The First: worst Big Bad ever?

[AvatarofTruth]

Without the Nosferatu uber vamps and Caleb's last minute entrance, and even with them, the First wasn't exactly making us quake in our 'stylish yet affordable boots'. Oooh, I'm so evil 'evil' is afraid of me. I'm made of evil. Seriously, the fear demon in "Fear Itself" was more frightening. Who's the little first evil? Yes, you are.

 

[white avenger]

Well, as you pointed out, the First Evil's real power lay not in what it could do directly, but in what it could influence and empower others to do in its name. Actually, I always thought that the real Big Bad of Season 7 was Caleb, and they missed a great opportunity in not having him lead the charge against Buffy and her little army there in the hellmouth. There wasn't any real reason for her to kill him, or even for him to be there, in the Guardian's crypt. A couple or three particularly vicious uber vamps could've done just as well there, and Ol' Broody could still have managed to stumble in just at the right moment to save Buffy.

 

[AvatarofTruth]

I might be willing to agree with you on the Caleb-as-big-bad front, if he hadn't let her go so many times, and the First hadn't led Buffy to the Caleb and the axe for no reason (expect plot).

 

[white avenger]

I might be willing to agree with you on the Caleb-as-big-bad front, if he hadn't let her go so many times, and the First hadn't led Buffy to the Caleb and the axe for no reason (expect plot).

Angelus had several opportunities to kill Buffy before their final showdown. Buffy fought Glory at least 3 times before the end of the season. She fought Adam at least twice.''

As for finding the axe, there are any number of other ways that that could have been, or even not done at all. The only thing that it really did that was any different than any ordinary weapon was to be used as the focal point of Willow's spell, and even that could be substituted for or simply worked around. There could have been some artifact left by the Shadow Men that would have worked, or simply the mixing or Buffy's and Faith's blood.

 

[Perny]

ooooh I love the Fear itself demon! He was cute!

"Tremble!"

😀 Oh I'm trembling real hard

 

[JCC]

The First was the best Big Bad of all of them. That was the point, the First was just symbolic of Fear, and Fear is the great manipulator. Season 7 was about overcoming oneself, the First was the perfect example of that. Best Big Bad.

 

[Fake Shemp]

For buffy personally Angelus was the worst big bad, and hardest to overcome. For me... I would rather watch Glory all day.

 

[Revolver]

Yeah, I've always felt that The First was the worst big bad. I understand that the First symbolized fear itself, but something powerful that can directly hurt you is scarier than a symbol. I felt more fear for Buffy and crew when they were fleeing from Glory in season five in a seemingly futile effort to keep Dawn safe.

 

[buffbot23]

I have to agree with most on this, the first was the badest of the bad, but it did really strike fear in our hearts like others did. The characters it portrayed struck the most fear, Caleb, the bringers and the Ubervamps.
As White Avenger brought up other characters had been fought against more, but if we count how many times Buffy and the potentials came up agaist Ubervamps, the bringers and Caleb it would be more than once.
I do agree that the scythe wasn't the best thing to forward the plot, but it was what Joss wanted, and that is all that I need.

 

[T.I.P]

It was the worst but i still think it was good. Caleb and the Turokan wereamazing

 

[Perny]

I liked Caleb. The thought of a mortal who endured that much fear... I mean the trio was fun, but hardly ever really evil. They were more egocentric in taking over the world. Caleb was insane and just pure evilness... He creeps me so much out... Kudos Nathan..kudos

 

[ItMustBeBunnies]

I dont think it was the worst big bad ever that honor goes to Adam for me. But yer "how bout The Taunter" does sum it up pretty good. Caleb was awsome though. He was funny at times and the masogany really made me cranky and wanna deck him which I guess makes him a good villan coz he evoked some kinda emotion in me other than "meh". I do think the ability to take shape of their dead loved ones was cool, got to see dru and the mayor and all that again, which of course would have screwed with them on a more emotional level than some of the other villans like adam and the master. The Turokan were just ok for me. It did annoy me that it took so much effort to kill the first one they saw and then hay look at that, Dawnie can take a bunch of em out!, lol. But obviously as Joss has said he wasn't worried about the consitancey with those guys in the end.

 

[Perny]

Maybe spilling blood would make them a bit stronger?

 

[itsxpaperdoll]

I liked the idea of the First but they could have eleborated his character a bit more. Now it was basicaly like, "look at me! I'm a dead person, you can't touch me! I am evil" But the idea was good, it was a nice Big Bad. It made for a nice finale in the end.
But doesn't the obvious Lord of the Rings link here bug anyone? I mean, über evil that can't take material form, turukhan-uruk hai, caves, possessing people? In the beginning I thought like, Hey thats funny, they've watched Lord of the Rings, but when they kept going on it started to annoy me a bit. Not enough to stop watching tho. ^^

 

[Amanda Hannigan]

i loved the idea of the First, and Caleb and the Turokan were pretty scary. But during the whole series, i found that Glory was the most scary villian and out of them all; the First was probably the worst big bad. The idea was good though and i did really enjoy season 7. and i cried my eyes out when it ended :blush:

 

[hannahfngrl26]

The First as the worst big bad? For me it is hard to say. When the season initially aired I was so scared for Buffy. I know Caleb and the uber vamps were just vessels for the first, but they were very scary to me. Anytime there was a scene with either Caleb or the uber vamps I totally would get freaked out that someone who was a mainstay in the cast would die. I mean their strength alone was overwhelming to watch. Overall, I think there have been better big bads but i dont know if the first was the worst necessarily.

 

[La Luna Unita]

I agree that there was a lot of potential with the First that wasn't used. When it comes to a villain taking down their foe, I tend to break their methods into two camps: 1) physically incapacitate or destroy the hero or 2) emotionally wreck them so they can't fight anymore. And, of course, the two can be combined.

The First initially did a great job with the emotional attacks - Willow in the library, Dawn at the house - but the attacks grew more shallow as the season went on. The attacks became the First's equivalent of someone's little brother saying "I'm not touching you, I'm not touching you!" while poking a finger in our beloved Scoobies' faces. Once our heroes were on their guard, the First just didn't have the weight anymore (Although creepiness factor was awesome - remember the potential who died in a hotel? They thought she lived with them for like a week but it was really the First and no one noticed!)

Caleb was great muscle for the First... but yeah, I also agree that he was hobbled by the First's directions (or the writers, whatever). He had the desire to do some truly evil things to our Slayer and her merry band of do-gooders, but he just never got a solid running start. The uber-vamps, whatev. They had no brains. There's a reason humans are still at the top of the food chain even though there aren't Slayers in real life.

I think I'm convinced that the First doesn't get the title of Worst Big Bad - I'd still give that one to Warren. I think if the First were given another shot - say in the comics - some real damage could be done.

p.s. How come the First never directly used Tara as an avatar? Was Amber not available during Season 7 or is there another reason? (Or did she appear and I just don't remember it?)

 

[MikeWelsh]

The First was great but there was one problem to me;
Buffy couldn't kick it's butt!

I was so annoyed with that one factor. Every episode in Season 5, Buffy and Glory were fighting like there was no tomorrow but in this, it was all foot soldiers. The uber-vamps were great in the first arch in the middles of the series but in the last episode, they were just normal vampired. I mean, Buffy (full slayer power) couldnt take one without being beaten up but when everyone else gets a boost, they seem so easy. Thats what I got confused about.

 

[Atren]

The First was worst for me, so much power and so little brain. I said it before, but the First was total idiot felt to me. Most of all it choices of dead persons, or more the lost opportunity with it. I do not mean some long lost friends, but actually using Buffy and Spike to divert them. I bet it would not been hard to get scoobies do something pretending to be Buffy.

Another thing is, did the First even know what it wanted. Seemed like it kept changing or had some weird agenda that made little sense at times.

 

[hazzard]

i still think glory and the spike/drusilla/angelus partnership were the best villains. glory was brilliant--insane and powerful and a young girl like buffy. and spike/drusilla/angelus got buffy the most emotionally. however, the first was an awesome idea and i thought it was really interesting. caleb was scary as hell, too. the first made all the other evil things throughout all of the seasons, so technically, it is the ultimate big bad.