Gum Gnome33
"Well, yeah..."
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2011
- Messages
- 1,148
Toward the beginning of "Selfless" when Spike is still in the basement, he imagines that Buffy is sitting in front of him, as he tries to explain to her that he's been seeing things and that he's in trouble. She's, (the vision), is patient and kind, and when she offers him help, Spike declines and says that he can't expect her to take care of him, not after what he's done to her. This is the scene, for reference:
Buffy's wearing a white shirt and an open, non-judgmental face.
BUFFY (compassionate and patient) Spike.
SPIKE I'm in trouble, Buffy.
BUFFY I can help you.
SPIKE I could never ask. Not after...
BUFFY It's different. You're different.
SPIKE I could never ask.
BUFFY Spike, it's me. It's you and it's me, and we'll get through this.
SPIKE Never...
BUFFY We'll get through this.
Seconds later we see the real Buffy appear and she's harsh, demanding that he leave the basement as it's making him crazy.
At the time, we know Spike has been having lots of visits from the First who as appeared as Buffy among others. Though there is evidence of the First visiting people as loved ones and attempting to create pleasant encounters in order to manipulate them, the purpose is clearly to get them to give in/give up. When Joyce appears to Buffy in the form of the First, this is the case.
Personally, I don't think it's likely that it was the First that came to Spike in this particular encounter. What would be the purpose of reassuring him and making him think he is going to be taken care of? It might just be Spike "going crazy" but in every other instance of that, it's the First who is behind it. Even in Amends when Angel is being visited by the spirits of the people he's killed and wronged, it was always the First, with the purpose of getting him to take himself out of the game.
This is different. Any theories as to what Spike is seeing? If it's really just his imagination, I believe this would be the only time anyone in the show has completely imagined an entire encounter without any supernatural involvement, (or dreaming).
Another interesting thing to consider: a very similar encounter actually does take place a few episodes later, in "Never Leave Me," when they are in Buffy's basement and she tells him that she believes in him and she won't kill him, though he's begging her to on account of all the horrible things he's done in his life.
So, could it be that Spike actually had some sort of premonition back in "Selfless?" Or am I reading too much into it; was it simply that his desires came true? Or was it The First, somehow attempting to manipulate Spike in a completely unusual way? If so, what do you think its plan was?
Buffy's wearing a white shirt and an open, non-judgmental face.
BUFFY (compassionate and patient) Spike.
SPIKE I'm in trouble, Buffy.
BUFFY I can help you.
SPIKE I could never ask. Not after...
BUFFY It's different. You're different.
SPIKE I could never ask.
BUFFY Spike, it's me. It's you and it's me, and we'll get through this.
SPIKE Never...
BUFFY We'll get through this.
Seconds later we see the real Buffy appear and she's harsh, demanding that he leave the basement as it's making him crazy.
At the time, we know Spike has been having lots of visits from the First who as appeared as Buffy among others. Though there is evidence of the First visiting people as loved ones and attempting to create pleasant encounters in order to manipulate them, the purpose is clearly to get them to give in/give up. When Joyce appears to Buffy in the form of the First, this is the case.
Personally, I don't think it's likely that it was the First that came to Spike in this particular encounter. What would be the purpose of reassuring him and making him think he is going to be taken care of? It might just be Spike "going crazy" but in every other instance of that, it's the First who is behind it. Even in Amends when Angel is being visited by the spirits of the people he's killed and wronged, it was always the First, with the purpose of getting him to take himself out of the game.
This is different. Any theories as to what Spike is seeing? If it's really just his imagination, I believe this would be the only time anyone in the show has completely imagined an entire encounter without any supernatural involvement, (or dreaming).
Another interesting thing to consider: a very similar encounter actually does take place a few episodes later, in "Never Leave Me," when they are in Buffy's basement and she tells him that she believes in him and she won't kill him, though he's begging her to on account of all the horrible things he's done in his life.
So, could it be that Spike actually had some sort of premonition back in "Selfless?" Or am I reading too much into it; was it simply that his desires came true? Or was it The First, somehow attempting to manipulate Spike in a completely unusual way? If so, what do you think its plan was?