a spectrum - you have Angelus with virtually no humanity and you have demons like Harmony and Dracula and Spike that still retain some humanity.

2. Spike is a creation of William. From the nickname, to the clothes and the attitude - it's a persona build from the ideas of badassery and coolness that fits his newfound power, similarly to Willow's Dark Willow, while Willow draws from Rack, William draws from Angelus ( You were my...Yoda! ) I don't know, it's like Spike never truly embraced his demon and kinda worked around it, pursued his own thing since day one if that makes any sense.

2. Spike had a chip - he had to learn how to deal with not living the demon lifestyle and it wasn't easy - I mean, he even wanted to stake himself that one time, right? Suddenly, he can't hang out at the demon bars with demons anymore, he has to refrain from licking the victims' blood and his own too for that matter because humans he bangs hangs out with hate that, he has to drink pig's blood, he has to scare kids to get some money for cigarettes and alcohol and so on. Spike had to adjust before he even had a soul so when he gets one the transition is easier and he already knows how to deal.

3. He drowns his urges in alcohol, nicotine, sex and violence. Spike drinks a lot, Spike smokes a lot, Spike loves beating the crap out of demons, just look at him fighting that thing in "Get It Done" - dude's high as the space station and sex, yeah, I don't have to elaborate that, right? Point is, with soul or without it, Spike revels in that shit. Also, he works out - best way of dealing with one's inner demons, can confirm.

4. Ensouled Spike does not give a shit. He's not that big with the whole guilt thing, I think that it might be a factor too.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

How does he feel about the demon side of him?

I think the difference is that Spike likes and accepts, not accepts as in deals with, but truly accepts his demonself. The demon was what made him who he is, by failing to address his demon self, it would be akin to devaluing his own position. The demon was the best thing that happened to William.

Just as the soul was the best thing that happened to Angelus. That is why the two characters are and will always be a dichotomy.

 

[The Bronze]

I can't add much more to the post from @EVIL UU which covers most of what I was thinking. One theory to add though is that William was less inclined to violence than Liam, from what we've seen anyway. We saw William looking scared of his own shadow most of the time and Liam having a ball in bar fight. Maybe that has something to do with Spike being able to keep a better handle on the demon than Angel?

 

[Ethan Reigns]

In "The Dark Age 2x08" where Eyghon starts to kill off all the Ripper-era friends of Giles, Eyghon is finally subdued by the demon inside of Angel as shown in this exchange:

Buffy: You knew that if the demon was in trouble it was gonna jump into
the nearest dead person.
Angel: I put it in danger.
Willow: And it jumped. (stands up)
Angel: (gets up) I've had a demon inside me for a couple hundred
years... (exhales) just waitin' for a good fight.

Angel doesn't seem to be at odds with his internal demon. If Angel, in all his angst about what he has done, has no problems with letting his demon take over a fight, Spike would have no problems with his demon at all. Spike has the attitude that slayer and vampire are natural enemies, that's how the game is played and he is like soldiers from opposing sides meeting up after a war and reminiscing about the bad old days.

 

[white avenger]

Something to remember about the difference between Angel and Spike as far as drinking human blood is concerned is that, as was pointed out in the original question, Angel has had to deal with tasting human blood on occasion. Spike, on the other hand, as near as I can recall, except for when he is under the First Evil's influence, made an issue about "not goin' back on the sauce," once he began being developed as one of the good guys. If we assume that Angel and Spike are both the equivalent of alcoholics, then Angel has backslid on occasion, with bad results. Probably, Spike would have had just about the same type of reactions if he had done the same as Angel. Whether by stronger will power, sheer determination, or just plain dumb luck, Spike has been able to resist the urge to fall off the wagon, at least, so far.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Spike would have had just about the same type of reactions if he had done the same as Angel.

But he did. I dont recall the episode in season 7, but wasnt that one of the reasons that he was tied up? I remember Buffy saying something like he was still hopped up (my word not hers) on human blood. I dont recall the exact line.

 

[white avenger]

I think that you're referring to when the First Evil was compelling Spike to feed on and turn those people in the basement as a trap for Buffy, which I mentioned. I'm not exactly how that would effect him, since all memory of the events were wiped from Spike's mind almost as soon as it was over, and, to remain of use to the First Evil, he couldn't be acting strangely (or, at least, no more strangely that at any other time) If there had been any hint that Spike was feeding off of humans again, Giles would have probably gotten involved in a plot to... Oh.

Well, alcoholics quite often depend on a friend to help them, encourage them, and if necessary, support them when they weaken. Maybe Buffy fulfilled that role for Spike in Season 7. Again, I don't recall Angel having that same kind of support when he fell off the wagon, so the alcoholics analogy should still hold true.

 

[Firstina]

4. Ensouled Spike does not give a shit. He's not that big with the whole guilt thing, I think that it might be a factor too.

Great theories! As for the last one - you can be absolutely indifferent to oxygen but still need it to survive. Guilt or no guilt demon has some preferences in it's "oxygen" - and it's better be the fresh blood of a virgin rather than pig's blood.

One theory to add though is that William was less inclined to violence than Liam, from what we've seen anyway. We saw William looking scared of his own shadow most of the time and Liam having a ball in bar fight. Maybe that has something to do with Spike being able to keep a better handle on the demon than Angel?

So, basically Spike didn't have a problem because he sucked at being a decent vampire?😉

Angel doesn't seem to be at odds with his internal demon. If Angel, in all his angst about what he has done, has no problems with letting his demon take over a fight, Spike would have no problems with his demon at all. Spike has the attitude that slayer and vampire are natural enemies, that's how the game is played and he is like soldiers from opposing sides meeting up after a war and reminiscing about the bad old days.

IMO, Angel demonstrates quite the opposite - he is ashamed of his vampire part as we especially see it in Pylea, feels like being judged by his friends in Sense and Sensitivity.
As for Spike - with chip he still has a full package of problems with his demon and suddenly with soul he is all okay. That's wierd from my POV.

 

[Silverspike]

To be honest I think you seeing problems with all this that just weren't there.

 

[Firstina]

Pretty opposite - I am curious about the reason why ain't there any😉

 

[Silverspike]

Because they're souled?

 

[Firstina]

And demon-ed too.
See it in Darla, I see it in Angel.
Neverending conflict - demon part vs soul part. You slip a little and demon is on a loose.
Soul wants to save an inocent victim, demon wants to kill her.
So why did Spike's demon suddenly give up on happy meals on legs so quickly?

 

[The Bronze]

So, basically Spike didn't have a problem because he sucked at being a decent vampire?😉

I'm not entirely sure what the measurements for a decent vampire are. He survived for a century and until the initiative got hold of him was having a blast. I'm just speculating that William might have a had a gentler nature than Liam and so it's easier for him to reign in the demon urges whire souled.

 

[Firstina]

My guess about measurements is at least to want killing humans and have a bloodlust because they are basically your food.
And Spike slips every single time with his chip during 4-5-6 season - he pretty much hurted everyone his demon was allowed to hurt - another demons and Buffy. That's why I am curious where is all that gone after a soul.
And about the gentle nature of William I always wondered about Dru at this occasion. Sure, she was turned being crazy and all but as a human she was a sweetest thing - so where did her desire to kill children a to torture people (at least we saw she enjoyed torturing Angel) come from? 
And by the way I am a little bit confused about the concept of a "real Spike" - just rewached Never Leave Me from 7 season.
In this episode he asked Buffy to kill him and said that she never met the "real" him - that Spike who killed and probably raped the girls Dawn's age.
And then in Destiny he said to Angel again that he never saw the "real" Spike and something about his own reflection.
First, he says that he is capable of horrible things and then he says that he did it only because Angel(us) made him a monster.
Contradiction?

 

[thetopher]

Spike is the only character in the Buffyverse where getting his soul makes him less conflicted than he was before. Unlike any other person who has darkness inside them, whether it be Angel, Faith, Giles, Wesley, Willow or even Buffy, Spike seems utterly unaffected by the presence of personal demons (whether literal or figurative).
He fights, he snarks, he smokes and shags and...that's it. No conflict, no complexity, no interest. This is to show how 'evolved' his is compared to Angel.

Add to that that both demon Spike and human Spike are in agreement on so many things; they both love Buffy, they both love violence and they both see themselves primary as victims of other people, mostly women. They are more sinned against than sinning, and a have a strong self-pitying streak.

Soulless Spike blames almost all his problems on the women in his life, his Mum, Drusilla, Buffy, etc

Soulled Spike blames being turned into a perpetual victim by his Mum (who made him weak, with overly romantic expectations) and into a monster by Angelus, who taught Spike everything he knew about being a Big Bad vampire in those 20 years or so.
Spike sees himself (accuratly in many respects) as shaped by the bigger personalities around him, so therefore he can abdicate responsibility because he's not really to blame for his actions, other people are.

And by the way I am a little bit confused about the concept of a "real Spike" - just rewached Never Leave Me from 7 season.
In this episode he asked Buffy to kill him and said that she never met the "real" him - that Spike who killed and probably raped the girls Dawn's age.
And then in Destiny he said to Angel again that he never saw the "real" Spike and something about his own reflection.

Manipulation.
Spike wants Buffy to kill him so he tells her how much of a threat he is (or possibly so she'll take pity on him by playing the tortured victim, he knew how that played thanks to Angel), with Angel it's blame. Pour all that anger that the demon part of him had towards Angelus and use it in the fight. It also plays into how Angel sees the Angelus part of himself, responsible not only for his own crimes but the crimes of his 'creations'- Drusilla, Spike, Penn, etc.
Working on Angel's self-doubt/loathing/ and guilt Spike manages to win the fight, it's the same tactic that unsoulled Spike used a few times before on Buffy (See 'Harsh Light of Day') to undermine her confidence and beat her up.