The Problem With Dawn

[TheVoid68]

In Normal Again Dawn is outraged she isn't included in Buffy's escapist fantasy world (really Dawn, that's what you are worried about when your sister is going crazy?). In Dead Things when Buffy wants to go to the police and admit her guilt Dawn somehow gets to the conclusion that this is because Buffy doesn't want to live with her.

These are signs of deep insecurity, but could you really classify them as tantrums?

 

[Icarium]

These are signs of deep insecurity, but could you really classify them as tantrums?

I am not really seeing much difference between my examples and say Dawn's behaviour in Real Me. I don't hate Dawn or anything, she just behaves irrationally sometimes.

 

[dan k]

For me Dawn's character improves as time goes on. In late season 6 and season 7 the bratty behaviour starts to fade as Buffy involves her more in the Scoobies fold. She's notably responsible in early season 7 when in "Beneath you" she accepts she has to stay at home whilst the others go out to look for clues. On previous occasions she would have moped about and got angry.

Also in "Help" she helps Buffy by becoming close friends with Cassie and looking out for her, which is another sign of her growing maturity. The fact that Buffy was teaching her how to fight made her feel involved and important in the battle against evil and so her character became more integral. She had a role in the group whereas before in some episodes it was as if they didn't know what to do with her.

 

[Misty]

I so agree with you. I don't know if I ever acted like Dawn, not just in my teen years. When I watched season 5, I was like 9, and I was still annoyed with her. Maybe some teens act like that, but no one who I know acted like that when they're 15, 16.. She did got better in season 7, though...

Agreed. I really like Dawn, but I don't think she acted like the way she did because she was a teenager. I think she acted like she did because she was going through alot that time and she felt like no one cared about her, but that's just me. And I'm still a teenager in high school and I don't think I act like that either. Yes, I have an older sister who sometimes got moody when she was around 14 or 15, but she never acted like that either. But I do remember me and my sister did not like Dawn when we first starting watching Buffy, and it's weird because I was in middle school. But I'm used to Dawn now, and I really like her as a character and I think her plot was interesting.:cute:

 

[Ms.Trick]

I don't really like Dawn, she kind of pisses me of.
But...I feel sorry for her also.

I mean...When we look at her, she is sort of a big loser you know? No matter how hard she tries, she's just...She never really fits in. It's hard to explain but she doesn't really fit in Buffy's world, in school's world, in slaying's world...She' always a little bit left behind!

But I really really dislike her when she kicks Buffy out of their home. I wanted to scream at her "Hey you! You were not even human at first, not from this world, you were drawn into Buffy's life, she sacrificied in EVERY WAY for someone that isn't really her real sister and you thank her how? By kicking her out of the house?"

GAH.

 

[TaylorSwift]

I have mixed feelings about Dawn. In season 5 she was so whiny all the time..plus the whole "get out, get out, get out" is so overly-dramatic..ok, she just discovered she wasn't real and all was fake, combined with teen angst is justifiable but still can't stand her. In season 6 she really gets on my nerves (apart from rare cases): I hate when she says to Buffy he never cares for her or that she's never home. How dare you Dawn? You were supposed to die and she sacrificed her life mainly for you and what do you say? She's never home because she works for you, every single day plus she just saves countless lives every night. So nobody is going to the mall with you? Big deal. Season 7...that's definitely better, she gets to work and acts instead of complaining..nothing life-altering from the plot point of view but at least she didn't act all childish and crazy..loved how Potential showed her maturity.

 

[crazysoulless]

I thought that Potential showed her immaturity. She thinks she is an SIT and what does she do? She sneaks out her window AGAIN. She knows that Buffy is having dreams of SITs getting butchered around the world. She knows that SITs are arriving at Buffy's doorstep because they aren't safe and need her protection. She knows that Sunnydale is full of Bringers that want to hunt down and kill every SIT in town. And yet she still leaves the house to wander around by herself in the middle of the night on the Hellmouth.

She didn't mature at all from All the Way or Blood Ties.

 

[TaylorSwift]

I thought that Potential showed her immaturity. She thinks she is an SIT and what does she do? She sneaks out her window AGAIN. She knows that Buffy is having dreams of SITs getting butchered around the world. She knows that SITs are arriving at Buffy's doorstep because they aren't safe and need her protection. She knows that Sunnydale is full of Bringers that want to hunt down and kill every SIT in town. And yet she still leaves the house to wander around by herself in the middle of the night on the Hellmouth.

She didn't mature at all from All the Way or Blood Ties.

I think it showed her maturity to accept things when they're not like she thought they would be or maybe she'd like them to be. That's important. Sneaking out the window..ok, dumb..but I'm talking about the general sense of the episode. The writers showed us that yes, she's going her way to maturity but she still has to fully grown up. That's how I see it.

 

[TheVoid68]

I don't really like Dawn, she kind of pisses me of.
But...I feel sorry for her also.

I mean...When we look at her, she is sort of a big loser you know? No matter how hard she tries, she's just...She never really fits in. It's hard to explain but she doesn't really fit in Buffy's world, in school's world, in slaying's world...She' always a little bit left behind!

But I really really dislike her when she kicks Buffy out of their home. I wanted to scream at her "Hey you! You were not even human at first, not from this world, you were drawn into Buffy's life, she sacrificied in EVERY WAY for someone that isn't really her real sister and you thank her how? By kicking her out of the house?"

GAH.

Buffy kicked herself out of the house.

Buffy: I can't stay here and watch [Faith] lead you into battle.
Dawn: Then you can't stay here.

Buffy issued her stupid little ultimatum and Dawn just went with it. She was hoist by her own petard almost.

 

[ApesFindShapes]

I figure the writers had Dawn dress so kiddish to show the contrast between her and the Scoobies.

Although she was made from Buffy, that doesn't mean they are the same person. Buffy is the older sister and fits the "responsible one" stereotype. Dawn is the younger sister and is reckless. It really isn't much different from my sister and I.

I didn't like Dawn in seasons five and six, but, much like my own sister, I began to like her in season seven as she matured. She did have to go over more hurtles in life than your average pre-teen, not to mention always living in Buffy's shadow. When my sister started growing up and becoming less of a whiney tattler, we began to develop a pretty strong bond. I think the writers did a good job of portraying Dawn as the younger sister.

 

[zobothehobo]

I saw too much of my own younger sister in Dawn. She was annoying and got in the way. And she always wanted to be "included" in things she was too young for. She was a bitch about everything. I tell my friends the best thing Dawn ever did was say "I like Britney Spears' early work... before she sold out... so her finger paintings and macaroni drawings. Very underrated."
But yeah, like a lot of others have said... she was so ungrateful even after Buffy gave up EVERYTHING for her. It was like "WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT CHILD?!"

 

[msfantastico87]

I really hated Dawn. But not as much as I hated Warren or Kennedy lol. She did get in the way too much and was just made you want to hang yourself. my youngest sister was like that.

Although I must say, she really starts to step it up and I find myself saying "aww little Dawnie is growing up" after seeing some of the things she does and says in s7, which carries on into s8

 

[BananaBuffy]

Okay, I'll admit here that I haven't seen the whole of the seven seasons and in my time of watching the show I've only seen a minimum of Dawn but I like her. Maybe that's just because I'm a teenager but I don't just outright hate the girl. You're right, what teen isn't whiny and ungrateful sometimes. It takes life expereince to realize the big things about the world but she's fifteen years old, cut her some slack.

Sometimes I find her kind of sweet and she is really realistic. I love her with Willow and Tara in Seeing Red when she see's them together, it was so sweet. And she is grateful for Buffy she just doesn't show it as well as she could. But you can tell she loves her because of the things she says to Spike, which she says even though she loves Spike too.

I don't see anything wrong with Dawn. She's one of the most realistic characters on the show and she does grow up in season seven. Kind of.

 

[AndrewCrossett]

I've been re-watching the series, and it seems to me that, with a few exceptions, Dawn isn't nearly as annoying as I remembered her being.

She only got bad during season 6, when she was no longer the center of attention and thought she was being ignored as everyone paid attention to Resurrected Buffy, and all the drama with Willow and Tara and Xander and Anya. The only times I thought she was really smack-worthy were in "Older and Far Away," and maybe in "As You Were" when she was being bitchy to Riley.

 

[Sommers Summers]

Buffy kicked herself out of the house.

Buffy: I can't stay here and watch [Faith] lead you into battle.
Dawn: Then you can't stay here.

Buffy issued her stupid little ultimatum and Dawn just went with it. She was hoist by her own petard almost.

That is classic Buffy. 😛

]
Sometimes I find her kind of sweet and she is really realistic. I love her with Willow and Tara in Seeing Red when she see's them together, it was so sweet. And she is grateful for Buffy she just doesn't show it as well as she could. But you can tell she loves her because of the things she says to Spike, which she says even though she loves Spike too.

I don't see anything wrong with Dawn. She's one of the most realistic characters on the show and she does grow up in season seven. Kind of.

I kinda agree there. Problem with most of us is that, we tend to compare Dawn to an unreasonable level, to Buffy, thinking that she'd inherit Buffy's mantle. Point is, she's not Chosen, not a Potential, not a Wiccan, not anything but herself.

Thus, a direct comparison to Buffy is plain wrong. If one must compare, one should have compared to Xander. To which, I think she's actually OK. We place Dawn on Buffy's pedestal, and expect much. Is that realistic?

Where Buffy is an achiever, Dawn can never be one. Dawn is a brutal realist, and her position mandates that. Nothing wrong about that. I feel that's to be expected. In fact, she's wise to do so.

Imagine if Dawn was really all we wanted her to be, a Potential, someone powerful and great. Sounds wonderful, doesn't it? but what will the endpoint be? Surely, if this goes on, this will lead to a rivalry between Buffy and Dawn. If Buffy wins, we'll all rejoice. Won't we? But that is NOT the point.

If DAWN wins, then it'll be like the UK Labour Party which elected Ed Milliband, the younger brother as leader over David Milliband, the older brother.Specifically, the trade unions swung against David. The Labour MPs were in disdain.

But if David Milliband won, the UNIONS would be outraged, since it would be "more of the old, Blairites", the big bullies small, etc.

This would be what happens if Dawn was equally powered and "useful".
Therefore, we need to see that Dawn is not supposed to be compared to Buffy at all, but held in her own regard.

I've been re-watching the series, and it seems to me that, with a few exceptions, Dawn isn't nearly as annoying as I remembered her being.

Odd, huh? Actually, not so much, when you consider that she's not Buffy.

 

[Hale Caesar]

I hate Dawn. In season 5 I didn't mind her because the whole "Key" thing kept her important to the story. Season 6 she was just annoying and had no relevance to the story. I'm in the middle of season 6, and I hate whenever Dawn is on camera and I doubt that will change

 

[sylvanscribe]

Dawn in Seasons 5 and 6 is insufferable. Not coincidentally, those are my least 2 favorite seasons.

In season 7 they actually rehabilitated Dawn to something tolerable. She was given something to do besides whine and get kidnapped. She became almost a contributing member of the group, and actually started acting like she was 16 (or whatnot) rather than 12.

The comics reversed this trend, sadly. They made her even more ridiculous than Season 5.

 

[Sommers Summers]

Dawn in Seasons 5 and 6 is insufferable. Not coincidentally, those are my least 2 favorite seasons.

In season 7 they actually rehabilitated Dawn to something tolerable. She was given something to do besides whine and get kidnapped. She became almost a contributing member of the group, and actually started acting like she was 16 (or whatnot) rather than 12.

The comics reversed this trend, sadly. They made her even more ridiculous than Season 5.

Season 8 is one big mess, and I wish that it wasn't canon.

 

[SlayerFae]

Okay... I've been watching season 7 for so long that I got lulled into a sense of security about Dawn. I'm watching "Older and Far Away..." Oh. My. God.... I totally forgot how irritated she used to make me. I've actually fast forwarded past most of her complaining this episode... especially the return of "getoutgetout GET OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" *shudders*

---------- Post added at 08:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:25 PM ----------

zobothehobo agrees: I love everything about that episode except Dawn. She royally pisses me off beyond all comprehension.

Seriously.... sadly enough, without Dawn's annoying insecurity, the episode would never have happened, but if she could have just shut the hell up after making the wish, then that would have made the episode much... MUCH better. It was a good episode otherwise though. The posturing from Spike, Anya's claustrophobia, and the Willow/Tara post break up interaction. And also the posturing from Spike *snickers* OH OH AND CLEM!

 

[zobothehobo]

Seriously.... sadly enough, without Dawn's annoying insecurity, the episode would never have happened, but if she could have just shut the hell up after making the wish, then that would have made the episode much... MUCH better. It was a good episode otherwise though. The posturing from Spike, Anya's claustrophobia, and the Willow/Tara post break up interaction. And also the posturing from Spike *snickers* OH OH AND CLEM!

Exactly.

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