Strongest Character?

[thetopher]

This might sound a bit random and kind of trivial, (but it's actually of vital importance! 😉 ) but who would people say is physically the strongest main character on the either show?

I mean is it Buffy? Angel? Conner? Grue?

What you y'all think?

Illyria doesn't count, because she's kind of obvious- she's a unique being.

 

[Kean]

Buffy.

Then:
Angel.
Grue.
Connor.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I think the absolute strongest is Buffy

In terms of normal characters after that I'd say Angel - Darla/Conor/ - Faith/Dru/Anyanka - Spike

I'm not sure but maybe the Buffybot would be stronger than Angel?

 

[janas]

Buffy
Angel
Connor
Groo (I know that he is brave and undefeated but I think Connor is stronger than Groo)

I can add also Faith? If yes then my list is this

Buffy
Faith (because the slayers are stronger than vampires)
Angel
Connor
Groo

 

[Buffyverse Fan]

(I know that he is brave and undefeated but I think Connor is stronger than Groo)

In their kind-of fight, they make Groo out to be quite a bit inferior to Connor.

Are we talking who would win in a fight or who could lift the most weight?

Either case, Buffy's #1, it's her franchise, and she's beaten all of the contenders in proper fights.

#2 would already be different based on the rules. I have no doubt Faith is made out to be physically stronger than Angel, but I think Angel would win in a fight.

STRENGTH:
Buffy
Faith
Angel
Spike
Connor
Groo

WHO WOULD WIN:
Buffy
Angel
Faith/Spike
Connor
Groo

Even then, it's tricky with the three heavy hitters.

Buffy would always win, it's her franchise.

Spike on his best day would beat Angel on his worst day.

Spike on a good day would beat Faith on a bad day.

Faith on a great day would beat Spike or Angel on a lousy one.

Angel & Spike are tricky. Slayers' main advantage seems to be that most vampires are poor fighters. Those two have Slayer-level skill, near-Slayer level strength, and far better durability than Slayers. They're even slightly sunlight resistant, where other vamps dust from the sun instantly, both those guys easily survive temporary exposure.

Regarding Illyria... given time to prep, the heroes would definitely take her down--probably more Giles, Willow, and Wesley than the better fighters. But with no prep, wow, even Buffy, Faith, Angel, and Spike, they couldn't phase her combined. The original attack on Illyria: Angel, Spike, and Wesley led, would've killed Buffy in two seconds. Illyria barely noticed it.

 

[Blaze]

Physically speaking only (not who would win a fight, I think there's a big difference):
Glory (doesn't really count, she's a Goddess)
Buffy
Faith
Spike/Angel
Connor
Groo
Riley on roids (he did give Angel a run for his money, which in itself is really impressive)

The ones that I can't really tell are: Kendra, Darla and Dru. We never truly saw their raw strength.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

I would include Hamilton on this list. He was mopping the floor with Angel until he revealed that he had been given a boost by the Senior Partners when he says:

HAMILTON

Let me say this as clearly as I can. You cannot beat me. I am a part of them. The Wolf, Ram, and Hart. Their strength flows through my veins. My blood is filled with their ancient power.

ANGEL

Can you pick out the one word there you probably shouldn't have said?

Angel only beat him when he drank from Hamilton. I am not sure where he would go on this list, but someone who could not benefit from drinking his blood (like a slayer) would have ended up in bad shape. Or a slayer just might have followed the example of all their vampire targets and drank his blood anyway.

 

[AnthonyCordova]

I would say Buffy strikes me as the strongest. After that, Faith, who is pretty close actually. After that Angel and then Spike. But to me they are all a fairly close bunch in terms of strength, all in all. Connor and Grue are also very strong, and not far behind the others at all. I could rank them if I wanted to (just as I did now) but there is a general relative equality among all of these people. Generally speaking and without breaking out measuring devices, they are all relatively equal, more or less.

Now who is the strongest in a fight? The edge overall goes to Buffy again. She's got the intangibles all working in her favor. Faith comes closest, but I definitely get the impression that Buffy has a little extra something on Faith that will allow her to come out on top in most cases. Angel is about as close as Faith is to Buffy, because of his heroic status. But Buffy still would win in the end (at least the majority of the fights). Spike, Gru and Connor are a little farther behind. Once again though, they are all pretty close. They are not separated by much, when you take a step back.

If we are going to add villains and others to the list (like people added Glory and Hamilton above) then yeah, Buffy isn't first anymore. Definitely not on strength (Hamilton, Adam, Glory, Illyria pre-change, and many others would be much stronger physically). As far as fights go, Buffy and Angel win fights with these people because they have hero-karma and a little bit of fate and good fortune working their way (as well as skill and planning and thinking too) and the super-villains lose partly because of hubris and over-confidence and things like that too.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

In "Destiny 5X08", Spike and Angel contend for the Cup of Perpetual Torment and Spike wins, so the writers have established that Spike can overpower Angel.

But who cares? My favourite fight is Xander vs. Harmony when they get into this hair-pulling, bitch slapping fight. Break out the popcorn for that one.

 

[Buffyverse Fan]

In "Destiny 5X08", Spike and Angel contend for the Cup of Perpetual Torment and Spike wins, so the writers have established that Spike can overpower Angel.

I totally agree that Spike can beat Angel in a fight.

In-context that was Spike at his best, and Angel at his worst, in terms of frame of mind. They have completely different fighting styles, but I think they're portrayed as the same general level of ability. That being said, both on their best day, Angel's portrayed as tougher.

Generally speaking, it seems like:
Angelus > Angel > Ensouled Spike > Evil!Spike

 

[white avenger]

It's the BUFFYverse, so, naturally, Buffy would seem to be the strongest, or, at least, the best fighter, which isn't necessarily the same thing.

Spike, Faith, and Angel are too close to make a definite choice.

Connor would probably be next, with Groo bringing up the rear.

Of the human fighters

Gunn
Riley
Wes (as of Season 4 of "Angel")
Giles
Xander

 

[bespangeled]

I totally agree that Spike can beat Angel in a fight.

In-context that was Spike at his best, and Angel at his worst, in terms of frame of mind. They have completely different fighting styles, but I think they're portrayed as the same general level of ability. That being said, both on their best day, Angel's portrayed as tougher.

Generally speaking, it seems like:
Angelus > Angel > Ensouled Spike > Evil!Spike

I'd say it was more than a bad day. Angel had spent a lot of time in the previous years sedentary - and his skills were rusty. Spike had spent several years killing demons, most of whom were probably as strong or stronger than he was. Not only were his skills polished, he was more adaptive and creative.

That said - in terms of lifting something - I agree it's Buffy, though Angel may be damn near at the same strength. Not sure after that - but I suspect Faith, Groo, and Spike (in that order).

 

[Blaze]

I'd say it was more than a bad day. Angel had spent a lot of time in the previous years sedentary - and his skills were rusty. Spike had spent several years killing demons, most of whom were probably as strong or stronger than he was. Not only were his skills polished, he was more adaptive and creative.
That said - in terms of lifting something - I agree it's Buffy, though Angel may be damn near at the same strength. Not sure after that - but I suspect Faith, Groo, and Spike (in that order).

Interesting, I'd say the opposite. I think Angel and Spike are equally matched in strength, but Angel would beat Spike 4/5 times if only because he tries harder. Spike is too nonchalant to give it his all in most fights. Even if he is dam strong. He reminds me of the cartoon Hercules, you'd tell him to use his head and he would just ram head first into the bad guy lol. He's strong, he has good techniques, which means he wins almost all of the time, but he doesn't fight very smart or with much conviction. Angel is actually somewhat similar, but Angelus, that's another story. Angelus fights to win every single time. He's aggressive, and convinced that he'll win, and he wants to make you suffer through it. Angelus would destroy Spike, but not because of strength. When it comes down to Angel vs. Spike, it's all about the mental aspect I think.

 

[AnthonyCordova]

In that fight everyone is talking about, angel said he lost to spike because, in his words, "he wanted it more", which troubled Angel because he thought it meant Spike wanted to be the hero more than Angel. Angel also said in the same conversation that that was the first time Spike had actually beaten him convincingly. I think they are actually a pretty close match, but Angel in general has his number, so to speak.

I kind of feel Buffy and Faith are similarly closely matched, but Buffy has Faith's number (so to speak) too. It happens often where two otherwise equal people are very unequal head to head. I used to fence a lot ("rusticana", which essentially means with live blades, usually sabre), and the guy who taught me many of my moves always beat me, and I mean always. We would win and lose the same number of times to other fencers of equal strength (which is why I would say we were equal, at least as far as everyone else we fought was concerned) but in the head-to-head he was always just a little bit better. He had my number.

 

[thetopher]

Interesting to see what people think.

I was generally talking in terms of strength, which is easier to quantify than 'who would win in a fight', because all the fights between the different characters go different ways.

So, Buffy stronger than Faith, but she's so little! 😛
But, while I'll agree that Buffy's better in a fight (mostly) I always took Buffy as the faster, more agile type with a better fighting technique (from all her training), but Faith as maybe slightly stronger and much tougher (look at Angel S4 for evidence of that.)

I never understood what Grue was exactly, human-plus? Some other-dimentional chosen.
Conner, as a teenager, wasn't as strong as Angel or Faith, but he's still a growing boy- it would be interesting to see how he handles himself now. (More Conner please!)

Angel, as far as I can see, trains and works out more than any other vampire that we see- so with any other vampire on a given day, he'd still kick their ass.
(Yep, true that Spike beat him- he was having an off-day and he realised it.)

 

[Black Eye Guy]

So, Buffy stronger than Faith, but she's so little! 😛

I think their magical strength is probably exactly equal, but Buffy has been doing it longer which I think would make her stronger.

It looks like most people are going off a who would win in a fight, which is a different question as that has a lot of different outcomes, like how Spike beat Angel that one and only time, that proves nothing of strength.

If the characters were arm wrestling, I think Buffy takes everyone, not only does she have the slayer strength, but she's trained. I think Faith is weaker cuz she's got the strength but hasn't trained.
Same applies to Angel and Spike, presumably their magical strength is the same, but Angels trained, and he's older than Spike.
I think the fact he's trained would make him stronger than Faith. While I think the two untrained characters of Spike and Faith comes down to who's magical strength is better, and Slayers are made stronger than vampires, so Faith takes it.

 

[Robb Stark]

In "Destiny 5X08", Spike and Angel contend for the Cup of Perpetual Torment and Spike wins, so the writers have established that Spike can overpower Angel.

But who cares? My favourite fight is Xander vs. Harmony when they get into this hair-pulling, bitch slapping fight. Break out the popcorn for that one.

Well, this ignores all the times Angel kicked the living crap out of Spike. Even later in that season he swipes Spike away like it's nothing.

And yes, LOVE Xander vs. Harmony!

 

[bespangeled]

Interesting, I'd say the opposite. I think Angel and Spike are equally matched in strength, but Angel would beat Spike 4/5 times if only because he tries harder. Spike is too nonchalant to give it his all in most fights. Even if he is dam strong. He reminds me of the cartoon Hercules, you'd tell him to use his head and he would just ram head first into the bad guy lol. He's strong, he has good techniques, which means he wins almost all of the time, but he doesn't fight very smart or with much conviction. Angel is actually somewhat similar, but Angelus, that's another story. Angelus fights to win every single time. He's aggressive, and convinced that he'll win, and he wants to make you suffer through it. Angelus would destroy Spike, but not because of strength. When it comes down to Angel vs. Spike, it's all about the mental aspect I think.

I see fighting to be the only thing that Spike really concentrates on, and I don't recall seeing him lose all that much....well, until season 7 when he was 'weepy or whiny'.

I agree the Angelus would kick Spike's ass for a lot of reasons both physical and mental But, as things stand, this is the first fight they have had in a century and - other than the Buffy comment, which really threw Spike off his game, I saw Spike fighting with far more intelligence than Angel used. I suspect Angel didn't take that battle seriously until it was way too late.

---------- Post added at 11:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:57 PM ----------

I think their magical strength is probably exactly equal, but Buffy has been doing it longer which I think would make her stronger.

It looks like most people are going off a who would win in a fight, which is a different question as that has a lot of different outcomes, like how Spike beat Angel that one and only time, that proves nothing of strength.

If the characters were arm wrestling, I think Buffy takes everyone, not only does she have the slayer strength, but she's trained. I think Faith is weaker cuz she's got the strength but hasn't trained.
Same applies to Angel and Spike, presumably their magical strength is the same, but Angels trained, and he's older than Spike.
I think the fact he's trained would make him stronger than Faith. While I think the two untrained characters of Spike and Faith comes down to who's magical strength is better, and Slayers are made stronger than vampires, so Faith takes it.

Spike has trained - for the last few chipped years he beat on demons, which I think gave him an edge on technique. In season 5 Angel, I would say he is the better fighter. It helps that Angel didn't even see Spike fight for a century, and he seriously underestimated him. And I agree that Spike wanted it more, but what he wanted was the win and not the cup.

He's also probably the weakest of the 4 - I agree there. And he lacks Angel's tactical sense. Spike might win the battle but Angel would win the war.

---------- Post added at 11:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:03 PM ----------

Well, this ignores all the times Angel kicked the living crap out of Spike. Even later in that season he swipes Spike away like it's nothing.

And yes, LOVE Xander vs. Harmony!

Details? All I remember is the fight in Angel's office where he reveals his plans. Were there any other battles that weren't in flashbacks?

 

[janas]

Details? All I remember is the fight in Angel's office where he reveals his plans. Were there any other battles that weren't in flashbacks?

Count if I mention that Puppet Angel knocked easily Spike, leaving him bleeding into the elevator?

 

[Taake]

I would include Hamilton on this list. He was mopping the floor with Angel until he revealed that he had been given a boost by the Senior Partners when he says:

HAMILTON

Let me say this as clearly as I can. You cannot beat me. I am a part of them. The Wolf, Ram, and Hart. Their strength flows through my veins. My blood is filled with their ancient power.

ANGEL

Can you pick out the one word there you probably shouldn't have said?

Angel only beat him when he drank from Hamilton. I am not sure where he would go on this list, but someone who could not benefit from drinking his blood (like a slayer) would have ended up in bad shape. Or a slayer just might have followed the example of all their vampire targets and drank his blood anyway.

True, Hamilton was immensely strong... but question - does that mean that Eve was as well? Or was Hamilton more a part of W&H than she was?