Was Buffy in love with Spike?

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

I posted this in the Spuffy forums and white avenger suggested I open the discussion up to everyone else as well, including the Bangels.

This is not meant to be another Bangel vs. Spuffy war - rather, I'd like people to respond to the below quotes within the context of their stance on the issue.

Die-hard Buffy and Angel supporters always tell me that Buffy LOVED Spike but that she wasn't IN LOVE with him.

Here's what Joss Whedon's said regarding the two:

Buffy was in love with Spike the moment their hands clasped.

James Marsters recently responded to Joss' quote in the March Q&A section of his official site:

What do you think of Joss Whedon’s comment that “Buffy was in love with Spike the moment their hands clasped” in the finale?
Yeah, I believe that. Only then was he a true hero, only then did he truly sacrifice himself for other people and only then did he truly deserve her.

What do you all think? Did Buffy love Spike? If you don't think so, why not? Do you respect Joss' and James' comments on the matter, or have you come up with your own conclusions?

 

[white avenger]

The fact that Joss said that Buffy was in love with Angel has been used here on the Boards to verify the feelings of the two for each other, and has, since it came from the ultimate source of canon truth, accepted as ...well...canon. Though we have good naturedly bandied back and forth whether Bangel was a school girl crush or not, and whether Buffy meant that she loved Spike as a friend or was actually IN LOVE with him, this statement, to me, verifies what I have said for quite some time. Buffy was in love with both men, equally but differently, and she could live her life perfectly happily with either one. That Spike was either mistaken or in denial when he said, "No, you don't..." and that Angel was simply taking for granted that he was the only recipient of Buffy's baked cookies, when she never said any such thing.

So, if and when Buffy ever makes that Big Decision, it's still a crap shoot as to who the lucky guy will actually be, and that's a situation that I have no problem with whatsoever.

 

[xaphania]

Yes, she was.

Like I said in the other thread, I think you only have to look at the end of Showtime to know that she loved him and was in love with him.

 

[Eleftheria]

No she wasn't. Her feelings IMO evolved from taking advantage of his feelings and giving in to her darkest desires in s6 to friendly love and respect in the end of s7.
I am sorry but I can see no romantic love no matter what Joss wanna show or says...I only feel that in s7 noone else supported her, and given the fact that this man got a soul to be better as a person, she started having feelings for him but not romantic ones.

 

[thevikingsgirl]

Yes, she was.

Like I said in the other thread, I think you only have to look at the end of Showtime to know that she loved him and was in love with him.

Totally. How she looks at him in Chosen too, when she almost goes back upstairs and he stops her. She loved him. You could see it in her face, in her actions, and Joss said so. It's bizarre to me that people deny it. But I've often thought I must be watching a different show from other people. There are people who read the Southern Vampire books and like Bill more than Eric. I think these people must have a different version. 😉

 

[white avenger]

Boy, this thread's been up for over 8 hours already, ant it's not a bloody battlefield yet. We MUST be burned out on the Spuffy vs Bangel argument. That, or the Bangels just can't deny the truth any longer.

 

[ToShanshuInLA]

Well, if I may...If this isn't a Bangel vs. Spuffy thread why is it in the Battle'Ship sub-forum? 😕

"Spuffy" skeeves me out (I'm not keen on "Bangel" either though I don't find them skeevy) but I think that she was in love with him by the end.

 

[Willow-Tree]

I definitely think that at one point in time, Buffy was in love with Spike. I don't, however, know if she still is. =/

 

[KristenVictoria]

If Joss says so, I will take his word.

 

[racheltng]

"No you don't, but thanks for saying it."

That sealed the argument for me. Even Buffy seemed shocked when Spike negated her declaration of love, but I think he had the ability to see into her core, and he knew she didn't really love him.

 

[Airam]

Of course she loved him! Those quotes yeah, kinda make it cannon, which is nice. But you just have to watch the latter of S7 to know she was in love with him... how she protected him, depended on him, trusted him, stood up for him, her jealousy when he talked to Faith, their snuggles, sleepovers and just overall closeness, "Why does everyone think I'm STILL in love with Spike?!", oh yeah and that time when she looked him dead in the eyes and told him, "I love you." ... Just sayin' 😀

 

[Kana]

Yeah I think she was. That's what my gut tells me. What is romantic love anyway? She was attracted to him, trusted him and was clearly emotionally attached to him, so then what? She just likes him as a friend? I just don't see it.

 

[thevikingsgirl]

"No you don't, but thanks for saying it."

That sealed the argument for me. Even Buffy seemed shocked when Spike negated her declaration of love, but I think he had the ability to see into her core, and he knew she didn't really love him.

Spike suffered from poor self-esteem. He did know Buffy very well, maybe better than anyone else did, but he never saw himself as worthy of her and therefore couldn't believe she loved him. With his history, it's not really any surprise.

 

[white avenger]

If anyone ever deserved Buffy's love, and I fully realize that being in love seldom works that way, but anyhow...Within the confines of the show, from Season 2 when he was first introduced until Season 7, he changed more, did more, and suffered more, than either of her other two romantic interests combined. Note that I said WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE SHOW. Angel might have been inspired to pull himself out of an alley, wash the rat blood off of his hands, and put on some clean clothes for Buffy, but the majority of his real change didn't occur until after he left Sunnydale. Riley was simply Riley. Corn fed Iowa boy Riley. That about sums him up entirely.

 

[Kana]

If anyone ever deserved Buffy's love, and I fully realize that being in love seldom works that way, but anyhow...Within the confines of the show, from Season 2 when he was first introduced until Season 7, he changed more, did more, and suffered more, than either of her other two romantic interests combined. Note that I said WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE SHOW. Angel might have been inspired to pull himself out of an alley, wash the rat blood off of his hands, and put on some clean clothes for Buffy, but the majority of his real change didn't occur until after he left Sunnydale. Riley was simply Riley. Corn fed Iowa boy Riley. That about sums him up entirely.

My only grumble is that why should Spike or anyone else have to earn her love. Angel didn't really earn her love but then Buffy didn't really earn their love either. I actually prefer all the guys when they leave Buffy.

 

[thevikingsgirl]

Love really isn't something anyone earns. Look at how many really, really undeserving people have someone in love with them. But I can see the point, as to why Spike shouldn't have felt he didn't deserve for her to love him. I don't think he saw himself very clearly though. His little William voice is always in there telling him he's not worthy. Like in Angel when Fred said he was a champion who sacrificed himself to save the world and he said he didn't really do anything, he just stood there. He doesn't give himself enough credit. It's why he also brags so much (IMO), like when he bragged to Angel and Darla about killing his first slayer. Overcompensating.

 

[dan k]

I've just watched most of season 7 tonight and i am now in no doubt that Buffy loved Spike. After watching the early seasons of the show i was convinced i thought Bangel was the superior ship but i was wrong.

That's not to say Bangel isn't strong because it is, in fact i find it really hard to seperate Bangel and Spuffy.

After watching season 7 the bond i thought wasn't there in terms of Spuffy is definately there. After not watching season 7 for awhile i remembered wrongly that Buffy was just being a friend and caring for Spike. As i watched again tonight its clear that as that season progressed she found a respect for him which eventually led to her loving him.

Comments like when she confirms she felt the same the night Spike held her and he said it was the best night of his life. Also when she tells Angel he is in her heart. Of course you can attack that by saying she doesn't envisage having kids with him but its amazing how i now see what other people were saying.

She loves both Angel and Spike. I didn't see it before but now i do. I love both ships because they are extremely powerful in different parts of Buffy's life.

In season 2 she is deeply in love with Angel, she is obsessed and that love never goes away but she learns to deal with it.

With Spike the opposite happens, her love for him continues to grow over time and by the time the show ends i honestly think she doesn't know who she loves more, actually i don't think she envisages being with one of them because of what she has to face.

I admit i was wrong and i am apologize for going against the Spuffy contingent because i love the ship now. Their relationship is characterized superbly in season 7 destroying all images i held of the two of them in season 6.

If i was to pick what ship i prefer right at this minute then i'd say Spuffy however i've just finished season 7. If i'd just finished season 2 i'd say Bangel. Its really hard to call what one i like the most, most interestingly i think its hard for anyone to fully justify what man she should end up with, which makes it all the more fascinating.

Hence i'd love Joss to clear it all up be it in a one off episode or film :smile3:. I've gone off point but just wanted to unload, season 7 is a superb season by the way. :biggrin3:

 

[discereaude]

Buffy was in love with Spike the moment their hands clasped.

So I'm the only one who sees something wrong with that statement? I mean it says that Buffy was in love with Spike the moment their hands clasped. Not before, I mean, after everything, I just don't get Spuffy. I mean, Spike loved Buffy so much more than Buffy loved Spike, throughout their relationship.

 

[dan k]

Yes that's true that Spike loved her more but i really think by the end of season 7 Buffy loves him too. It is extremely difficuly to understand but after watching it again last night she says things and looks at him in ways totally different to season 6.

 

[BuffyHead]

I think it def started out that she just wanted to feel something. Anything. Then I think he proved himself to her.