What happened to Cordy after "You're Welcome"

[Willow Rosenberg]

I know she's dead, but where do you think she went? Does she belong in heaven, hell or somewhere in between.

Just a curious thought...

 

[LadyLavinia]

Here's a better question - why didn't the Fang Gang make a big deal over Cordelia, when she was in a coma and after her death?

 

[ProphecyGirl]

I think she become one of TPTB. She deserved it.

 

[eset]

But she already was...and she really hated it.

Maybe it was just Jasmine working through her and trying to get down, but I can't see Cordy relishing inaction. She would love to help people out, but it would kill her (metaphorically) to only be able to watch.

 

[nerd4hire]

Here's my theory.

I think there's something beyond the PTB. To me, the way the PTB are presented, they're more like amoral cosmic policemen.

Something else seems present in the Buffy/Angelverse. It's what made it snow in Amends, what allows Buffy to rise up stronger in Prophecy Girl and Chosen. It's what let's Angel walk into Kate's apartment to save her, even though he'd never been invited in. It differs from the PTB in that it cares. It's nice, and it's where I believe Cordelia went.

 

[Xin Rong]

I always thought that was a spirit or the "first good" if there is such a thing

 

[VisionGuy]

I think that Cordelia is in some kind of heaven dimension punching the PTBs in the nose. I doubt that she became a higher power again. The only reason she became one before was because of Jasmine. Cordy hated it anyway so she would deny the offer.

 

[Lyri]

ok here's my theory...she in that place that all warriors go when they fall. where hero's end up when their destiny is fulfilled.
here, Cordy now dwells, cherishing her memories and walking with the other hero's from the shows...Doyle, Wesley, Kendra, Tara, and so many others.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

Anybody wants to know my theory of where Cordelia is, you will have to wait until the end of my Fanfic.......not that many people will care, but some people will.....



oops, should have written spoiler!!!!

 

[The Arcane]

Here's my theory.

I think there's something beyond the PTB. To me, the way the PTB are presented, they're more like amoral cosmic policemen.

Something else seems present in the Buffy/Angelverse. It's what made it snow in Amends, what allows Buffy to rise up stronger in Prophecy Girl and Chosen. It's what let's Angel walk into Kate's apartment to save her, even though he'd never been invited in. It differs from the PTB in that it cares. It's nice, and it's where I believe Cordelia went.

See, personally i don't think there is anything you mentioned there that couldn't be attributed to the PtB. They needed Angel alive to be their future champion and so made in snow in Amends to prevent his suicide. They bent the "no invitation" rule in Epiphany so that Angel could save Kate, thus getting him back on the hero path. Nothing there that didn't work in their favour, in the long run.

As for Buffy, well in both cases you mentioned Buffy rose again at a point where the power of the slayer line was being manipulated. The first time she was brought back was the point where the were suddenly two slayers active for the very first time and the second point you mentioned was only minutes after every single potential in the world was suddenly activated. It's no surprise that a surge in slayer power was available at both those points in time. I wouldn't say that there needed to be any help from on high on those occasions.

As for Cordy, i don't know, i got the impression that she was heading towards a mission of her own, somehow truly serving the PtB. Maybe as a messenger, maybe even as a warrior, who knows. I'd love to see for certain though. Wonder if now things are settled between Joss and Charisma there might be a chance of a little Cordy adventure in a telemovie of some sort. I can hope! 😀

 

[THE BLUE]

I think she is in between; neither heaven nor hell.

 

[Mr. Pointy]

If I ever get around to finishing my Xander story, entitled "You're more than welcome" btw - a clue there 😉 you might well get to see my theory about what happened immediately after she appears to die in "You're Welcome" (or it may be immediately before...I haven't decided which yet...don't hold your breath tho' - it's been over a year so far and I haven't got past the outline and a couple of introductory paragraphs...🙂

 

[Black Eye Guy]

See, personally i don't think there is anything you mentioned there that couldn't be attributed to the PtB. They needed Angel alive to be their future champion and so made in snow in Amends to prevent his suicide. They bent the "no invitation" rule in Epiphany so that Angel could save Kate, thus getting him back on the hero path. Nothing there that didn't work in their favour, in the long run.

Hmm this is interesting, I would tent to agree with N4H, if you look at the PTB's they always take credit for the things they have done, or point it out in some way?

And I could see where you could get The bit where Buffy rises in Chosen as the manipulation of the Slayer line, in the actual script it say's something like "Buffy, Faith and Spike fight harder then they have before as if they had been 'pumped up'."
But I'm not sure about the Prophecy Girl one...

 

[The Arcane]

Hmm this is interesting, I would tent to agree with N4H, if you look at the PTB's they always take credit for the things they have done, or point it out in some way?

How so? To my knowledge the PtB's never once took credit for anything they did. Sure, they sent the visions to Doyle and Cordy as directions for Angel but that was by neccessity, rather than to take credit. They needed Angel to receive a message which would set him on a path to carry out a mission they needed accomplished and they used the visions to do so. That wasn't taken credit, that was simply the way it had to be done.

However, in the cases seen in Amends and Epiphany, the acts of bringing about the snow and letting Angel into Kate's apartment were things that only beings of their power and influence could bring about. And as i already said, in both cases the end result would help to set Angel back on the path that they needed him to be on. Makes perfect sense to me that they would do whatever was neccessary to secure their champion.

And I could see where you could get The bit where Buffy rises in Chosen as the manipulation of the Slayer line, in the actual script it say's something like "Buffy, Faith and Spike fight harder then they have before as if they had been 'pumped up'."
But I'm not sure about the Prophecy Girl one...

I don't see the difference. In both cases there was a fundamental change in the slayer line at the exact moment where Buffy seems to have a sudden surge in power. No reason to doubt that the two had similar origins.

I think, for me, my feelings that this is all down to the PtB, rather than an even higher power, also comes down to my knowledge of Joss' personal beliefs. He, like myself, is an athiest and he created the Powers that Be to replace the need for there being a "God" within the slayerverse. I tend to look at the PtB as the ultimate source of "Good" within this fictional reality in the same way that the demons are supposed to be the ultimate source of "Evil". That fact, couples with what i already said above, leaves me with no doubt that the PtB were responsible for these acts.

 

[nerd4hire]

Interesting you mention the fact Joss is an atheist, because it made me remember something.

Joss was discussing the snow in Amends thing, and he said something like (I can find the quote if you want), if you wanted to attach a Christian connation to it it would be OK by him.

I believe what he meant was the idea of whatever caused the snow in Amends was purposely open-ended. You can view it in a way that works for you.

I think the whole idea of what's ultimately in power in both the Buffy and Angel verse is presented in a similarly open-ended fashion. It's whatever works for you.

What works for me is a power beyond even the PTB. It's what creates the law that even the Senior Partners and the PTB. have to obey. I'm not saying that's a script fact. I'm saying that's what works for me.

 

[The Arcane]

Don't worry about the quote, N4H, i can just about recall the comment you are talking about.

And yeah, that is pretty much what i meant in the final paragraph of my last post. My reasoning behind tending to believe that all these things could easily have been done by the PtB is due to me sharing a similar faith (or lack of same) to Joss. It certainly was left open to intepretation so that you can fill in the blanks with your own ideas about the "Higher Powers" of the Buffyverse, which i think is the best way Joss could possibly have done it, without alienating a portion of the fanbase, or worse, actually offending one group or another.

Again, for me it's pretty simple, as i have no real belief in gods in reality, to attribute what we see to those that we do know have been guiding Angel's life for a number of years. There is no reason to doubt that the PtB could have made the snow fall, or let Angel into Kate's apartment, but those that choose to believe in someone even higher up in the cosmic balance are free to do so thanks to Joss not ramming one particular belief system into his stories.

 

[Cordelia Chase*]

Well to me, I believe Cordelia was already dead before she helped Angel and Spike. Now what about this vision thing? I think I read a guide for one of the eps and it said she passed the visions on to Angel when she kissed him.

 

[Lyri]

as Angel mentioned in, i think the ep was 'Power Play' it was a one time deal...Cordy gave him a gift of one last vision, so that Fred's death wouldn't be in vain. he never actually received the full vision power.

 

[The Arcane]

Well to me, I believe Cordelia was already dead before she helped Angel and Spike. Now what about this vision thing? I think I read a guide for one of the eps and it said she passed the visions on to Angel when she kissed him.

Yeah, without a doubt Cordy was technically dead in You're Welcome. Her body never left the hospital whilst her spirit was given a manifest form by the PtB so that she could help Angel.

And the vision Angel received was a one time deal, as Lyri just said.

 

[nerd4hire]

Again, for me it's pretty simple, as i have no real belief in gods in reality, to attribute what we see to those that we do know have been guiding Angel's life for a number of years. There is no reason to doubt that the PtB could have made the snow fall, or let Angel into Kate's apartment, but those that choose to believe in someone even higher up in the cosmic balance are free to do so thanks to Joss not ramming one particular belief system into his stories.

That's true if you choose to believe the PTB are the ultimate power in the verse, and if anything is manipulated behind the scenes it can be attributed to them, what's to stop you? Nothing.

At the same time I want to clarify again, if you choose to believe there is a power beyond the PTB that can be used as a personal reference explaining stuff like the snow in Amends, where Cordy goes, and the other things I mentioned, you can find support for that.

For example if we believe what Jasmine says when she claims to be a PTB, we have to be struck by the fact there are rules governing how she returns to this reality. It could be the other Powers, or it could be something else beyond them making these demands.

When Jasmine offers up her origin story in Shiny Happy People she suggests the Powers were pressured to leave this reality. This suggests power beyond the Powers.

You could say Jasmine isn't credible, or you could say maybe there is some truth in what she says.

Jasmine is vain she's not shy about taking credit for her power, yet she claims Man was created by something other the powers. What?

Jasmine claims she was forged in the fires of creation. If so what created her?

On the other hand you could say same thing, even if you postulate a power beyond the powers. What created it?

In CWDP Holden Webster asks if there's any word on the existence of God. Buffy replies something like "Nothing definite". She doesn't say "No. There's only the PTB".

It's stuff like this that makes me comfortable believing Cordy went to a place beyond the PTB's control.

I haven't seen anything in the scripts, or read anything in the external literature convincing me I'm not entitled to the warm, fuzzy feeling I get believing that. 🙂