Were Willow and the others out of line for yelling at Buffy?

J

Joshua

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Near the end of Dead Man's Party do you think Willow and the Gang were out of line for yelling at Buffy like the way they did?
 
I don't think so, I understand why they did it. Buffy ditched them, never contacted them, made them worry sick all summer long, and then as soon as she comes back, she decides to leave again.

I'm sure they had a lot of bottled up feelings of hurt and betrayal that they needed to let out.

Buffy was too busy thinking about herself and how she feels, that she didn't even stop to think how her friends felt. I know she left because she killed Angel and she wanted to be alone, but she didn't even think about how that would effect those closest to her. Like Willow said, she would have been there to talk to her and help her through it, and the fact that Buffy didn't want her help made Willow feel hurt.

Willow was always there when Buffy needed her, but when Willow needed Buffy the most in her times with having a werewolf boyfriend and finding her inner-magic, Buffy wasn't there.
 
D
dexeded
[No message]
I think this is one of those cases where nobody was right and nobody was wrong. The gang had very good reason for being upset and frustrated with Buffy, but Buffy had very good reason for leaving, and it's understandable that she couldn't bring herself to contact them after all she'd been through.
 
BuffyElevated
BuffyElevated
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I don't think they were out of line for yelling at her. She did just up and leave for 3 months and then come back thinking everyone would be A-OK with it.

Though I do think they should have waited till the party was over and everyone else had left. It was a very awkward scene and I never get used to it.
 
I don't really think they were out of line, but I always found it interesting how out of all of them, Giles was the only one who seemed in tune to Buffy's feelings and how she needed to acclomated back into the group. The gang's treatment of Buffy, while completely understandable, was not the best way to keep her in Sunnydale.
 
I understand why Buffy left at the end of season 2, because her mother disowned her, she killed her boyfriend, she was wanted for murder,and her mother could not fully accept her slayerness in the heat of the moment. But I do not think that the gang was out of line for yellign at her when she tried to leave again.
 
Yes. For sure. They had no right. The funny thing here is, the only person on Buffy's side in this situation, is Cordelia. She's the one who sticks up for her, who tries to understand her perspective and feelings, when her so-called "friends" don't. It's a great Cordelia moment.
 
K
kittenpoker
yeah it is. "Cordelia, get out of my shoes"
Oh they absolutely had every right to yell at her. And buffy had every right to yell back. I really love that this happens. Everyone is all pent up and silent and this allows everyone to get their feelings out. I think it was both necessary and important. And I think it brings them all closer.
 
Absolutely. I understand that they were angry with her for skipping town without a word..But put yourself in Buffy's shoes. She's a teenage girl who's mother told her if she left to never come back. The one person she loved most had just abandoned her because she didn't believe that her daughter was the key to keeping the world safe.

She must have felt that she had no other choice. She believed she had no where to go in Sunnydale and that she had been cast out like she was a leper. I think they could have been more understanding. Besides, They threw her a welcome home party with a bunch of strangers she didn't even know. She just wanted a small gathering with her mother and her closest friends. I think they made the wrong decision in that aspect as well.
 
Yes. They were. I get so mad when I watch this episode... They were all selfish and didn't think for a SECOND about Buffy and how she felt. they thought about how hard this was for them, but they didn't think for a second about Buffy. they invited the whole school in her house because they wanted to avoid that, in fact. and Willow blew Buffy off at the mall... it's just so irritating.
 
They were totally out of line. I can somewhat relate to Willow (even though I still think her snark in the livingroom was out of line), but Mr "Kick his ass" and Mrs "don't think you can come back" should have kept their big mouths firmly shut. Both Xander and Joyce make me want to slap them in this ep. Or better yet, have them both slapped by super-strength Buffy. Joyce, especially, got exactly what was coming to her over the summer. Aw, so you're worried about your daughter now after you kicked her out of your house? And then instead of accepting her own responsibility, she's blaming Giles? Boo hoo. Grow up or shut up, missy. :nopity:

Not to mention the blatant idiocy of the party throwing. Let's make sure there'll be no chance to talk things out because the house will be full of noisy Muggles, and then shout at Buffy for being too secretive? Rrright. I don't think anyone has a right to blame Buffy for trying to run away from these sort of "friends" and "family", again. Noone was completely right in the sitch, but Buffy was by far the least wrong.
 
Z
zobothehobo
Brain twins
I don't think they were wrong to be upset with her, but I also think they could have tried harder to approach the situation in a more civil manner. At that point, no one understood at all why Buffy had left, so I totally get why they were all angry and frustrated. But maybe they should have been a little less confrontational about trying to get her to tell them why she left.
Buffy was going through so much, and the last thing she needed was all her loved ones jumping on her case. However, she owed them an explanation to why she had skipped town. I realize she was going through a ton of emotional crap, but seriously, she needed to realize what she put them all through, too.
 
HisMrs said:
I don't think they were wrong to be upset with her, but I also think they could have tried harder to approach the situation in a more civil manner. At that point, no one understood at all why Buffy had left, so I totally get why they were all angry and frustrated. But maybe they should have been a little less confrontational about trying to get her to tell them why she left.
Buffy was going through so much, and the last thing she needed was all her loved ones jumping on her case. However, she owed them an explanation to why she had skipped town. I realize she was going through a ton of emotional crap, but seriously, she needed to realize what she put them all through, too.
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Exactly, I've been on the gang's end of a similar situation in real life and it's very hard to trust and forgive the abandoning party who just skipped town and left all their friends without a word, yet expects everyone to just welcome them back with open arms. There are feelings of betrayal, abandonment and a loss of trust which are hard to deal with.

However, I completely agree that the gang's actions, while understandable were the worst possible way to get Buffy to stay.....blowing off one on one time with Buffy, inviting a bunch of strangers and then ignoring her at the party, yelling at her etc. Giles truly is the only one who understood Buffy and his patience and forgiveness of her is amazing. He was flying all over the country looking for her, he was tortured by Angel not to mention lost Jenny and despite his constant support he had to deal with his slayer being AWOL not knowing if she was dead or alive and yet Giles only thinks of Buffy's needs and loss and what she has been through and not until "Revelation" when he finds out Buffy kept Angel being alive from him did Giles show any anger or disappointment of Buffy.
 
InsaneMystic said:
They were totally out of line. I can somewhat relate to Willow (even though I still think her snark in the livingroom was out of line), but Mr "Kick his ass" and Mrs "don't think you can come back" should have kept their big mouths firmly shut. Both Xander and Joyce make me want to slap them in this ep. Or better yet, have them both slapped by super-strength Buffy. Joyce, especially, got exactly what was coming to her over the summer. Aw, so you're worried about your daughter now after you kicked her out of your house? And then instead of accepting her own responsibility, she's blaming Giles? Boo hoo. Grow up or shut up, missy. :nopity:

Not to mention the blatant idiocy of the party throwing. Let's make sure there'll be no chance to talk things out because the house will be full of noisy Muggles, and then shout at Buffy for being too secretive? Rrright. I don't think anyone has a right to blame Buffy for trying to run away from these sort of "friends" and "family", again. Noone was completely right in the sitch, but Buffy was by far the least wrong.
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Good perspective, I agree with this completely.
 
HisMrs said:
I don't think they were wrong to be upset with her, but I also think they could have tried harder to approach the situation in a more civil manner. At that point, no one understood at all why Buffy had left, so I totally get why they were all angry and frustrated. But maybe they should have been a little less confrontational about trying to get her to tell them why she left.
Buffy was going through so much, and the last thing she needed was all her loved ones jumping on her case. However, she owed them an explanation to why she had skipped town. I realize she was going through a ton of emotional crap, but seriously, she needed to realize what she put them all through, too.
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She shouldn't need to. As her supposed "best friends" they should be the ones thinking about her pain and what she went through, instead of ignoring her and blowing her off when she actually tried to talk about it.

---------- Post added at 07:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 PM ----------

They really aren't good friends at all. Where's that true, deep, forever friendship, like in HARRY POTTER? I mean, Ron is a better friend than they are. And don't even get me started on Hermoine, possibly the bestest, kindest, most sympathetic and understanding friend to ever walk the face of the earth, who even slaps Harry's ego down when it gets too big. She practically follows Harry to the depths of hell and back without speaking a word against him. She's always there for him when he's upset, she's always by his side when he's hurt, she holds his after Dumbledore dies, she stays with him when Ron leaves for basic suicide, and she wants to go with him when he walks off to his death with Voldemort. Where is THAT kind of friendship for Buffy?
 
Dagenspear said:
She shouldn't need to. As her supposed "best friends" they should be the ones thinking about her pain and what she went through, instead of ignoring her and blowing her off when she actually tried to talk about it.

---------- Post added at 07:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 PM ----------

They really aren't good friends at all. Where's that true, deep, forever friendship, like in HARRY POTTER? I mean, Ron is a better friend than they are. And don't even get me started on Hermoine, possibly the bestest, kindest, most sympathetic and understanding friend to ever walk the face of the earth, who even slaps Harry's ego down when it gets too big. She practically follows Harry to the depths of hell and back without speaking a word against him. She's always there for him when he's upset, she's always by his side when he's hurt, she holds his after Dumbledore dies, she stays with him when Ron leaves for basic suicide, and she wants to go with him when he walks off to his death with Voldemort. Where is THAT kind of friendship for Buffy?
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They didn't know she was in so much pain because she wouldn't tell them anything. They had a right to be upset and it's understandable that they would be frustrated that she wouldn't open up to them. Just because they get mad at her doesn't mean they're horrible people because of it.
And if you really want to bring HP into it, doesn't Ron go all crazy on Harry because he's jealous when he's chosen out of the Goblet of Fire?? But seriously, back to the topic, which is Buffy and her friends, not Harry Potter, I stand by my opinion that the Scoobies and Joyce had every right to be upset with Buffy. Being her best friends and closest loved ones, though, they should have given more thought and been more sensitive to the fact that Buffy had to be going through something seriously deep to have run away like that.
 
C
caritas08
I agree. You can't just abandon your friends for months without telling them if you're dead or alive or contacting them to let them know you're okay and expect them to take it lightly. Yes, they handled it badly but they are human.
First of all, A. Ron thought Harry had put his name into the GOB, which was against the rules, because he was underage. B. That was ONE TIME, in SEVEN YEARS. And C. He apologized and helped Harry in it.

---------- Post added at 09:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:43 PM ----------

HisMrs said:
They didn't know she was in so much pain because she wouldn't tell them anything. They had a right to be upset and it's understandable that they would be frustrated that she wouldn't open up to them. Just because they get mad at her doesn't mean they're horrible people because of it.
And if you really want to bring HP into it, doesn't Ron go all crazy on Harry because he's jealous when he's chosen out of the Goblet of Fire?? But seriously, back to the topic, which is Buffy and her friends, not Harry Potter, I stand by my opinion that the Scoobies and Joyce had every right to be upset with Buffy. Being her best friends and closest loved ones, though, they should have given more thought and been more sensitive to the fact that Buffy had to be going through something seriously deep to have run away like that.
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They never bothered to ask her. They threw a party full of strangers to avoid her. They gave no thought to Buffy's feelings. They only cared about how it effected THEM.
 
She shouldn't need to. As her supposed "best friends" they should be the ones thinking about her pain and what she went through, instead of ignoring her and blowing her off when she actually tried to talk about it.
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When one plays the "you wouldn't understand" card one too many times, it's quite normal for their friends to not understand them perfectly. Buffy tried to play it cool, Xander and Cordelia asked her what happened during the summer, she was understandably evasive. They were perfectly willing to give Buffy space and time to, as Flutie would have put it, heal; the quarrel only started because she wanted to run away again.

The viewers know that Buffy is all "Angel, Angel, Angel, I killed him!". But in a show where Xander having to kill Jesse or Buffy staking Ford doesn't seem to have affected those two characters in the slightest in the long term, it's not that unreasonable for the Scoobies to think that maybe Buffy did spank her inner moppet and playing it cool means she is sort of okay now. I mean, if the characters were realistic as far as dealing with violent death goes, they would all be in therapy forever just because their classmates keep being murdered, not to mention the people really close to them.

Oh they absolutely had every right to yell at her. And buffy had every right to yell back. I really love that this happens. Everyone is all pent up and silent and this allows everyone to get their feelings out. I think it was both necessary and important. And I think it brings them all closer.
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Yes, I like that nobody was portrayed as totally wrong or right too. So different than Empty Places where they might as well have put subtitles explaining that Buffy is right and we better root for her or else... 🙂
 
[MENTION=11428]Dagenspear[/MENTION], you really need to take a step back and stop "yelling" (using CAPS) to get a point across.
Xander asked her where she went and Willow attempted to talk to Buffy about what happened when they were all at Giles' after they found her... It was awkward and clear that Buffy didn't want to talk about it. I can imagine that this was really frustrating for them and it only made a weird situation more weird.
We are gonna have to agree to disagree though cause I'm not going to keep debating you on this.
 
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