Spike leaving

[Perny]

OK I just remembered that when Spike says he should leave so the First couldn't used him as a slave, Buffy stopped him. She told him something like "She wasn't ready for him not to be there".
Why do you think she said it like that?
I have a lot of theories. Some include love, selfishness and the fear of being alone.

 

[MinwaraYana]

I think it's because she really sees he has a soul and he is the strongest warrior she has. They need the best they've got to stay and fight. Plus, she believes in him that he can win over his ghost. 🙂

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

Gosh, I think her comment was inspired by a variety of feelings on her part. Yes, he is a dear and trusted friend at this point, and I think in part she felt she needed him there for emotional support. But there's also something to be said for him as a warrior mentioned. He is their strongest fighter at that point - so realistically, it makes sense for her to keep him around for the final battle. But I got the feeling it was personal, like she wanted him to stay for her.

It's interesting too, in the context of this quote, when we take their final scene into consideration. Would you say she was ready in "Chosen" to let him go? What changed? She let him die, after all. Sure, he wanted him to leave with her, but she didn't really fight him in the end. Don't get me wrong, she knew his sacrifice was the right thing for him to do. It was neccesary for his ultimate redemption but...I argue she had accepted, and was ready and willing to lose him. You can hear the pride in her voice when she tells Giles it was Spike who saved the world, and closed the Hellmouth. She was alright with his death; but why?

I guess my question is; why wasn't she willing to give up Spike before, when he was endangering everyone around him?? What changed between "First Date" and the final episode?

 

[itsxpaperdoll]

Oh that's an easy one. Buffy wanted Spike to stay because she was in love with him, and, while she had trouble admitting to to herself, she knew it was true and that, therefore, she couldn't let Spike go just like that. She knew she wanted him to be around, to hold and comfort her when things got rough and occasionally make sweet, sweet love to her.

Seriously, though, I think that it really was about her not being ready for him to be around. I had the feeling that for once this season she wasn't thinking big picture, but just herself. I think having Spike around was of some sort of comfort to her.

 

[Mommatis]

OK I just remembered that when Spike says he should leave so the First couldn't used him as a slave, Buffy stopped him. She told him something like "She wasn't ready for him not to be there".
Why do you think she said it like that?
I have a lot of theories. Some include love, selfishness and the fear of being alone.

I think she said it like that because she wasn't ready to commit to any real feeling for him but yet she knew she needed him there for herself and not just the mission.

She really tried through out all of Season 7 to treat him as fairly as possible (always makes me think of Spike's quote from the gift where he tells her that she treats him as a man) and she knew that of all the scoobies he was the one she could always be honest with and that would always be honest back in when you are in a position of power that is a priceless.

Now the romantic in me that loves Spuffy:cheering: with a fiery passion wants to say it was because she was starting to realize that she loved him to the depth and breadth and all that but that is of course always debatable.

 

[Perny]

Now the romantic in me that loves Spuffy:cheering: with a fiery passion wants to say it was because she was starting to realize that she loved him to the depth and breadth and all that but that is of course always debatable.

Oh but I like the thought.. And I do think there could be some of it related to her finally realizing how she's feeling

 

[BillyidolwannaB]

She loves him. They way they acted and talked througout s7 proved that. But to buffy i think it was at the stage it was true love fading to a friend love, and i think spike also realized this.

 

[Mommatis]

She loves him. They way they acted and talked througout s7 proved that. But to buffy i think it was at the stage it was true love fading to a friend love, and i think spike also realized this.

IMHO True love doesn't fade... Friendship love can grow into true love but not vice versa. If it was true to begin with it can morph into other passionate feelings such as hate but friendship...::huh1::

 

[white avenger]

I have no doubt whatsoever that Buffy loved Spike, that she was IN love with him (which is an entirely different thing), she recognized that, even with the danger of the First Evil using him against her, he was still the most powerful warrior at her army, and that he was the one ally whose trust and support she could always be sure of.

But all of that can be summed up, not in even five words, but less. She...believed...in...him. She said it, she meant it, and that settled the issue. Volumes could be written attempting to analyze contributing factors, past experience, instinct, even possible Slayer dreams, but, beyond those four words, nothing really needs to be said.

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

I have no doubt whatsoever that Buffy loved Spike, that she was IN love with him (which is an entirely different thing), she recognized that, even with the danger of the First Evil using him against her, he was still the most powerful warrior at her army, and that he was the one ally whose trust and support she could always be sure of.

But all of that can be summed up, not in even five words, but less. She...believed...in...him. She said it, she meant it, and that settled the issue. Volumes could be written attempting to analyze contributing factors, past experience, instinct, even possible Slayer dreams, but, beyond those four words, nothing really needs to be said.

She believed in him yes...but why do you think it was so easy for her to let him go? To let him die? Why didn't she argue with him when he denied her 'i love you'? So many things lead me to believe she loved him yet so many other things don't. It's difficult for me. I want to believe she loved him I just don't know if she had the capacity. Sure, she really cared about him and she trusted him and consitered him a dear friend at that point...I just don't know.

Too bad she doesn't know he's alive...(*sighs)

 

[Giants Rule 04]

I don't think that she was thinking about the big fight at all when she said this. I think that Spike was one of the few people that actually understood how difficult this was for her and she had come to depend on him in a way. She had also developed feelings (not love) for him and she wasn't ready to not have him around.

 

[white avenger]

She believed in him yes...but why do you think it was so easy for her to let him go? To let him die? Why didn't she argue with him when he denied her 'i love you'? So many things lead me to believe she loved him yet so many other things don't. It's difficult for me. I want to believe she loved him I just don't know if she had the capacity. Sure, she really cared about him and she trusted him and consitered him a dear friend at that point...I just don't know.

Too bad she doesn't know he's alive...(*sighs)

Ah, yes, the old, "No you don't, but thanks for saying it" thing. Now, why WOULD someone who, when the time came, when there was no other choice than self sacrifice, not jeopardize everything that they had fought for, suffered for, in some cases even died for, accept the fact that there are times when, as Mr Spock so eloquently put it, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Or the one,"? Maybe because she had had to make that same decision just two years earlier.

Why didn't she at least stay there, when Sunnydale was falling on top of her, and debate the point with him? ("But I do, Spike, I REALLY DO. That clown Angel was just a school girl crush. You're the one, you're the ONLY one. We belong together. Our fates are intertwined. I have a job to do, building and organizing this army of new Slayers that I had Willow create through the power of my magical Slayer Scythe. WE have a job to do. The world needs you. I need you. Please, oh, please...") She barely made it out as it was, and she HAD to make it out.

Remember what Spike had told her? "You're THE ONE, Buffy...) Well, she WAS the one. The one who has caused all of those girls to be Called. It was her job to find them, organize them, train them, and lead them. If she didn't do it, who would? Faith? Giles? Willow?
How about Andrew?

The sacrifice had to be made, Spike was the one who had to make it, and it had to be made RIGHT NOW. So she left him down there in that hole to do what Angel has never been able to do. To redeem himself. His sacrifice in that moment tilted the scales far over into his favor in those last few moments, because, in voluntarily making that sacrifice, he saved every living thing on the entire planet.

Oh, and, by the way, Spike died knowing that Buffy loved him. That's what he was laughing about.

And Buffy knew that Spike's actions there had proven to the world, undeniably, that a monster could become a Champion, and a Champion deserved heaven for his labors. That's what she was smiling about.

 

[Sam The Bloody]

Also, it seems kind of funny that amongst all the other good and noble things that Spike did by sacrificing himself. He ALSO accomplished what none of the other Big Bads had been able to do... He destroyed Sunnydale.

So basically, our boy Spike lived on both sides of the fence and died the same way. He died saving the world AND destroying the town, which I think he appreciated the irony of.

Hell, if he had the chance he would have stuck a sign next to the crater, right where the "Welcome to Sunnydale" sign used to be and spray paint "Spike Was Here" so that he'd get credit for the town being gone.

 

[Tranquillity]

I think it was partly from practical resaons, he's a fighter and good to have on the team and all that and I also think it has a lot to do with unresolved feelings between the two of them but I think the biggest reason that Buffy doesn't want Spike to leave is that she feels less isolated and alone when he is around.

 

[fly on the wall]

I guess my question is; why wasn't she willing to give up Spike before, when he was endangering everyone around him?? What changed between "First Date" and the final episode?

Simply put...Buffy did. She changed a hell of a lot this season, from lone Slayer to general of a whole bunch of Slayers. She had always been the leader of sorts within her close-knit group of friends...but never before had she been a general of many. This changed her perception, it gave her a glimpse of the bigger picture. The bigger picture was, Spike had to die. She understood that by the end.

Anyways, OP...I think mostly, Buffy wanted him to stay for selfish reasons. Okay, so he was a strong fighter...but he was a dangerous murderer on a leash again at that point! I don't think she was thinking of the Potentials' safety, or the well-being of her friends or little sister...I think she wanted him there for emotional support. He was the only one who truly knew the darkest sides of her and I don't think she was willing to lose that yet. He was a dear friend, and she wasn't quite able to see the bigger picture yet.

 

[SpuffyFan4Life]

She told him "I'm not ready for you to not be here" That was the reason. He pointed out that she has a new demon fighter and she didn't care. She probably understood that he was dangerous but the way she felt about him (however unsure) was more important and she still hoped that the trigger thing would work itself out, which good thing it did, albeit in a complicated way.

 

[white avenger]

He pointed out that she has a new demon fighter and she didn't care.

That's something that I never really understood. Robin Wood and another dozen just like him couldn't come close to equaling Spike in any kind of fight, and both Spike and Buffy knew it. The "I should leave before the First uses me to hurt someone here," okay. But "Now that Robin's here, he can take up the slack when I'm gone"? No way, no day.

 

[SpuffyFan4Life]

I get that Robin couldn't pick up the slack but I don't think Buffy would lie to Spike about why she wanted him there. Maybe she wouldn't want to hurt his feelings, but she wouldn't want to lead him on either. Plus she could have made a case for that even alongside "I'm not ready for you to not be here" but she didn't.

 

[Sunnydale Siren]

just finished watching "First Date" , think that Buffy finally acknowledged her feelings for Spike.

Hence the asking him not to leave.

As for Robin Wood...

dude handles himself pretty well, but isn't quiet on par with Spike in overall combat.

The final scene confirmed my suspicions, Spike killed his mom.