The Correlation between Angel and Spike

BuffyElevated

BuffyElevated

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Sineya
I found this tidbit on IMDB this morning:
Before he was turned into a vampire, Spike's name was William. Angel's real name was Liam, which is the Irish version of the English/British William.
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This is really interesting to me... I never knew this before, and now it makes me think a lot more about how similar the characters are. I have no way of knowing if it was planned early in his role that Spike was going to get his soul back, but after reading that, it kinda makes me believe that the similarities between the characters are on purpose.
Think about it... Not even counting their history together before they met Buffy, both men meet Buffy and want to be better men because of her. Each of them fights along the side of good with their soul, and their struggles with the "demons" in their heads after they get their soul is similar, as well.

I don't know, I just think it's really cool.
 
Oh, it gets better.

There are 3 Williams. Angel, Spike and Willow. Strip the superficial and they suddenly become uncannily similar.

*They're all immortal

*Stuck in an endless cycle of murder/rape/apocalypse -> redemption

*Absolutely obsessed with Buffy, they will do anything to be with her, get a soul, rip her out of heaven, create a new universe etc, you get the point. Consequences be damned.

*Featured in the song "Blue" in "Conversations with Dead People"

*Most influential "people" in Buffy's life, also the most powerful and the ones that hurt her the most. Moreover, Buffy's the most influential person in their "lives".

*Buffy killed all of them. Angel in season 2, Spike in season 7 ( Yeah, I know, still who gave Spike the trinket that fried him? Who? ) and Willow in season 8.

So, which one of them gets the girl? The most cruel and vicious one, of course. Personally, I bet on Willow as she's the most remorseless of the three.
 
Yes! It's very interesting; I think it goes beyond just those tho characters as well! I actually put up a thread about it, (and other name choices in the 'verse) a while back, based on what I found in "Why Buffy Matters," by Rhonda Wilcox:

https://www.buffy-boards.com/showthread.php?t=55409

"With a dangerous desire for control repeated and emphasized over the years...as in the episode "Something Blue" in which Willow enacts a spell to have her 'Will done.'"
"...Three major characters, then, all share forms of the name William...'(William and Willow are) both trying to reinvent themselves as no longer geeky, sensitive outcasts...So is Spike Willow's double or her shadow or the embodiment of her desire for Buffy?' This parallel does not, however, apply to the never-geeky Angel/Liam...William means 'a willing protector'; this meaning...could be said to apply at some points in the plot to Spike, Angel, and Willow...

The notable episode 'Lie to Me' contains another significant William--Billy Fordham...(this further serves to point out) the overall William-Will-Liam-Willy(Billy) naming pattern. I would argue that one effect of the pattern is to remind viewers, on some level, of the connections between the bad guys and the good guys--and the fact that any of us could cross that line...
...Spike, Angel, and Willow are perhaps the most notable examples in the Buffyverse of characters who are capable of memorable good or vicious evil."
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I love looking into this stuff...
 
caitaintdead
caitaintdead
Love Rhonda Wilcox!
white avenger said:
Don't forget Willy, the bartender.
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There's also Billy Fordham ("Ford" in Lie to Me episode), Billy from an episode of Angel (can't remember which...) and
there's going to be a new male "slayer" in S9 called Billy.

...maybe Joss just likes the name? 😛

ETA: Oh and I just remembered... wasn't the baseball kid in Nightmares a Billy too?
 
[MENTION=8100]xaphania[/MENTION]

*reads the spoiler*

What? Just, WHAT?! You mean, like seriously, for real? Somebody stop the planet, I'm stepping out 😀

You know, when Buffy slept with a woman in season 8, me and my friend had a talk. He had already read the comics, I was in the dark. It kinda looked like this:

Have you heard, Buffy's finally slept with a woman! Guess who the lucky girl is?
I don't know, I said. Must be Faith, I guess
No, my friend said clearly amused
So, Willow, right? I mean, there was all that subtext after all.
No
Kennedy?! Not that's something wrong with it, but Kennedy?
No, son of a bitch was grinning already
Let me think. Willow brought back Tara and she's like, post-corpse bonding with Buffy, dead crave the dead etc.
No
Wait, don't tell me she's slept with Dawn! I mean, they're not really sisters, and yeah, there's unquestionable love, but...but Dawnie?!
No
Alright, just, just tell me.
It's a new girl, he starts laughing
Let me guess, that new girl, she was never heard from again?
Yes!, he said.
MAN, WHAT ARE THEY SMOKING?
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The spoiler? It beats it. It beats the space sex, zombie-vampires with free will and giant pregnant robot Buffy. Damn, what are they smoking? 😀
 
I think this and other similarities between the two exist to remind us, despite how much these two claim to hate eachother, how similar they really are - and how much they've shared, and what a rich history and close relationship they have 🙂

HisMrs said:
I found this tidbit on IMDB this morning:


This is really interesting to me... I never knew this before, and now it makes me think a lot more about how similar the characters are. I have no way of knowing if it was planned early in his role that Spike was going to get his soul back, but after reading that, it kinda makes me believe that the similarities between the characters are on purpose.
Think about it... Not even counting their history together before they met Buffy, both men meet Buffy and want to be better men because of her. Each of them fights along the side of good with their soul, and their struggles with the "demons" in their heads after they get their soul is similar, as well.

I don't know, I just think it's really cool.
Click to expand...
 
EVIL UU said:
The spoiler? It beats it. It beats the space sex, zombie-vampires with free will and giant pregnant robot Buffy. Damn, what are they smoking? 😀
Click to expand...

Firstly, nothing can beat the space sex. Next, the spoiler isn't actually that far out.
He's not an actual Slayer, just a rogue demon hunter. A gay, more powerful Xander.
 
[MENTION=11500]drizzlydaze[/MENTION]

Oh, so it's just another publicity stunt. Why do I still fall for that? After pregnant robot lesbian I really should know better.

a gay Xander
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Isn't Xander already gay? He spend a couple of months with Dracula after Anya's death, after all.

nothing can beat the space sex
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Yeah, you're probably right
but still, from one girl in all the world to thousands of girls around the world and a boy, now that's just...words fail me. And a rogue demon hunter? How boring. They could have gone the transsexual route, that's at least mildly interesting. It's like they want to write generic drivel.
 
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