Things that could have been dealt better

Blaze

Let it Burn
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Black Thorn
What are things that you think season 7 could have dealt with better, or give a better resolution too?

The big obvious ones to me are Spike's rape storyline that went...well nowhere and also Willow's addiction storyline that miraculously went away and she was now fine to do magic.

I wish they would have shown more closer scene of Tara dying. I know Willow visited her grave, but they could at least have one of the Scooby mention that they miss her once in a while. It was like she never even existed. She was like Dawn's sister and her and Buffy were getting really close and then poof three months later they're over it😕

I may come up with some more later!
 
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Spikefan31
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Kean
Kean
Would you settle for a completely different S6? Where Giles doesn't leave, Willow doesn't go evil, Tara lives and um Spike's tragically trips and falls heart first on a stake? ;) :p
I would go with pretty much everything that was introduced in Season 6.

Nothing from that season was dealt with in Season 7. Willow's magic addiction, Xander and Anya's break up, Buffy's depression, Spike's sexual assault on Buffy, Dawn's feelings of insecurity and loss, Tara's death - not one of these events was explored, dealt with or examined properly over the course of Season 7.

Let's face it, Season 7 is just one big mess.
 
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Yosso
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zooeygreenway
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Fredsicle
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Alright, mount up, this thread could get messy.

For starters, I really wish they'd dealt with the Willow/drug angle more thoroughly. Or, you know, at all. I wasn't a fan of the drug metaphor direction they went in S6, but I at least understood it. Then they just threw it all out the window in S7, and I honestly believe that's because of sheer laziness on the part of the writers. They couldn't think of a good arc for Willow that didn't involve magic, so to keep her around and keep her...um..."interesting", they just gave some lame excuse and boom, she could use magic again (it's "a part of her now" might be the dumbest cop out ever. Like ever. Seriously, try telling a heroin addict that they can use dope again because it's a "part of them". Wow).

The other was the "Commander Buffy" arc they went with. On the whole, I had no problem with it. However, I felt like she could have been smarter. All the benevolent lords and kings in the middle of war on Game of Thrones are hard and often unrelenting too, but that doesn't mean they don't listen to people. I think that S7 proved that Buffy may be a decent battle leader, but she's a failure as a ruler. She was often proved right, but at the same time it sometimes felt like she was only right because the plot required it, not because she actually out-thought Faith or the Potentials. I'd have to give that more thought on a case-by-case basis though.
 
Kean
Kean
"I will support Angel until the bitter end... and then some." F*ck Yeah Team Forehead! :D
Everything. All of the things.

Everything left over from S6: Buffy being resurrected, her depression, SPIKE!, and his attempted rape of Buffy, Willow's addiction, the neglect of Dawn, Tara dying, Xander self-destructing spectacularly, Giles abandoning his charge at the point he was most needed, the fact that the Scoobies fell apart completely as a support system, Willow tried to end the world and killed people for fun. And all of this is all just for starters.

I feel like if these issues are dealt with properly, we avoid the biggest issues of S7 which is that Scoobies don't trust each other and end up playing against each other. That leads to rogue!Giles and Dictator Buffy. It leads to the Potentials being completed neglected, it leads to "Spike is my only friend" BS.

When you think about it, the best way to avoid the crap shoot of S7 is to not have S6. I'd be really okay with that. 😛 😀
 
Blaze
Blaze
I agreed with your post till you said "not have season 6" now I disagree ;) lol
R
Robb Stark
Agreed on all counts
I pretty much agree with everyone concerning how the writers decided to pretty much drop all the issues they had raised in S6 to focus on more of a 'big picture' arc. The show became less character centred and more plot-focused, and there the show lost its way. Buffy somehow just got over her depression, Xander and Anya just plodded along, Buffy never rebonded with Dawn and taught her to fight and Willow moved on rather quickly having gone through such trauma post-Tara (I think she should have just stayed single) and Spuffy, who I adored in S6, just got turned into barf-worthy mush.

Alright, mount up, this thread could get messy.

For starters, I really wish they'd dealt with the Willow/drug angle more thoroughly. Or, you know, at all. I wasn't a fan of the drug metaphor direction they went in S6, but I at least understood it. Then they just threw it all out the window in S7, and I honestly believe that's because of sheer laziness on the part of the writers. They couldn't think of a good arc for Willow that didn't involve magic, so to keep her around and keep her...um..."interesting", they just gave some lame excuse and boom, she could use magic again (it's "a part of her now" might be the dumbest cop out ever. Like ever. Seriously, try telling a heroin addict that they can use dope again because it's a "part of them". Wow).

With Willow's addiction, I don't think that it's the magic itself that was the problematic issue, it's the abusive way she used it. I don't think equating magic to drugs works as a metaphor; it's too simplistic. Magic can often be used to positive productive effect for the greater long-term good, the same thing can't be said for drugs. So because of that I don't see a problem with Willow continuing to use magic in S7, the fact she stopped using it simply for her own personal gain and pretty much exclusively when it was needed in the Scoobies' efforts is definitely a step forward for Willow in her recovery.
 
Willow never had a problem with the amount of magic she used. It was Tara that had a problem with the amount of magic Willow used and put her values onto Willow.
So Willow didn't need to find help for her 'addiction' she needed help to get away from Tara's beliefs.
When Tara was shot, Willow became vulnerable because of the doubts that Tara installed in her.
If Willow had been able to continue to use magic as she was and not be restrained by Tara's religious values she would not have fallen to be 'Dark Willow'.
The issue was not of Willow's use of magic, it was the dominance of Tara on Willow. If anything it was a type of peer pressure by Tara, in much the same way that a Christian might react to a pagan.
 
Season 7, is at large, a complete and utter mess.

The attempted rape storyline went nowhere. Tara was largely forgotten apart from the seemingly necessary mourning scene at her grave, and her indirect part in "Killer In Me'. Willow/Kennedy was thrown together as a makeshift replacement for Willow/Tara. Buffy acted completely emotionless to the Potentials. The plot hole regarding Ubervamps

Joss, what the holy hell were you thinking?
 
The attempted rape: Buffy wanted to forget that it ever happened, to be able to put it out of her mind completely. Who was it that mentioned it the most? Spike did when he tried to apologise.
Willow/Kennedy: What you saw was Willow in a relationship where the other person wasn't trying to stop her using magic. Did Willow start to be like an older version of herself again?
 
What are things that you think season 7 could have dealt with better, or give a better resolution too?

Okay, let's get the BIG ONE out of the way first. At some point, probably at the end of "Showtime" or the beginning of "Potential," Buffy should have gathered all of the gang together and made an official announcement to the effect that anything that had gone on between Spike and her in the past, and anything that might happen between them in the future would be between them, and them alone. No interfering or meddling, however well meant, by friends, ex Watchers, mystical keys, or Slayer offspring would be either appreciated or tolerated. Anyone incapable of understanding and accepting that as fact would be free to move over to Angel's show for the rest of the season.

Secondly, Buffy should have made it clear that anyone living under her roof and eating at her table was subject to her authority. Suggestions, if presented properly, would be considered, but the ultimate decision in all things will be made by her. Once more, anyone who has a problem with that is free to move out, no hard feelings.

With those two hings settled, the season could have moved along just fine.

Once Angel arrived with the amulet, Buffy should have graciously let him wear the damn thing, if that was what he really wanted to do, and if he was willing to follow orders like a good little vampire. Then, when he heroically incinerated in the hellmouth, Buffy and Spike could have gone to Europe and built a Slayer army together.

(Though it's not really part of the question, I'll add this)

Faith would move to LA and work with Angel's gang at Wolfram & Hart, where the first order of business would be for super lawyer Charles Gunn to reduce Faith's sentence to time served. When ghostly Angel pops up, Faith would help the Fang Gang return him to solid form, then move to her own series.
 
S
Sweet J
An Alt history that might have been much more interesting
Aimee
Aimee
Yes!
You know what's a huge misconception a I had between the first time I saw S7 and the my re-watch? "Chosen".

I loved the episode the first time through and I still really like it, but I find now that while the emotional aspects of it, the Buffy/Angel/Spike scenes, the feel of it all (and of course the music, which was just amazing), the actual plot of the episode itself makes zero, and I mean ZERO, sense. It was like they handed a six year old tactical command of their final battle.

Assuming that Buffy, Angel and Spike had no idea what the W&H amulet actually did, and there's no real indication beyond a line or two from Angel that they did, Buffy's invasion of the Hellmouth was beyond stupid. It was just plain suicidal, with no actual goal in mind at all. Even if Willow's spell had worked, that still would have given Buffy about 20 Slayers against literally thousands and thousands of ubervamps. They were dead no matter what Willow did. Having Anya, Xander, Dawn, Andrew and even Giles there accomplished nothing. We'd seen how immensely powerful the umbervamps were. There was nothing they could do except attempt to stay alive. And the whole idea of "containing" them in the school was just dumb. It was the middle of the day! Where were they going to go? A FAR more logical plan would have been to spend however long it took shearing the roof off the school, leading the vamps out of the Hellmouth into it and then collapsing the whole thing for them to be dusted by the sun.

One other thing I found strange, not bad, but strange, was the concept of the amulet. It didn't bug me, but having the franchise villain and the hero of another show essentially solve the problem, and then secondary hero (Spike) win the day at the end was kind of an odd way to end the series. I mean, if you take Buffy out of the equation entirely in "Chosen", and play out the Spike/Angel/amulet thing the same way, the heroes still win. Buffy really didn't do a significant amount in the end.
 
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Yosso
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tabrizi
This. All this.
[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]
Secondly, Buffy should have made it clear that anyone living under her roof and eating at her table was subject to her authority. Suggestions, if presented properly, would be considered, but the ultimate decision in all things will be made by her. Once more, anyone who has a problem with that is free to move out, no hard feelings.

...and less than 5 minutes later there's only one person left in the Summer's house and that's Buffy. I'd love to see that, it's far more humiliating than what actually happens in "Empty Places".
 
Black Eye Guy
Black Eye Guy
Couldnt agree more!
[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]


...and less than 5 minutes later there's only one person left in the Summer's house and that's Buffy. I'd love to see that, it's far more humiliating than what actually happens in "Empty Places".

Actually, there would have been two. Buffy and Spike.

And since so many people say that it's just a "Buffy and Spike season" anyhow, we just eliminate the non essentials.
 
Where do I start....

too many deus ex machinas... the toys r us axe, the amulet, etc. With Chosen, they could have gotten really creative in the destruction of the hellmouth, like how creative they were in The Gift and Graduation Day, part 2, but the whole plan seemed incredibly suicidal. I've always struggled to buy the concept that a slayer, means physically stronger than all the demons. I mean, I understand Buffy surviving it (just by a bit) but all the newly awakened Slayers, it doesn't make any sense.

Alot of the aspects I loved in season 7 seemed rushed, fitted into one episode. I thought there was enough material in Selfless to be stretched out and expanded on for a longer time. A 1000 year old character's past only gets one episode to shine. As opposed to on Angel, Darla, a character with just as a fascinating history, gets alot of space to shine in- Selfless could have been a two-parter or its own arc. It's kind of the same with Willow: her feelings of displacement, guilt and alienation among her friends are heavily focused on Same Time, Same Place and then ditched completely.

Too. Many. Speeches. They gave me headaches and made me feel tired. Thinking about them makes me want to go to sleep. Seriously, did any character have a conversation with any other character without it morphing into a speech?

Lack of suspense and danger. Only two episodes end on successful scary, suspenseful note: Dirty Girls and CWDP. It's a gross season: we see Willow's skin get eaten, but it's not really scary. All of these speeches *yawn* kind of take away the suspense. When I saw End Of Days for the first time, the ending with Buffy/ Angel kissing, Spike growling... considering its the second last episode of the series, it's kind of a bad note to end on. Think of other notes other second lasts episodes have ended on: Buffy finding Kendra's body, Faith falling onto the truck, stabbed, Buffy waking up from a catatonic state full of dread and despair, Giles walking into the magic shop... from Touched onwards, all the feel of despair and dread was all gone. By Bring On The Night, you could pretty much figure out that Buffy was going to win, to me, it was always about 'is my favourite character gonna make it'.

The feminist message doesn't work at all. In the season seven special feature, the potentials idea were pretty much ''people who needed saving''. By portraying said woman as merely damsels for a large chuck of the season, it takes away from the feminist integrity. Also, for about six seasons, we see the downsides of being a slayer: as Buffy says in Becoming Part 2, she talks about how lonely and dangerous it is. In Fool For love, she says she has an 'expiry date'. She gets ripped out of heaven. The mythology of it: Shadow men, watchers council... forcing it onto a girl. And Willow and Buffy does the same to thousands of girls. Even if they aren't 'alone' that doesn't mean much... they'll be removed from the world, thrown into a new one. Also: so, you've made a very misogynist character called Caleb. He's incredible powerful, and can 'render a slayer useless within one punch'. You can connect this to deus ex machinas: how he suddenly, over the course of a couple of episodes, become less and less powerful makes zero sense. So, a female can only be empowered if the plot says so? That's trash. Also, the Buffy and Spike relationship is a travesty on so many levels. Seeing Buffy cuddle and comfort the man who undermined her, verbally and physically abused her, attempted to sexually assault her is awful, insensitive on so many levels.

Xander. Poor, poor, Xander. Not coz of the eye, I mean, hey, there goes that nice construction career but he just stands there to make other characters look better. The two speeches by Xander people go on and on about: that speech to Dawn in Potential, and about Buffy's 'heart' in Dirty Girls, are all about Xander saying how great other characters are. But who is making speeches about Xander? You know, that guy who had the required heart to stop Willow in Grave. The one who told Angelus to back off in Killed By Death. And in End Of Days, Buffy says that Xander is the 'reason she got this far' 'her strength' which is all nice, but what does Buffy want Xander to do? To render Dawn unconscious and take her out of Sunnydale. Really, writers? Your attempts at connection between characters have never seemed more phoney.

Buffy is so unlikeable in this season, if she was like this in season one, no one would watch the show. Seriously, what was Whedon thinking? She has like one facial expression in the whole entire season. She makes fun of Chloe, a poor girl who killed herself (and btw, nice triggering of a very sensitive issue, idiot writers and directors). She tells Wood that she'd let her knight, Spike, kill him if he attempts to kill the man who killed his mother again. She holds poor Andrew over the hellmouth, gives him an incredibly self righteous lecture, says that his blood is the cure, and then psyche! it's tears. That is ethically wrong on so many levels.That's like trying to get a urine sample by forcing someone to chug a tonne of water. Why not just say, hey Andrew, could you please cry in front of a hellmouth? If not, just think: Stargate is cancelled. Would it kill the writers to give us a likeable main character?

More MOTW, please. Hush, Doppelgangland, OMWF, Halloween... fun episodes that did a great job at keeping the plot moving.

Okay I'll stop.
 
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EffyStonem
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EVIL UU
EVIL UU
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Mitchy121
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Where do I start....

That's like trying to get a urine sample by forcing someone to chug a tonne of water. Why not just say, hey Andrew, could you please cry in front of a hellmouth? If not, just think: Stargate is cancelled. .

This on time in anatomy, the prof made us chug a gallon of water to see how much it would make us pee...we had to collect the samples in those little container...I don`t know where I`m going with this...


But I like your post!😀
 
I
itssmiletime
lol your post made me laugh... wow, that must have been one awkward lecture.... i'm really immature, i'll stop laughing :)
I wish instead of introducing Kennedy, that Xander or Dawn was there for Willow, which will give both of them something to do that season. They were completely neglected, especially Xander.
 
The feminist message doesn't work at all. In the season seven special feature, the potentials idea were pretty much ''people who needed saving''. By portraying said woman as merely damsels for a large chuck of the season, it takes away from the feminist integrity.

Yes, which is why I find it baffling that so many fans find "Chosen" empowering. To me the message is that if you are a woman (or a man for that matter) with no superpowers you are just a useless burden on the superior folk with superpowers. How inspiring this is not...

Willow never had a problem with the amount of magic she used. It was Tara that had a problem with the amount of magic Willow used and put her values onto Willow.

Yeah, Rack's crack den was all Tara's imagination, right? No matter if Tara was right or wrong about how magic is to be used (and really, her opinions changed depending on the current needs of the plot), one doesn't just recover from an addiction by getting high some more.

If Willow had been able to continue to use magic as she was and not be restrained by Tara's religious values she would not have fallen to be 'Dark Willow'.

Yes, because Willow was doing just great when she ignored Tara in say Tabula Rasa, right? Is your argument that Willow was deluded into thinking she was addicted? If yes, how is that Tara's fault? She was barely around when this happened. And the whole thing was clearly shown to be a physical addiction anyway. It wasn't Tara's idea that Willow should go "cold turkey", it was Willow's. If you we are to blame someone other than Willow, I think we should blame Giles who disappeared and then in S7 had miraculously learned all there is to know about magic addiction and stuff.
 
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itssmiletime
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Blaze
Blaze
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EVIL UU
EVIL UU
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I really wish they would have done more with the school. The first 7 standalones were so good, and I loved the background arc that was happening. It reminded me a lot of the first 2 seasons, where each episode was standalone, but there was a major arc occurring. I wish this season could have been more like this, than one big arc starting with episode 8. It got way too intense, and I honestly feel like the First/Slayer army arc should have been over 2 seasons instead of one. There simply was not enough time given properly to everything that was going on.
 
S
Sweet J
I was really excited when S7 began too, as it appeared to be that the writers were back in the vein of S2. Sadly, as you discuss they dropped the ball as S7 went on and it all mad speechy
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