The First in C.W.D.P.

C

ChosenOne

Potential
Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
452
Age
38
Location
Grassy Field Ireland
Freinds, Romans, BBers, lend my your ears

We all know that It wasn't Joyce that was in Conversations with Dead People and that i was the first (even Joss said so).
So while falling asleep last night something struck me (I was my lamp... it fell over🙂) But also a thought came into my head.

Through out Buffy the first was said to be non-coperal and not able to take psyicial form etc. So how is it that in CWDP The First was able to Bang on Doors, Make Wind, Write on the wall, push Dawn, Fry a microwave, tune into a radio etc.
When in later S7 it can't even open a door or pick up a gun.

I just wondered what other BBers though of this.
Maybe the first hired a poltergeist or something to make all those things happen (But i don't really think the first does much hiring, do you😉)...
 
I haven't heard Joss say anything about this but I don't believe it was Joyce either.. Why would Joyce do that to Dawn..?

But, it seems weird that that is the First since the First has never done anything like this before. I agree that the First shouldn't be able to do all that, and if it is, why only use that power once, and later on don't do anything like that again..?
 
I think it's that continuity thing in s7 cause the first is behaving awfully strange at times. First TF's able to do something and some episodes later not. Maybe it's like Buffy's bruises and scars, they only show up when it's necessary for the plot.
 
doppelgänger said:
I think it's that continuity thing in s7 cause the first is behaving awfully strange at times. First TF's able to do something and some episodes later not. Maybe it's like Buffy's bruises and scars, they only show up when it's necessary for the plot.
Click to expand...

Probably.. But I don't like it. I want a real explanation.. cause it's so obvious this needs one..
 
From past discussions on this, something that I vaguely remember was someone proposing the idea that although the form of Joyce was actually The First (as has been stated by those with power to affect official Buffy cannon), that perhaps the other entity in the house was really Joyce.

Although she seemed hostile, maybe it was an attempt to get Dawn out of the house, after all, it was telling her to leave, to get out, while the apparition of Joyce, really The First, needed her to stay to convince her of it's lies (were they lies? Whole other discussion).

Of coarse, it could have just been one big show by the forces of darkness, enc. In order to make the whole thing more believable and convincng to Dawn.
 
My question is in later episodes Robin Wood says that The First tries to get into the head of the "Key Players". So why is it messing with Dawns head?

Also I think you are right about the non-corporeal thing. Banging on walls, writing in blood etc are Poltageist activity (not sure if that is the word).

Maybe it was Joyce trying to help Dawn but the first got in the way.

Also when we saw the outline of that demon....scared me a bit. Tummy did a 360.
 
Continuity sucks...lol...

If you re-watch Amends, you'll see The First as Jenny, touch Angel's face...so yah...

Now...to the Joyce thing...

I personally believe that it was left open as, 'Was it Joyce? Or, was it The First?'

And my personal opinion, is that it was Joyce, and the force inside the house (the black demony thing) was The First...

It does make sense why people will consider that it was just all The First...especially when it hurt Dawn, and Joyce says 'Buffy wont choose you' - but this makes sense, because Buffy sends Dawn and Xander away...hense...not choosing her...

Im probably not making any sense...grr...
 
The first wasn't corporeal, but it had minion sthat were: the Turok han. Isn't it pretty likely that whatever was trying to keep joyce from getting through wasn't the first (since the first was already somewhere elase) but some other creature working for the first that could sort of manifest corporeally?
 
Maybe Dawn could have been a key player, i mean we have never really been told about dawns true potential, i mean at certain times she is one of the most powerful instruments of chaos ever and yet we are meant to expect her to have no power at all the rest of the time, its my belief that maybe dawns untapped power could have been used, maybe instead of using the power of the scythe they could have use dawn, and i also read somewhere once an alternate ending to s7 which showed dawn as someone who also needed to die for the slayerline to pass, whih is why when buffy died s5, no new slayer was called because dawn is like a clone of hers, you could also say its becausee faith is now the holder of the slayer line, or was.
 
I heard about that too.. Dawn having to die for a new slayer to be called. But, if Buffy and Faith died, both of them. There would be no slayer, and no new would be called until Dawn died..? Don't think it can work that way, although Buffy could replace Dawn in The Gift, don't think Dawn should be able to replace Buffy in that way.
About Dawn and her powers. I agree that it doesn't really make sence that she goes from being a really important key, to being just a teenager. But I still don't like to think of Dawn as someone who has a lot of power, in any way, even if she doesn't know about them. Sure, there will always be something special with Dawn since she wasn't always human. But I don't think there's more to it than that..
 
Interesting idea, but i don't think i would work. Buffy dies= no slayer.
Faith Dies= A new Slayer
But what's the point now there's thousands of slayers now.
Waht if every one of those slayer's dies what happens
 
I do know that the whole "Dawn has to die for a new slayer to be called" thing in Chosen has been pretty well debunked on B-B before: Alternative Chosen Script
I still believe that Dawn is powerful, though, she just hasn't found out how to tap into it yet.

I think that even though the all current potentials were activated, no new slayers (potentails yet to be) would be called until the last of the newly made slayers dies.
 
I don't think the slayer line has anything to do with the potentials. They are slayers, sure, but just like nothing happens if Faith dies (in season 7) no slayer is called if the potentials die.

(Can't believe every discussion leads to the slayer line discussion in some way..)
 
This may be a bit OT, since the thread is about the first.
But since the slayer line is mentioned...

I think that Joss left us with a whole lotta questions at the end of chosen and SOMEONE should write something, do something to clear things up. At least a little bit. Like... ta-da! A Faith spin-off.
The Fray book gives you some answers but it's still, it's a bit blurry.
 
doppelgänger said:
This may be a bit OT, since the thread is about the first.
But since the slayer line is mentioned...

I think that Joss left us with a whole lotta questions at the end of chosen and SOMEONE should write something, do something to clear things up. At least a little bit. Like... ta-da! A Faith spin-off.
The Fray book gives you some answers but it's still, it's a bit blurry.
Click to expand...
A bit? Lol. Yeah, doesn't he want us to know? Is he doing this to tease us? Or is it just that he hasn't really thought this through himself, and there really isn't an answer to these questions..? (Aww, I don't like the last one..)
(OT, sorry)

EDIT: No, not OT since this does concern the questions about The First in CWDP as well as the questions about the slayer line..
 
I'm really havint trouble seeing how this concerns the first... 😉
But anyway, I think it might be as sad as option nr 2. Not sad maybe cause heck, we've got a lot to think about. Maybe he knows some stuff and lets us hang there for future projects (oh I really hope so).
 
doppelgänger said:
I'm really havint trouble seeing how this concerns the first... 😉
But anyway, I think it might be as sad as option nr 2. Not sad maybe cause heck, we've got a lot to think about. Maybe he knows some stuff and lets us hang there for future projects (oh I really hope so).
Click to expand...
I hope so too.
I meant that the question about "why doesn't Joss tell us the truth?" has to do with the slayer line, but also with if Joyce in CWDP in The First and how The First works..
 
I hope it means that he intends to continue the Slayer-saga, somehow. Too bad Angel and Buffy has both been cancelled - but a third spin-off series, perhaps with a brand new cast, would have been nice. Almost nicer than bringing back any of the old guys.

Except Giles. Bring back Giles and I'm a happy man. Perhaps "Ripper" will answer some of these questions, if we are lucky.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom