Wesley's Dream in "Underneath"

[RogueDemonHunter]

So I just rewatched episode 17 of this season (season 5), the episode entitled "Underneath", and I was very confused as to the meaning of Wesley's dream with Fred. Obviously he is depressed about her death, and longing for her to be there, but the actual dialogue made no sense to me, here it is:

FRED
You have a visitor.

WESLEY
(turns slightly)
I thought I was in isolation.

FRED
(kisses his neck from behind him)
Whose fault is that?
(walks around to kneel in front of him)
Tell me a joke.

WESLEY
(softly)
2 men walk into a bar. The first man orders a scotch and soda. The second man remembers something he'd forgotten, and it doubles him over with pain. He falls to the floor shaking.... and then through the floor and into the Earth. He looks back up at the first man, but he doesn't call out to him.
(looks down at Fred)
They're not that close.

FRED
Yeah. You always know where you are.

WESLEY
It's my particular skill.

FRED
(crawls into his lap, looks into his eyes)
This is only the first layer. Don't you wanna see how deep I go?


So my question is, does anyone have an interpretation as to what this interaction meant?

 

[EffyStonem]

Alright, I'm going to give this a go. This could either be seen as brilliant or ridiculously stupid. Either way, I'm going in.

FRED
You have a visitor.

WESLEY
(turns slightly)
I thought I was in isolation.

FRED
(kisses his neck from behind him)
Whose fault is that?

This exchange is indicating that Wesley is feeling alone and cut off from the rest of the group in the wake of Fred's death. He believes himself to be in "isolation". Fred (or rather his subconcious) is pointing out that his isolation is his own making "“ he has chosen to distance himself from the others and therefore he can't blame them for the way he is feeling.

(walks around to kneel in front of him)
Tell me a joke.

WESLEY
(softly)
2 men walk into a bar. The first man orders a scotch and soda. The second man remembers something he'd forgotten, and it doubles him over with pain. He falls to the floor shaking.... and then through the floor and into the Earth.

There's probably a million different ways to intepret this exchange but my pet theory is that the two men Wes is referring to are himself and Gunn and the context of the joke is actually their feelings towards Fred.

The first man is Wesley. He knows that he loves Fred. He's always known. So he walks into the bar and orders the drink. The second man is Gunn who, in Wes's eyes, forgot that he cared about Fred. He is reminded of his feelings when she dies and the pain of it crushes him.

He looks back up at the first man, but he doesn't call out to him.
(looks down at Fred)
They're not that close.

FRED
Yeah. You always know where you are.

WESLEY
It's my particular skill.

This part of the joke seems to cover the fact that Gunn and Wes have drifted apart and therefore are unable to share their grief. This distance was brought on partially by their rivalry over Fred and so it ties into Wes's feelings and grief over her death.

The last line from Fred "You always know where you are" and Wes's response could be an indication that Wesley's feelings for Fred have always been there and have never changed. His "particular skill" is loving her.

FRED
(crawls into his lap, looks into his eyes)
This is only the first layer. Don't you wanna see how deep I go?

This is the most clear-cut part of the dream. Wes's subconcious is showing him how little time he had with Fred. He only got to the first "layer" before she died. He wants more, he wants to see "how deep" their relationship could have gone.

Well, I hope this made sense and didn't come across all fanwanky 😎

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

I think EffyStonem's interpretation is good, but I'd like to give it a go as well:

RED
You have a visitor.

WESLEY
(turns slightly)
I thought I was in isolation.

FRED
(kisses his neck from behind him)
Whose fault is that?
(walks around to kneel in front of him)
Tell me a joke.

WESLEY
(softly)
2 men walk into a bar. The first man orders a scotch and soda. The second man remembers something he'd forgotten, and it doubles him over with pain. He falls to the floor shaking.... and then through the floor and into the Earth. He looks back up at the first man, but he doesn't call out to him.
(looks down at Fred)
They're not that close.

I think Fred is suggesting that Wesley's isolation from his friends is his choice, and that she understands his feelings of helplessness.

FRED
Yeah. You always know where you are.

WESLEY
It's my particular skill.

This is only a comment on Wesley's education and intelligence, which Fred has always admired, but that in some ways Wesley resents.

FRED
(crawls into his lap, looks into his eyes)
This is only the first layer. Don't you wanna see how deep I go?

This is foreshadowing to what happens to her later...when Illyria takes over her body, every "layer."

That's my two cents, anyway. The beauty of these shows is they can are interpreted by every fan in a different way.

 

[AlienSoul]

Old post, but I just discovered this board and I love this discussion (and everything else on this board.) I, too, agree with most of the above. But I'd still like to add my additional thoughts 🙂

I think EffyStonem's interpretation is good, but I'd like to give it a go as well:

RED
You have a visitor.

WESLEY
(turns slightly)
I thought I was in isolation.

FRED
(kisses his neck from behind him)
Whose fault is that?
(walks around to kneel in front of him)
Tell me a joke.

WESLEY
(softly)
2 men walk into a bar. The first man orders a scotch and soda. The second man remembers something he'd forgotten, and it doubles him over with pain. He falls to the floor shaking.... and then through the floor and into the Earth. He looks back up at the first man, but he doesn't call out to him.
(looks down at Fred)
They're not that close.

I think Fred is suggesting that Wesley's isolation from his friends is his choice, and that she understands his feelings of helplessness.

I agree with this. Only I want to add that this particular 'joke' just adds to the eerie-bittersweet feeling in this scene. To allude to how Wesley is howling with pain on the inside, isolated from his friends. I don't remember if it's in this episode that he brings back the memories about Connor, so the 'remembering something he'd forgotten' could allude to that. I'll check. But even if it wasn't the same episode, it could still work.

FRED
Yeah. You always know where you are.

WESLEY
It's my particular skill.

This is only a comment on Wesley's education and intelligence, which Fred has always admired, but that in some ways Wesley resents.

I like your take on it!

FRED
(crawls into his lap, looks into his eyes)
This is only the first layer. Don't you wanna see how deep I go?

This is foreshadowing to what happens to her later...when Illyria takes over her body, every "layer."

I don't know. I have seen people around the web suggesting this 'layer' thing was a clue that Fred isn't really gone. A foreshadowing of the original S6 plot where Illyria was supposed to split into Fred/Illyria.