Update Staff Decision

[Mesektet Ra]

You dont like what I have to say or how i say it? too damn bad. Doesnt change the fact that it is what it is.

And if you don't like that fact that I disagree with your tone and the fact that you're an adult acting like a petulant child, too damn bad. You come in here name-calling and stomping your feet and you expect me not to say anything? Got another thing coming, darlin'.

Seraphim just chooses his words carefull enough to make it SEEM as though he's not harrassing/direspecting Buffy at more than one turn but I've watched him before. he really ONLY appears around here when something involving his wife becomes an issue. the often condescending tone he takes with Buffy shows how fake and phoney HE is.

Agree to disagree. Your opinion is not fact.

Again, i really don't CARE how you view ME because you dont know me from eve and your opinion of me is about as "precious" fake pearl.

That's something we can both agree on, because I sure as hell could care less about what you think of me. And you're right, I don't know you, which makes me wonder why the hell you're getting away with acting like you are when people who can actually deal with conflict in a mature way are getting berated for it.

rest assured I was aware of what was going on and more importantly i saw the toll it was taking on Buffy who was trying to figure out the best course of action that was both proactive and FAIR all the while she was losing staff, members and PEACE OF MIND over the actions of this woman and her little clique.

I'm not doubting Buffy did what she thought was right. And to reply to BEG, Seraphim calling people 'douchebags' was wrong too, but that was one instance compared to many posts of wrong assumptions and name-calling. So I'm not agreeing with him acting the same way that once, but in my mind many posts doing that is bigger deal.

 

[Mozzymandias]

Meseket, I agree Seraphim, could have a right to ask questions about his wife but. But he only comes on here to defend her, how can someone who's absent from the boards turn up after she's banned, asking for the information, if he wanted the information he should have been here all along to see it for himself.

Just going to point out that if that is the route to be taken about how people only appear at certain times defending person/s then is it ok for Athena to appear? Not seen her around in my time here before and that's only been short in comparison to the time span of the boards but since her last post was in '04 unless a whole lot of lurking has been done I don't feel she should contribute to this thread since she herself has not really been active. Just saying.

 

[Spiral]

Agree to disagree. Your opinion is not fact.

when BUFFY (Faith and others) have remarked on the way Seraphim behaves and comes across to THEM? it's not MY opinion it is a FACT based on those on the RECEIVING END of his subtle attempts to condescend and direspect them.

That's something we can both agree on, because I sure as hell could care less about what you think of me. And you're right, I don't know you, which makes me wonder why the hell you're getting away with acting like you are when people who can actually deal with conflict in a mature way are getting berated for it.

wonder away, sweetheart, and keep it moving because the bottom line is, things are the way they are. the clique has been dealt with and as long as MY friend feels okay about things now...then I'M okay as well because I'm here for HER...not you or anybody else's validation.

 

[VisionGuy]

It's gotten really heated in here. If Seraphim wanted answers, he should have PM'ed Buffy Summers in private instead of running in here and accusing her of.... what was the word?

Hi. My wife (yellowcrayon) got permabanned apparently for merely being associated with some of the actual offenders...? That rather smacks of douchbaggery. Or has she been up to stuff I don't know about? kkthxbai.

Yeah that. If it would have been kept civil from the beginning instead of making assumptions and accusations then we wouldn't be having this problem.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

But the difference is Athena didn't start it, she was matching the tone Seraphim was using, he came on here demanding to know who complained about his wife, and then give out when we wont tell him.

And he actually wonders why!

 

[Black Eye Guy]

"Just going to point out that if that is the route to be taken about how people only appear at certain times defending person/s then is it ok for Athena to appear? Not seen her around in my time here before and that's only been short in comparison to the time span of the boards but since her last post was in '04 unless a whole lot of lurking has been done I don't feel she should contribute to this thread since she herself has not really been active. Just saying."

Sorry I can't quote in the Mobile skin, but Athena is defening a friend of her. Seraphim has come on demanding to know who ratted out his wife.

 

[Mesektet Ra]

when BUFFY (Faith and others) have remarked on the way Seraphim behaves and comes across to THEM? it's not MY opinion it is a FACT based on those on the RECEIVING END of his subtle attempts to condescend and direspect them.

'Kay. I still read that as opinion. Buffy and Faith's opinions aren't fact either, and neither are mine. We took what he said differently. Simple.

wonder away, sweetheart, and keep it moving because the bottom line is, things are the way they are. the clique has been dealt with and as long as MY friend feels okay about things now...then I'M okay as well because I'm here for HER...not you or anybody else's validation.

.:shrugs:. 'Kay. And you're giving Seraphim shit because he's defending his wife, when you're in here telling me that you're here to defend your friend? Sounds a bit contradictory, just sayin'. Guess that's how you roll, which is cool.

Jesse, he might've gotten off on the wrong foot but it was taken entirely too far. And I'm not agreeing with everything he's said, again, because I do think he got a bit heated and could've handled things differently. But I do agree with what he's trying to do because he has the right.

 

[VisionGuy]

And to be fair, Athena has a post count of over a thousand and she was an integral part of the boards at one time. Seraphim has a post count of 38 and he only comes around when something is up with YC. I mean... I've never seen him before.

 

[VisionGuy]

Jesse, he might've gotten off on the wrong foot but it was taken entirely too far. And I'm not agreeing with everything he's said, again, because I do think he got a bit heated and could've handled things differently. But I do agree with what he's trying to do because he has the right.

I completely understand that. But he went about it the wrong way. He threw shit in the air and it hit the fan. Now the shit has spread and people are not happy.

LOL at that analogy.

 

[Mesektet Ra]

Seraphim has a post count of 38 and he only comes around when something is up with YC. I mean... I've never seen him before.

I don't necessarily believe that. I've talked to him before and he came to the defense of everyone in The 29 when we were put in 'time-out', not because YC told him to or it had anything to do with her [she wasn't even banned], but because he felt what was going on was wrong. And I kind of feel like saying something akin to 'he's doing it just because she's his wife' is kind of low, because that kind of negates any kind of feelings he might have on the issue.

 

[Mozzymandias]

But the difference is Athena didn't start it, she was matching the tone Seraphim was using, he came on here demanding to know who complained about his wife, and then give out when we wont tell him.

And he actually wonders why!

I'm not saying the way Seraphim went about stuff was correct, I can understand him being mad and all those feelings and why he may or may not have thought through what he was doing properly but when someone who hasn't really been all that active and starts bashing members instead of talking peaceably and moving on I think it's kinda unhelpful. I mean Seraphim started it so its ok for Athena to bash people, firstly it's kinda childish(he started it and all that) but secondly why lower your standards to name calling and such if you're above that. It just seems to me that once again they're are members who wish to help Buffy and the team in any way and accepting what's happened but its been overshadowed.

And VG, I have a post count of over a thousand but post count means nothing to me. I've logged on here nearly everyday for the past year and feel I have a better understanding of the members here at the moment. I get she was an integral part of the boards and all that but it seems to me there are many double standards going on at the moment.

 

[Spiral]

But the difference is Athena didn't start it, she was matching the tone Seraphim was using, he came on here demanding to know who complained about his wife, and then give out when we wont tell him.

And he actually wonders why!

in plain sight...yet hardly seen! EXACTLY!

people on here have LONG enjoyed the supposed "privilage" of talking to Buffy (and staff) any kind of way. What they dont realize is that i HAVE been watching...AND MY FRIEND (and Faith) have come to ME about the fall out of the CRAP that has gone on courtesy of YELLOW CRAYON and that whole clique!

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. Buffy was MORE than long suffering and to HER detriment over this matter. Now that she's done what she needed to do, it really shouldnt be up for discussion and people should REALIZE that membership here doesnt entitle you to "berate" as the self righteous woman trying to take me to task calls it a woman who has maintained this board out of the kindness and goodness of her heart...put out time and MONEY for this place and yet she gets talked DOWN to by a woman and her crew and that woman's condescending husband? hell no...that shit shouldve been dealt with a LONG time ago but it wasnt until OTHER MEMBERS came to the staff in PRIVATE detailing THEIR issues of harrasment and bullying by these same people that Buffy finally had what SHE felt was a clear and FAIR reason to take action.

She COULD have (and would have been well within her rights) dealt with these people based on their treatment of HER and her STAFF alone ages ago. and yes...private chats (facebook etc) certainly contributed to the problem that was going on HERE. She was being called names and someone even spoke about STABBING HER!? wtf? you self righteous people here trying to defend YC or rebuke ME need to get a clue.

 

[VisionGuy]

And VG, I have a post count of over a thousand but post count means nothing to me. I've logged on here nearly everyday for the past year. I get she was an integral part of the boards and all that but it seems to me there are many double standards going on at the moment.

I completely agree. There are double standards. People here think that they can talk to Buffy or the staff anyway they want. But when somebody turns it around on them and uses the same harsh tone they are using [Faith In Buffy's Body]It's wrong. *pout*[/Faith In Buffy's Body] I just don't understand how you guys aren't seeing the problem here. It is right in your face!

 

[Lou]

So wait, bullying is bad, and then there is this? How is this a way to show anything has changed? This isn't the path to a happy board, this is the path to "bullying is only okay from our side", which I seriously doubt was the strategy Buffy set out to take.

Seraphim didn't call anyone a douche. He said it "smacked of douchebaggery". Don't see a difference? Well, this situation sucks....that is NOT to say that everyone involved suck or that anyone involved sucks. I care about people on both sides, so I can honestly say that. And if I had more time to play, I'd be much more upset about the state of the boards.

Yellow didn't hold any "private chats" she simply went into a room, that has been established for months, saw that some people were upset, and tried to keep the situation under control by not having people post while they were upset. She didn't threaten anyone. If they took it that way, I'm sure she is sorry, but her entire goal was to have a happy Drogyn Christmas and not let the drama from the rest of the boards ruin it. That's hardly rift causing, unless Drogyn is here to take over the board and no one warned us.
So, she saw it as drama? That's not a crime. As apposed to another thread over who Buffy really loved, it WAS dramatic.
She never once told anyone that she knew had caused trouble that what they did was okay. In fact, quite the opposite and stood up and said she understood the infractions whether the issue was done on the boards or off and was honestly upset about Lyri and Kean leaving. Guess that part wasn't reported. Which is fine.

Seraphim may not be the most active member that we see. But, he's always around. Believe me, I know. He's within smacking distance of YellowCrayon most of the time she was posting, or chatting, watching TV with us or talking to me on the phone.
He's upset for a valid reason. It's been stated these are ongoing problems, that the mods have tried to get them under control and the members won't listen. And if YC never got a PM or told that her behavior was somehow upsetting people when other members who have been warned aren't banned, he has a right to question it. Sure, Buffy has the right to not give him an answer, that is true. But he can still question it and stand up for his wife, assume people mistook her statements (as they seemed to by how they leapt on her in the other thread) and not just because he wants to keep "screwing" her. And the fact that part was not edited out, makes me happy I don't have more time for the boards.

Buffy's original post was well put. Too bad it couldn't stay that way.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

"but when someone who hasn't really been all that active and starts bashing members instead of talking peaceably and moving on I think it's kinda unhelpful."

But thats exactly what Seraphim was doing, Why is it only the mods and Athena is calling him out on it, He came on here just to know why his wife was banned, this time he wasn't defending a group, he is wanting to know who spoke bad about his wife. And he wasn't happy with the answer, that we're not telling. Which we absolutely should not. So he's thrown a hissy fit.

 

[Mozzymandias]

"but when someone who hasn't really been all that active and starts bashing members instead of talking peaceably and moving on I think it's kinda unhelpful."

But thats exactly what Seraphim was doing, Why is it only the mods and Athena is calling him out on it, He came on here just to know why his wife was banned, this time he wasn't defending a group, he is wanting to know who spoke bad about his wife. And he wasn't happy with the answer, that we're not telling. Which we absolutely should not. So he's thrown a hissy fit.

I did quite clearly say I didn't agree with the way Seraphim went about things was correct but could understand why he did it. Something you have to do a whole lot on this board lately, put yourself in other peoples positions and imagine how it is for them. I did that this morning when I woke, put myself in Buffy's position to understand her actions which I now fully understand. Anyone mature enough could fully understand Seraphim's reaction to the whole situation, he just cares a whole lot about his wife as Athena cares a whole lot about her friend which I truly do get but name calling isn't the way. We've lost to much already for it to carry on.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

Sorry Moz your correct you had said you didn't agree with him.

But there were allot of people that dind't jump to condem Seraphim when he posted, but as soon as Athena did everyone jumped. And I personally don't see a difference in the way they were speaking to eachother, it's not how I'd speak to someone else, but they were both talking like that, but generally people only had a problem with Athena.

 

[Mesektet Ra]

She COULD have (and would have been well within her rights) dealt with these people based on their treatment of HER and her STAFF alone ages ago. and yes...private chats (facebook etc) certainly contributed to the problem that was going on HERE. She was being called names and someone even spoke about STABBING HER!? wtf? you self righteous people here trying to defend YC or rebuke ME need to get a clue.

.:sighs:. 'Kay. What I'm getting from you is, "I'm Buffy's friend and I say what I want to whoever I want and nobody else can because SHE'S MY FRIEND theendkthx." And my take? I don't care who you're friends with. You could be BFF with Jesus for all I care and that doesn't excuse you acting the way you have. Seraphim might have started things off on the wrong foot but like Lou said, I didn't take what he said as calling people douches and more along the lines of 'this smacks of people acting in a shitty way'. Whatever.

Lou is completely and totally 100% right. And so is Sean - you're calling Seraphim out for popping in when it has something to do with his wife, yet I have never seen you before and you're coming to defense of your friends. You reek of contradictions.

Also, I'm not trying to spin around and point fingers, but if anyone's acting self-righteous, it's definitely you, darlin'. I've done nothing but state my opinion and you act as though that because you're friends with the admins here that your opinion is the Holy Gospel of BB and it's not always so.

Dude, the things people have been saying about the mods and admins here isn't right and I don't agree with it, either. I've said so before. I'm not going to explain why I think Seraphim is justified because Lou did a much better job, but I stand by the fact that he has the right to do what he's doing. Maybe not in the way he has been, but he still has the right.

And, really? Can't we seriously just backtrack and agree to act like adults now? Because the baby's kicking and this is making me tired.

 

[Spiral]

.:sighs:. 'Kay. What I'm getting from you is, "I'm Buffy's friend and I say what I want to whoever I want and nobody else can because SHE'S MY FRIEND theendkthx." And my take? I don't care who you're friends with. You could be BFF with Jesus for all I care and that doesn't excuse you acting the way you have. Seraphim might have started things off on the wrong foot but like Lou said, I didn't take what he said as calling people douches and more along the lines of 'this smacks of people acting in a shitty way'. Whatever.

several paragraphs devoted to YOUR self righteous rebuking of me...and what...two maybe three sentences with regard to the very REAL problem that Buffy and staff were facing?

i think you need to get a clue. it's REALLY not about me but everyone finds it so convenient to focus on me because i did what no one else wanted to...i called Seraphim out and i also kept the spotlight on YC and that clique for what THEY did to Buffy.

What i'm saying here pales in comparison to what has been said TO and ABOUT Buffy, the way her staff was treated, the things that were said offsight including on FB [STABBING HER? -where's the fury over THAT?] . Where's your indignation over THAT? you're here on this board at BUFFY'S leisure and you (and everyone else) really should remember that if it wasnt for HER, this board wouldnt be here.

your attempts to dismiss what i'm saying and focus only on the parts you dont like are noted and rejected. It doesnt change the fact that the problem here was YC and her crew and they've been dealt with. like it or not...deal with it. Seraphim got what he deserved too. again, the FACT is that he made Buffy, Faith and other staff feel offended and uncomfortable more than once, and it was usually on behalf of his wife. He's doing the same thing here NOW and the only people defending him are people who liked YC which really isnt saying all that much.

You can think whatever you like about me or my statements (it really doesnt matter) but the FACTS are crystal clear whether you want to see them or not.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I think we all Agree with Meseket, that there's no point in havinf this discussion the way it's going. Lets all just take a breath, and everyone try and be friendly and equal in their posts?

EVERYONE, Mods, members, husbands, wives, friends of Jesus, - everyone, there's just no point otherwise!

Ok I was a little late, but now!