Question Vampires being popular - Believeable?

[Skytteflickan88]

I can actually see why this happened, vampire being accepted so easily.

I'm a white woman from Sweden, and I don't think we've had any black slaves for hundreds of years,, maybe not since the vikings, but I still feel "the shame" over what "our" people did to the blacks in America just a while ago.

I also feel shame that Sweden kind of bent over for Hitler during the war, so there's a lot of shame in Sweden was well. Basically, we're not allowed to be proud of who we are. I we say "Yay Sweden", we're considered ignorant racists. Not sure if it's as bad in America, but I definitly think saying "Damned honky" goes over easier there than saying the N-word, even if it's said in a non hostile way. The "white shame and blame" goes on there as well. And I assume people of all colors are somewhat ashame of the hate against the jews.

To sum up, I and a lot of swedish, american and other western people feel like we've made bad judgements in the past, based on prejucide that was nothing but myth. We've treated people who were different badly, even though they're not actually different.

So I can, with some vomit-feelings, believe that people would be glad to accept a "people" that claim they have been haunted by wanna bee nazis.

I'm not saying it's smart, I'm saying it could happen. But I do hope we some some anti-vampires feelings in season 9. I mean, all the nazis and racists got to have a opinion as well, don't they? And vampires do drink blood, proving they're different than humans in other ways than just having bumpies in the face we don't. Should make people wonder about all the deaths in the world caused by blood loss and puncture wounds...

 

[white avenger]

As for why vampires are so popular in Season 8, if you recall, there was a group in Season 2 who envied vampires and called them "the Lonely Ones." (I have always loved the scene in that episode when Angel is ranting at the group for "Not knowing a single thing about vampires, how they live, how they hunt, how they dress..." at which point he sees a vamp wannabe dressed exactly like he is) I'm surprised that Joss let that little egg incubate for so long before letting it hatch completely in Season 8, and I have a sneaking suspicion that it'll be a fully grown issue in Season 9, maybe going so far as to replace the traditional "Big Bad" as the Season's villain, especially once the word leaks out about the "noble hero vampire" who actually raised an army to try and quell the Slayer menace, who even managed to kill one of the Slayers' main henchmen before being defeated by Slayer treachery. "He still exists somewhere today, imprisoned and no doubt tortured by the evil Buffy and her minions, just waiting and praying for rescue and release from his capture, still nobel, and with spirit unbroken by his torturers, a hero to both humans and vampires alike." (See, there's Angel's way to walk away smelling like a rose, and even emerging as the champion of all mankind.)

 

[Skytteflickan88]

That could happen I guess. Maybe even word get out it's that vampire detective from LA who's her prisoner, the one proven to be good.

It will actually be very interesting to see the two universes melt together on the vampire issue. Will Angel, the vampre detective be talked about among people? Will the truth of souls come out? Because people in LA seemed to get, or at least know it's a theory, that most vamps don't have souls, like that actress turned vampire that bit that female TV hostess? Would be interesting to see Harmony saying "Oh, yeah, her, she's was PMsing, not her fault. Btw, I heard that hostess was a slayer anyway."

 

[Icarium]

As for why vampires are so popular in Season 8, if you recall, there was a group in Season 2 who envied vampires and called them "the Lonely Ones."

But those people were: A) portrayed as a bunch of gullible fools B) seemed to change their minds once they saw that vampires were willing to eat them. Quite a difference from S8. Seems to me the writers are in the position of Chantarelle et al, since they are so fascinated by vampires that they put Harmony and Dracula in roles they didn't belong at all and make everyone else look like a fool for accepting them. Just because vampires are so popular in fiction doesn't mean they will be accepted if they suddenly turn out to be real. Most fans like Spike, Anya and Angel but in real life I would venture that the vast majority of them would never go anywhere near a serial murderer. I am not so sure about the writers, though...

To sum up, I and a lot of swedish, american and other western people feel like we've made bad judgements in the past, based on prejucide that was nothing but myth. We've treated people who were different badly, even though they're not actually different.

So I can, with some vomit-feelings, believe that people would be glad to accept a "people" that claim they have been haunted by wanna bee nazis.

Vampires aren't people. Their acceptance makes precious little sense, especially considering the Initiative and its successor special ops have spent years exterminating demons and vampires. Now they are suddenly so scared of the Slayers that they like vampires? Come on now. Even a cursory interrogation of Harmony would reveal she was persecuted because she is a serial murderer. It's not as if she has the brains to deceive anyone. Yet she somehow managed to deceive the whole world. Hmm, I wonder if that's a meta comment on the writers producing crap that's still bought?

And funnily enough, vampires should be just pissed at Harmony as Buffy is. Their strongest weapon is secrecy, once the public realizes they are evil, they are going to be hunted mercilessly by more than just a bunch of Slayers.

Not to mention there is the problem of this whole storyline being written almost as an afterthought while it's the biggest gamechanger in the entire series. Turning the secret war into an overt conflict should have been explored more. But no, apparently the only goal was to make fun of the people who are obsessed with vampires and to make Buffy into a persecuted martyr once more.

 

[VisionGirl]

I didn't start reading season 8 until this past summer, so I don't know how the timing worked on all this, but the idea of vampires "coming out" to the general public wasn't an original concept to me because my husband is a True Blood fan.

Vampires coming out was not a favorite plot device of mine in season 8, particularly because I couldn't stand Harmony. I liked Harmony in ATS (season 5 especially), but I didn't think she translated well to the comics, for me at least. On the show she was ditzy, funny, quirky, and kind of likeable, in the comics she was just plain annoying.

In general I think it was unnecessary- the Slayer army could've been hated just as easily without the vamps coming out as sympathetic. I think it would've been much more consistent with the general public's typical apathy toward the supernatural world in the Buffyverse if they had just said "Slayers? What are they slaying? Vampires? Yeah, right, they're probably just a rogue terrorist organization using that as a front."

 

[Skytteflickan88]

Vampires aren't people. Their acceptance makes precious little sense, especially considering the Initiative and its successor special ops have spent years exterminating demons and vampires. Now they are suddenly so scared of the Slayers that they like vampires?

I don't think it's been mentioned anywhere that the military likes vampires. It's just the public.

And my point is, it doesn't matter that vampires aren't "people". It's that the general public don't know if they're evil or good, they just know they're persecuted by slayers. They believe what they want to believe.

And funnily enough, vampires should be just pissed at Harmony as Buffy is. Their strongest weapon is secrecy, once the public realizes they are evil, they are going to be hunted mercilessly by more than just a bunch of Slayers.

I really hope we see more vampires like the chick from Carpe Noctem soon, that hate that Harmony has made them seem nice. But I bet a lot of vampires are glad they can get away with murder (anyone accuse them of rape, torture, murder, they can just say "She was a slayer" or "The person accusing me is a slayer").

Not to mention there is the problem of this whole storyline being written almost as an afterthought while it's the biggest gamechanger in the entire series. Turning the secret war into an overt conflict should have been explored more. But no, apparently the only goal was to make fun of the people who are obsessed with vampires and to make Buffy into a persecuted martyr once more.

I don't think we've seen the last of the vampire craze. I bet it will be a big theme for season 9, and it will be more than joke and martyrdom.

 

[BuffyThoughts]

Vampires aren't people. Their acceptance makes precious little sense, especially considering the Initiative and its successor special ops have spent years exterminating demons and vampires. Now they are suddenly so scared of the Slayers that they like vampires?
...

Not to mention there is the problem of this whole storyline being written almost as an afterthought while it's the biggest gamechanger in the entire series. Turning the secret war into an overt conflict should have been explored more. But no, apparently the only goal was to make fun of the people who are obsessed with vampires and to make Buffy into a persecuted martyr once more.

The "original story" about vampires is certainly that they are not people are less than people, less worthy to live, not qualifying as moral agents. That goes back to Bram Stoker or earlier. But in Buffy ... the notion of "vampireness" has become so muddled, we're not sure just in what ways people and vampires are different. The vampires often appear so "human like" that it is indeed believable that vampires would be embraced by the public. It seems like the writers never worked out just what being a vampire might mean. That's a drawback to this show, if not a weakness in the verse.

Oh, I agree, the storyline seems to be written "almost as an afterthought" as you say. If they were going to do it at all, they should've done much more with it. Unless ... wait until S9?

 

[Icarium]

I don't think it's been mentioned anywhere that the military likes vampires. It's just the public.

The government could have shown ample proof that vampires are monsters. They don't seem to have bothered to do so. Then again they seem threatened by Slayers - people who die with one bullet, so I reckon the fictional rulers are even stupider than those in the real world. 🙂

But I bet a lot of vampires are glad they can get away with murder (anyone accuse them of rape, torture, murder, they can just say "She was a slayer" or "The person accusing me is a slayer").

While I do have an almost endless belief in the power of human stupidity, I really don't think this could work in the long run.

I don't think we've seen the last of the vampire craze. I bet it will be a big theme for season 9, and it will be more than joke and martyrdom.

I bet it will be swept under the carpet. If everyone hates vampires and knows how to protect themselves from them then Buffy becomes almost completely irrelevant.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

The government could have shown ample proof that vampires are monsters. They don't seem to have bothered to do so. Then again they seem threatened by Slayers - people who die with one bullet, so I reckon the fictional rulers are even stupider than those in the real world. 🙂

I wouldn't be suprised if the military figured that the vampire problem could be dealt with later, after the slayer problem. Or, they simply don't dare too. I mean, who trust the US goverment these days? If they said "vampires are evil, here's proof" people would doubt the accurancy of that proof.

And as long as vampires are evil, slayers are too. If I were them, I'd let the mobs take care of the slayers, before I say "Oh, wait, vampire are evil. Get them." This way, one target help take out the other.

And I think the military don't know enough about slayers or their strength not to worry (let's not forget that bullets only stop people if they stand still in open view, not if they're hiding in squads all over the world, the way slayers were). Specially since they think their leader likes blowing up towns.

Humans fear what they don't understand. Military, civilians, all the same.

While I do have an almost endless belief in the power of human stupidity, I really don't think this could work in the long run.

Vampirs are often shown to not be big-picture thinkers. Or thinkers at all. But yeah, in the end, people will realize what vampires are. But by then, they might have turned the president...

Now that would make more a interesting season 9. In the end, everyone would turn to Buffy for help to defeat the vampire threat. 😀

 

[white avenger]

But those people were: A) portrayed as a bunch of gullible fools B) seemed to change their minds once they saw that vampires were willing to eat them.

I remember a survivor of the Holocaust once saying something along the lines that, "At first we thought that the Nazis were just a little bunch or relatively harmless radicals. By the time we realized the truth, it was too late." And as for the people who changed their minds about vampires once they realized that the vampires were willing to eat them, by that time they were either dead or turned. In neither case would they be raising any kind of alarm about what vampires REALLY were.

 

[VisionGirl]

Now that would make more a interesting season 9. In the end, everyone would turn to Buffy for help to defeat the vampire threat. 😀

But that would make another big-picture season, something that most readers say that they DON'T want.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

But that would make another big-picture season, something that most readers say that they DON'T want.

Nah, I think it could be done in a small picture way. The season doesn't have to end with a big battle or something like that, making it a mayor theme.

But a few panels here and there, maybe a one shot, about how the public starts questioning things, maybe how Buffy and a few military guys have to work together to stop a vampire gang killing off Twilight-fans or something. Angel could help, him being a celebrity and all. Then civilians start wondering if their prejudice of the slayers isn't a bit ironic. I mean, they hate all slayers because they think all slayers hate all vampires. They're prejudiced as well, and they should realize that.

 

[white avenger]

But that would make another big-picture season, something that most readers say that they DON'T want.

Not necessarily. It could be done just like a movie about a single combat unit in World War 2. Sure, there's a "big picture," and there's even reference to it occasionally, but the main action concerns what is happening specifically to Buffy and her single platoon of Slayers and friends.