Was S4 poorly cast?

[Robb Stark]

In terms of the newly introduced characters (Riley, Forest, Maggie Walsh, ect). I'm re-watching S4 right now, and it feels like the actors they've selected to play the new characters, particularly the military ones, just aren't really...suited to their roles. Marc Blucas as Riley fits, but I find him a bit wooden as an actor.

It just seems at times that they people they've got to play The Initiative characters just don't really seem to have any real feel for a military role whatsoever. Did anyone else get that feeling?

 

[Evil Angelus 95]

I completely understand where you're coming from with this. There wasn't a single instance in S4 where I truly believed that these people were a top-secret military organization. They didn't act at all like people who were military, for lack of better terms. They basically seemed like normal college students, which could go hand-in-hand with their 'cover'. But still, the acting for this organization wasn't that great.

 

[white avenger]

In terms of the newly introduced characters (Riley, Forest, Maggie Walsh, ect). I'm re-watching S4 right now, and it feels like the actors they've selected to play the new characters, particularly the military ones, just aren't really...suited to their roles. Marc Blucas as Riley fits, but I find him a bit wooden as an actor.

It just seems at times that they people they've got to play The Initiative characters just don't really seem to have any real feel for a military role whatsoever. Did anyone else get that feeling?

Probably, the people in Riley's unit were ordered specifically NOT to look or act like they were military in order to blend in with the college environment. Having a bunch of Army Special Forces (or whatever) types running around campus would have almost certainly called undue attention to their mission, which was to more or less babysit a bunch of scientists while they developed the demonic Frankenstein super soldier and a bunch of vampires and demons with behavioral chip implants.

 

[tec]

The army in the Buffyverse is not the brightest I meen they let a bunch of High Schoolers steal a rocket lancher..

But the Buffyverse Army is batteling more then just the normal bad guys so they might be streched even thiner then our forces are

 

[BuffyElevated]

I have often wondered about the casting for Forrest... He was downright unlikable to me, from the very start. But I thought they did a good job casting Riley and Parker, and even Professor Walsh.

 

[Lilac1]

I didn't like the cast of soldiers. Not because they didn't "look" the part with buzz cuts and what not, I just didn't like the attitudes. They all seemed lost. Like they were extras brought in at the last second to fill in as soldiers. There was no real intensity to them as they lined up in the Initiative ready to deploy. Some of them even looked out of shape. Graham was the only Initiative character I could believe was a soldier.

 

[This Year's Girl]

I have often wondered about the casting for Forrest... He was downright unlikable to me, from the very start. But I thought they did a good job casting Riley and Parker, and even Professor Walsh.

Agreed. Forrest wasn't great. I got the feeling that you were kind of supposed to like him, like he was supposed to have a rough charm, but the actor didn't do a very good job of convincing me. Although it was nice to see a person of color in a bigger role in Btvs. It wasn't a very diverse show in that matter.

 

[salustra]

Poor Marc Blucas. I've seen him in other things and liked him but he was a block of wood as Riley. *sighs* The fact that the audience so hated Riley, Marti Noxon's creation, explains why she took her revenge on Spike in Season Six where she was the showrunner. She's specifically responsible for the attempted rape scene in 'Seeing Red'. It's apparently a reversal of something she did, trying to force herself sexually on a boyfriend who'd broken up with her.

 

[Blaze]

Completely agree, in terms of casting season 4 was probably my least favorite (although they redeemed themselves by bringing in Tara!) But Marc Blucas was just awful as Riley. I don't really blame the actor and more the fact that his material pretty much sucked. I just didn't find him likeable at all. And in between Angel and Spike, he just had no chance for anyone ever shipping him and Buffy.

I do somewhat like Parker and Dr. Walsh though. Just in general I feel like they could have done much better with the concept of the initiative. I actually really liked when they brought it back for that one episode in season 7, it really had an undercover organisation type feeling.

 

[drlloyd11]

Improvisation

Season 4 was an example of how improvising can save what planning can doom. The original storyline (the Inititive ) added several mediocre characters and a plot line than needed to be aborted half way in. However the two best moves in s4 was this addition of two unexpected new characters (Spike and Tara) and how they took advantage of it.
Not just in making an entertaining characters but in how they used those characters to tell the story of a core Scooby. The changes to Willow and Buffy from Spike and Tara are a huge part of the appeal of the show. I would argue they were how the show survived the jump from HS to the real world.
The actual plan (Riley, Maggie, the other goons) was dumped halfway in as unworkable, and things got better after.
I mean of the 3 most popular couples on the show, two of them formed almost as an afterthought.
The planned ones (Riley, Kennedy) were the flops..

 

[brinkster130]

I didn't think the casting was the problem; I thought it was more of a poor writing problem. Even if the Initiative characters looked more like they were in the military their lines and attitudes wouldn't have changed...

 

[Tome]

Ehhh, I have nothing against the actors they picked for those roles. Of course it would have been interesting to see Christian Kane - a.k.a Lindsey McDonald - play Buffy's boyfriend, hahaha! After all, his real life best friend played Buffy's eternal soulmate. 😉

 

[Ethan Reigns]

I didn't think the casting was the problem; I thought it was more of a poor writing problem. Even if the Initiative characters looked more like they were in the military their lines and attitudes wouldn't have changed...

Agreed. Riley was an especially poorly-written part. He was a TA in psychology and everyone I have met in that position was more like Holden Webster in "Conversations with Dead People" 7ABB07 with an infinite curiosity about how and why other people are feeling what they do and what makes them tick. Riley never shows any of the curiosity a grad student in psychology would have. Instead, Marc Blucas stands on his marks and recites his lines as if he had never acted before. I don't think this is the fault of the actor - the writing only allows him to be a one-dimensional character.

Maggie Walsh is portrayed a lot better - I could definitely believe her part. So were the other scientists, but they were throwaway parts - no real attention was paid to them.

I don't know anyone who could get into an elite fighting group while they were still of college age. We have no backstory of what any of them did to get selected to what appears to be a "special forces" unit. There is no private conversation between the soldiers about what they encountered "in country" - nothing that would indicate any experience at all. And for all the technological support, they weren't all that effective - they should have been far ahead of Buffy in kills and captures, but they blew almost every assignment.

 

[YummySushiPJs]

I got the feeling we weren't really supposed to like Forrest.

 

[FaithsFollower]

Is THIS why I had an intense dislike for Season Four? I'm not sure.

But yeah, the people they chose to portray The Initiative weren't at all suited to their roles [with, perhaps, the exception of Walsh but that's because I thought Lindsay Crouse rocked that character]. Even with Adam, I thought he should've been written better [even though I thought the guy did a great job]. Although, thinking about it now with regards to Adam, it wasn't so much as they were poorly casted but poorly written.

But man, those guys were sure nice to look at [I'm lookin' at you, Bailey Chase]. 😛

 

[YummySushiPJs]

Yes Adam especially was poorly written.

 

[Yosso]

Agreed. Riley was an especially poorly-written part. He was a TA in psychology and everyone I have met in that position was more like Holden Webster in "Conversations with Dead People" 7ABB07 with an infinite curiosity about how and why other people are feeling what they do and what makes them tick. Riley never shows any of the curiosity a grad student in psychology would have. Instead, Marc Blucas stands on his marks and recites his lines as if he had never acted before. I don't think this is the fault of the actor - the writing only allows him to be a one-dimensional character.

I always thought this too. I thought it was odd how much of a yes-man Riley was, when really being a student is less about that but more about forming your own opinions and ideas about your subject and the world. Studying psychology would certainly add to that sense of being more of a free thinker. I think if he was say an Engineering grad student or something, he being a yes-man would be more believable. But it's a minor technicality, really.

 

[marie21]

Yes, I agree, Riley was not interesting enough and rather poorly-written...
I'm re-watching season 4, I am half-way through it and it's true that he's not as fascinating as Angel and Spike. Is it because he's a good and apparently a normal guy? or is it because of the script-writing of some episodes which don't allow him to 'shine' a little bit more and to make him appear less like the good soldier...

 

[Robb Stark]

Yes, I agree, Riley was not interesting enough and rather poorly-written...
I'm re-watching season 4, I am half-way through it and it's true that he's not as fascinating as Angel and Spike. Is it because he's a good and apparently a normal guy? or is it because of the script-writing of some episodes which don't allow him to 'shine' a little bit more and to make him appear less like the good soldier...

It's taken a few re-watches, but to be honest I like Riley now. I have no problem with him at all. He's not a favorite character of mine, but I like him. I think the problem though is/was the writing of the character.

Coming on the heels of Angel and "Graduation Day", Riley was always going to be behind the eight ball with fans. I thought Marc Blucas fit the part well, but the creative team didn't do enough to make Riley cool. Riley is clearly built with the Captain America template in mind, which is fine. I love Cap. But Captain America can still be the same character and cool at the same time. "Riley on drugs" was just ridiculous. His flopping between "just following orders" and "I'm an anarchist" was a little cringe-worthy and the fact that he was SO linked to The Initiative, and how south they went from about "The I in team" onwards, didn't help. By S5 it felt like they were just looking for a way to write him out of the show, and didn't have any real intention of trying to continue building the character.

It's a bit of a shame, really. I like him a lot in the comics.

 

[Mischlings]

I can't quantify it in any real way, but the problems with the new characters in Season 4 feel like about 70% the actors and 30% the writing. Marc Blucas is the one that sticks out the most because he's so much a part of it - I feel like a better actor would've been able to make the character likeable.

As for the others? Maggie Walsh I believed completely and she would've made a good Big Bad (her casting was spot on), whole the rest were kind of meh.

So poorly cast? For the most part, yes.