Was Angelus and William's friendship fake?

[Chosen Enemy]

When Spike arrives to Sunnydale and sees Angel for the first time, they seem to be buddies. Clearly Spike was faking his trust that Angel was evil. But they both acted as though they used to be good friends, back in the old days.

And in their flashbacks, they seem to hang out a lot together, going out on hunting trips and such.

However, I think all that time together, they were both faking their friendship. I don't think they even liked each other (except for that one time....). For example, after Spike kills the Chinese Slayer and Dru tells Angel and Darla that, Angel looks at Spike with serious face, like he's super jealous of him or something. And Spike seems to rub his nose in it ("Don't be so glum, mate! The way you tell it, one Slayer snuffs it, another one rises. I figure there's a new Chosen One getting all chosen as we speak. I tell you what... when and if this new bird does show up, I'll give you first crack at her"). Angel answers sarcastically, just like Spike.

And fast foward in time, after Angel loses his soul, the three family members seem to have a happy family. Angel even kisses Spike on the forehead and Spike laughes. But clearly Spike hates Angel's guts. But they all pretend to like each other.

So, do you think they've been faking their friendship all along? Or when does it start? Was it ever over, say in Ats S5?

 

[FetalPig]

I think friendship is a misleading word to use for the relationships between soul-less killing machines.

Probably the closest thing we have is the hierarchical mentality of a pack of predators who constantly vie for control of the territory. The alpha under constant threat from underlings, but also (somewhat) relying upon those underlings to maintain territory from other nearby groups. The alpha doesn't pretend to like them - any affection is a gift that reinforces the relationship.

No wait! Maybe corporate economics is a better model 😉

 

[spikecakes]

Oh, the fake friendship? That was there to simply hide the MASSIVE amount of sexual tension that oozes from them.

But really, I think they tried too hard to hate eachother. It's a love to hate thing.

A bit hot, really..

 

[sisterofmercy]

They were kind of forced together from the beginning and I think they both wanted to be the alpha male, so there was an element of falsity in their friendship. It seemed like the kind of friendship that you tolerate but only to make yourself look better. Not a healthy one, certainly, but at times it seemed like they kind of liked one another.

I'd call it more like sibling rivalry rather than a friendship.

 

[ticonderouga]

I think Spike and Angel had what amounts to a master/apprentice relationship. Angel essentially teaches Spike how to make killing his art. In School Hard Spike is angry at Angel because he feels betrayed by someone he thought of as a teacher. "You were my Yoda!" Essentially Angelus has two 'proteges' one was Penn and the other was William the Bloody. When Angel meets Penn in Somnambulist he remarks that Penn isn't even close to being creative that he has been operating on the same pattern for so very long and Angel ends up beating him quite easily. Do you realize of all the Vampires Angel has fought only one gets the better of him, and Spike does so at least three times. Once in School Hard, once in In The Dark, and finally in Destiny. I think that most of the tension between them is that Spike has become a master in his own right and Angel won't admit to that. Spikes life in many ways mirrors Angel's, both essentially shared most of their vampire lives with one woman (Angelus with Darla, Spike with Drusilla), then Angel gets cursed with a soul, and falls in love with a Slayer. Spike gets a chip and falls in love with the same Slayer and then goes and earns his soul. So while they are friends, they are also always rivals and are always involved in an elaborate game of one upsmenship. However, even though Spike's accomplishments equal or often exceed Angel's, Angel always gets the credit. So while they are friends, their friendship is based almost entirely on rivalry.

 

[Marisa]

It was a fake thing in ways to me yes but we have to remember Spike is the only vampire without a soul that seemed to even care. Angel probably didn't care about him and Spike certainly didn't care after that whole Dru situation.

Do I think it was fake? Yes but no at the same time because I don't think they ever really said they were mates and if they did I don't remember. I think Angel put up with Spike because he had his significant other and then Dru had hers.

Now Spike does rub stuff in his face because Angel and Spike no matter if they are friends will always want to be better than each other. That is okay with me because it makes for funny entertainment. 😛

 

[caritas08]

When Spike arrives to Sunnydale and sees Angel for the first time, they seem to be buddies. Clearly Spike was faking his trust that Angel was evil. But they both acted as though they used to be good friends, back in the old days.

And in their flashbacks, they seem to hang out a lot together, going out on hunting trips and such.

However, I think all that time together, they were both faking their friendship. I don't think they even liked each other (except for that one time....). For example, after Spike kills the Chinese Slayer and Dru tells Angel and Darla that, Angel looks at Spike with serious face, like he's super jealous of him or something. And Spike seems to rub his nose in it ("Don't be so glum, mate! The way you tell it, one Slayer snuffs it, another one rises. I figure there's a new Chosen One getting all chosen as we speak. I tell you what... when and if this new bird does show up, I'll give you first crack at her"). Angel answers sarcastically, just like Spike.

And fast foward in time, after Angel loses his soul, the three family members seem to have a happy family. Angel even kisses Spike on the forehead and Spike laughes. But clearly Spike hates Angel's guts. But they all pretend to like each other.

So, do you think they've been faking their friendship all along? Or when does it start? Was it ever over, say in Ats S5?

I thought Angel was upset about the Chinese Slayer because he had already got his soul back again but I could be mistaken.

As far as their friendship, I think they kind of liked and respected each other but their constant rivalry and Angelus' extreme untrustworthiness made their friendship different than most people's ideal. Kind of like Angelus and Darla. They had a strong bond but they would constantly throw each other under the bus when they were in danger.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I definitely think their "friendship" was more of them tolerating each other because of Dru. I never thought of them as friends. I think they enjoyed killing and that was what drew them together, but they were never friends.

 

[zobothehobo]

I think it was nostalgia when they see each other for the first time. It's like when you see someone in public you used to go to high school with, and whether you like them or not you're like "HEY! How are you?! Oh my god, how have you been! *hug* oh it's SO good to see you! Really. Oh, you look great!" And then you walk away and you turn to whoever you're with (or say it to yourself) and say "oh god, I hated her."

 

[Kana]

A relationship of mixed motives may be a more accurate term of description.

At the start from William's side the bond is genuine. He tends to understand the world in terms of the literal. His naivety about the 'game' makes him ripe for the picking as Angelus exploits this with obnoxious abandon.

William attempts to identify with Angelus, talking about his deepest passions, talking about Drusilla gives his life meaning. He thinks he's found a friend, Angelus, however has other ideas.

From Angelus perspective, he genuinely is intrigued by the newcomer. However his curiosity is marred by his fear of losing status. While a male killing companion promises a new dynamic, it also presages a possible power struggle. So he does what he feels he has to do...take control. By setting himself up as William's mentor, he's able to maintain his dominance in the group.

I've always felt the reason he continues to sleep with Dru, is the demonstrate who has the power. Also by stating that there is no belonging, he attempts to bring about despair in William. This is also a trademark of Angelus' other skill and inclination: sadism. For Angelus, evil isn't just a choice, it's a lifestyle, a belief system which is almost religious in it's fervor. For Angelus, love, and true friendship violates this ‘purity’. Any feelings of genuine affection is always superseded by the passion for destruction.

When Angel gets his soul, for the most part, due to circumstance, they are enemies. Angel is on the side of good and Spike on the side of evil.

When Angel gets a soul, he serves as a rival to Angel. From Spike’s perspective, like before, he’s trying to crave out a meaningful existence. This time it isn’t his sire that is the point of contention between the two, it’s Buffy. If Dru delivered him from mediocrity, then Buffy delivered him from evil. She is a salvation. However he fears like before that Angel could lay claim to her.

Now Angel still wants to keep Spike from ascension, however it’s not to do with sadism but to do with desperation. Like before, though, he still feels like his place is threatened but now it’s altogether more serious. We’re not talking about a petty power struggle, we’re talking about his very existence losing meaning. It also means that his suffering loses meaning as well. All those years of suffering in hell, tortured by guilt and the things that gave his life meaning now appear to be taken away from him.

The problem is, even though now they are on the same side, they don’t know how to interact with each other, aside from being rivals. Everything is a competition: power, women, moral status etc. The challenge now becomes to redefine their relationship to realize they don’t have to be each others nemeses, that they can coexist for the greater good.