Question The dynamics of a soul?

[Napoleon]

Fred, in the show, it was said that her soul was spent by the fires of Illyria's resurrection. But because of the perpetuity clause in all W&H employees, wouldn't Fred still owe her soul to W&H? So W&H couldn't claim her soul for the afterlife?

W&H claimed Eve's, Lindsey's, Lilah's, and Wesley's souls after their death. Angel's soul is now W&H's property?

Another thing.... vampire with souls. Once their soul is put back in their vampiric bodies, would their human soul retain all the memories of their afterlife in heaven/hell? What about the vampiric soul, that came from a different dimension, that embedded with the physical body to become a vampire? So the body now has 2 souls in it? The vampiric one from a different dimension, and the restored human one?

Does the vampiric soul that inhabit sired humans, go back to their dimension once their vampiric body dies from whatever reason (dusting, sunlight, etc.)? When Darla was resurrected, she wasn't resurrected as a vampire, after all.

Does Illyria have a soul? When she died during the magical explosion.... did she just cease to exist just like how Fred's soul allegedly was?

Matthias Pavayne was just a corporealized soul, from Fred's machine. So if Matthias, now corporealized, were to be killed... would his soul just disappear from existence? Could the same be said about Spike? Spike is just a corporealized soul after all. Strangely enough, Spike before and after he was corporealized, retained his vampiric attributes. But Darla, resurrected, did not but ended up being just human. Also, Buffy resurrected retained all her Slayer attributes. Darla did not retain her vampiric attributes.

Your thoughts of all this?

 

[Blaze]

I'll try to answer as best as I can.

Fred, in the show, it was said that her soul was spent by the fires of Illyria's resurrection. But because of the perpetuity clause in all W&H employees, wouldn't Fred still owe her soul to W&H? So W&H couldn't claim her soul for the afterlife?

This is a good question. I think it was more so explored in the comics which I'm not very familiar with. But from what I gathered a part of Fred is still in there. Either way, even if W&H owned her soul, if it is destroyed then there isn't much they could do about it. To me the real question is can a soul really be destroyed. Fred is the only example we have of this (I think?), and even that is unclear.

Another thing.... vampire with souls. Once their soul is put back in their vampiric bodies, would their human soul retain all the memories of their afterlife in heaven/hell? What about the vampiric soul, that came from a different dimension, that embedded with the physical body to become a vampire? So the body now has 2 souls in it? The vampiric one from a different dimension, and the restored human one?

I think it's inaccurate to say vampiric soul, because by definition vampires do not have a soul. They are a demon entity, but they do not have a soul. But yes, when the soul is puck back in the vampire, the demonic entity is still there, but there is no 2 souls, only one (the human's). Angel mentions a few times how the demon in him is still there. And Angelus confirms this.

A soul would also not retain memories in my opinion. There are many theories on this topic, but the one I subscribe to is that the soul isn't something that goes to hell or heaven (that's only caused by a full death as we see with Buffy). I guess you could think of it as the limbo. But the memories are something attached to the brain, not the soul in my opinion. Meaning that Angelus still has the memories of Liam and Angel still has the memories of Angelus. They are all linked not because the soul, but because they share a brain.

Does the vampiric soul that inhabit sired humans, go back to their dimension once their vampiric body dies from whatever reason (dusting, sunlight, etc.)? When Darla was resurrected, she wasn't resurrected as a vampire, after all.

Again, no such thing as a vampiric soul in my opinion, but even if we use it as a metaphor for the demon, then no I don't think it goes to another dimension upon killing. At least this was not explored on the show.

Does Illyria have a soul? When she died during the magical explosion.... did she just cease to exist just like how Fred's soul allegedly was?

This I do not know. But according to the new season,

Spoiler

Illyria might not be dead? (putting a question mark because I haven't actually read the comics)

Matthias Pavayne was just a corporealized soul, from Fred's machine. So if Matthias, now corporealized, were to be killed... would his soul just disappear from existence? Could the same be said about Spike? Spike is just a corporealized soul after all. Strangely enough, Spike before and after he was corporealized, retained his vampiric attributes. But Darla, resurrected, did not but ended up being just human. Also, Buffy resurrected retained all her Slayer attributes. Darla did not retain her vampiric attributes.

This comes down to the power of W&H. They have such power that they can toy with people/vampires/souls as they please. I think it comes down to the magick being used (eg. compare resurrecting Joyce to resurrecting Buffy; different magick=different outcome).

 

[Napoleon]

Interesting read, your answers. I would like to hear more from the different people in the forums.

Oh! And you're right... just for clarification, when I incorrectly said "vampiric soul", I actually meant "the demon entity that comes from another dimension that inhabits sired humans".

Let me upsize that so that newer readers of the thread can see it. I'm not shouting. I just want you to see it if you're scrolling through the thread.

MY CORRECTED DEFINITION: "VAMPIRIC SOUL" = "THE DEMON ENTITY THAT COMES FROM ANOTHER DIMENSION THAT INHABITS SIRED HUMANS"​