Was "Not Fade Away" hurt by not mentioning Buffy?

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Robb Stark

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I know she couldn't have been there, I get that, but do you think she should have been mentioned? When Angel tells everyone to have their "last day", I thought it would have been perfect if he'd tried to call her and just got the answering machine. That at least makes her part of it but still focuses on Connor. With Spike, when he's at the bar, he could have flashed back to Chosen and realized he didn't need to see her.

Even though I understand why she wasn't there behind the scenes, the Buffy/Angel/Spike romance was one of, if not the, biggest parts of the franchise. Not Fade Away is quite possibly the best episode of either series, but I've always thought that Buffy having no presence at all took away from it a bit.
 
Q
Quinn
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Aimee
Aimee
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Yeah me too... I think your answering machine idea is great! But yeah when I saw that Angel appeared in the last episode of Buffy I was so happy...and I would've liked to see Buffy and Angel at least once more in the last season...
 
I don't think not mentioning Buffy hurt the episode. "Not Fade Away" was about Angel and his team and their fight, not Buffy's and the Scoobies'.
 
T
The Scourge
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I don't think Not Fade Away was hurt by not mentioning Buffy. If anything, mentioning Buffy would've been really weird for the show. I think "Damage" earlier in the season sent a pretty clear message that Buffy, Angel, and their respective teams are fighting two completely different missions.

I can understand wanting it from a shippy perspective 😉 (I'm not a Bangel, but I do get shipping), but to be honest I think it would have been out of place.
 
I like the answering machine idea and would have loved to see some sort of crossover but I don't think it really took away from the episode too much without it.
 
The Bangel in me would never say no to a Buffy/Angel interaction. I like the phone call idea. It would match nicely to the first ever episode of Angel when he calls Buffy but doesnt speak when he hears her voice. Having a conversation with her or leaving a message would show he still has feelings for her but he's come a long way in the past 5 years.
 
If you brought Buffy into the final episode, you then have to either come up with a reason for her to leave LA before the final battle and effectively walk out on Angel or have her join his team and potentially die. You then also get into the realms of "if Buffy, why not Willow?" and ultimately that devalues Angel as a series- it's a darker, more mature body of work, and it takes away from the Angel Investigations team to have them not standing up to the ultimate battle on their own.
 
T
The Scourge
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I don't think the show was hurt by it, this was a very personal fight for Angel and his team. It was five years in the making and W&H had taken everything from the FG. If it hadn't been the series finale, I think the lack of Buffy, or at least slayers, would have been more glaring. But this was the finale statement on Angel, and really, Buffy was not part of that. If she had been there it would have been about her and Angel, and that wouldn't have been right.

I think it is very different from Angel showing up at the end of Buffy, simply because Angel had been a major part of that show. Not everyone agrees, but I think he earned his right to be there in the end. Plus, I think what Buffy and Angel had said to each other in Sunnydale still stood. Sometimes, she still looked that far ahead... and sometime was still something.

However, that doesn't mean that I haven't headcanoned that Angel wore his Claddagh ring around his neck going into that final battle. Or that he hadn't left a letter for Buffy, to be delivered if he died, with her long lost Claddagh in it. 😉
 
I dont think it was hurt by not mentioning it, but I think it is less realistic, same in Chosen, if they really did believe it was the end you'd think they'd be calling in everyone in their phonebook.
 
I don't think it was necessary but I would have loved it. It would have been perfect to see Angel drop some letters into a mailbox on his way to see Connor - so perfect that for a while I actually believed I had seen it in the episode. No direct mention of Buffy, just a nod to remind us that Angel had people beyond his team and his son, and that he cared enough to communicate with them about his death.

(There was plenty of time for him to have done that off-screen, though, so y'know what, it happened.)
 
It would have been cool to have a mirror of the events in 'Chosen' where this time Buffy gives Angel something or tells him something vital to the AI team's survival. I don't think it hurt the show at al that it didn't happen,l but it would have been a nice way to round things off.
 
I would of loved Buffy being in the finale and joining in the end fight and her and Angel kiss again for us fighting side by side 🙂

Even though I am a huge Bangel fan I was actually glad that Buffy didn't come back, as this was Angel's show, I like Angel coming back in "Chosen" as Angel started there and started being a hero so it was nice to end it with the world knowing Angel is not a sidekick he is a hero himself. But I would of liked it for Angel to get Buffy's voicemail like others said and tell her this might be he last day on earth and that he loves her.
 
I'm perfectly fine with Buffy not even being mentioned. Angel had more important things on his mind, such as his son's welfare and the impending deaths of himself and his team.

I felt Angel, the show and character, outgrew Buffy over the course of the series. Due to this I found it very annoying that they constantly brought up Buffy in season 5. It felt out of place, and I'm glad he didn't give her a second thought in the finale.
 
No I don't think it was hurt, I didn't even think about it really. 🙂
I think it would have been hurt hadn't Connor been around, but Buffy... I'm not sure what help she could have provided? I wish she had been some kind of part of the final season of Angel but not the final episode, even Angel only got a few minutes of time on the BTVS finale and that was because he could be squeezed in without interrupting the story.

Buffy in "Not fade away" would have interrupted the flow of the narrative. And facing those odds... well, an army of Slayers might have helped but that would have been a bit of an easy way out 😉
 
I'm honestly torn on this issue. I never thought about it til now...But I also never thought of how completely unrealistic it was that they didn't pop up in one another's lives more often until just a day or so ago. (Thanks, [MENTION=7407]caitaintdead[/MENTION] 😛)

On one hand, yes, this IS Angel's show. It was centered on Angel and the Fang Gang, just as it should have been. On the other hand....This is Buffy we are talking about. BUFFY. She never lost hope with Angel, even after he'd lost his soul. I always thought it was a massive copout that the Scooby's were all of the sudden against Angel the second they found out he headed up Wolfram and Hart, a law firm that was never even mentioned in their own show. The REAL Buffy would have found out what was going on, she would have found out why he was doing what he was doing instead of just turning her back completely on him. I understand they were trying to make up a reason why Buffy and co., wouldn't show up in the last season, but it was still absolutely absurd.

What would have been realistic for the characters themselves (Not necessarily saying this is what I wanted to happen, but it would have been totally within the characters, a hell of a lot more than what was actually shown,) is Buffy showing up with an army of Slayers towards the end of Not Fade Away. That much death and destruction going about in LA and somehow Buffy doesn't hear about it? I don't buy it, nor do I buy that she would just let it be if she *had* heard about it

All of that said, I like your idea of the answering machine. That is literally the only way that it could have happened, as if Buffy had spoken to Angel, no way in hell would she have let all of that stuff go on without being apart of it.

I adore Not Fade Away, don't get me wrong. It is one of the best episodes of either series. I just hate that they ended up bastardizing all of the history Buffy and Angel shared in that season as a whole. To wrap this up before I go on another rant; If you just think of Angel as a series, and NOT think about Buffy or the Scoobies, no, it doesn't hurt it. If you think of Angel as apart of the Buffyverse, considering Buffy and the Scoobies on a regular basis, yes, it does hurt it.
 
I wouldn't use the word hurt, but I definitely would've liked for some mention of Buffy. However, Angel goes and does his thing everyday knowing that he could die. Buffy too. Willow and Xander and Giles do too. I don't think Angel believed that he would die, which is why he didn't call Buffy or nothing. But I do like the idea that Angel did try to call Buffy. Aw . . .
 
I don't think it was hurt by not mentioning Buffy; however it would have been nice if they acknowledged her in some way. It is a little hard to believe that in facing the end of the world Angel wouldn't have made contact with Buffy somehow.
 
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