What Have They Done To Captain America?

white avenger

white avenger
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What evil, despicable plot is this, saying that the very bastion of truth, justice, and the American way is, and always has been, an agent of Hydra?

https://www.inverse.com/article/161...d-captain-america-was-a-hydra-agent-all-along

When did this happen, and why has everyone been trying to keep it from me?

(Personally, I think that this is all just a plot to besmirch Cap's hard core conservatism in an election year on the hopes that it will help the Liberals get you-know-who into the White House for another eight year run. Dang gun grabbin', tree huggin', flag burnin' noacounts will stoop to any measures just to get their girl sitting in the Oval Office)
 
It happened back in May. I thought it was a great twist, and will definitely keep the future comic book story lines fresh and will have lasting repercussions on the Marvel universe for definite. I think it's bold, I hope they don't retract it in a few months time, or say he was a triple agent or something like that. If they're going to do this, they should just plough ahead with it.

I don't think they're planning to turn him in the MCU though.
 
What evil, despicable plot is this, saying that the very bastion of truth, justice, and the American way is, and always has been, an agent of Hydra?

https://www.inverse.com/article/161...d-captain-america-was-a-hydra-agent-all-along

When did this happen, and why has everyone been trying to keep it from me?

(Personally, I think that this is all just a plot to besmirch Cap's hard core conservatism in an election year on the hopes that it will help the Liberals get you-know-who into the White House for another eight year run. Dang gun grabbin', tree huggin', flag burnin' noacounts will stoop to any measures just to get their girl sitting in the Oval Office)
Well, it happened long before that.

"Captain America: The Winter Soldier" turned Hydra from a Nazi/Communist evil to some kind of Republican caricature. Making Captain America a traitor is a natural development. Perfect progressivist logic.

I bet they would "progress" by making the Iron Man evil, because he's a capitalist. DC will follow. Superman is a white supremacist and Batman is a despicable rich bastard you know.
 
It happened back in May. I thought it was a great twist, and will definitely keep the future comic book story lines fresh and will have lasting repercussions on the Marvel universe for definite. I think it's bold, I hope they don't retract it in a few months time, or say he was a triple agent or something like that. If they're going to do this, they should just plough ahead with it.

I don't think they're planning to turn him in the MCU though.
It was a trick. Reality was changed to make him that way. It's not the 'real' Captain America. When they gave him back his youth they programmed him as a hydra agent. It's not that much different from what they did with the skrull storyline.
 
Well, it happened long before that.

"Captain America: The Winter Soldier" turned Hydra from a Nazi/Communist evil to some kind of Republican caricature. Making Captain America a traitor is a natural development. Perfect progressivist logic.

I bet they would "progress" by making the Iron Man evil, because he's a capitalist. DC will follow. Superman is a white supremacist and Batman is a despicable rich bastard you know.

Seriously, though, maybe I'm just getting too old for all these new fangled ideas and plot twists, but I remember, and truly miss, the days when a hero was a hero simply because that was the right thing to be, and if he had super powers or enhanced abilities, he used them to help those weaker than himself for no other reason than that's what a hero is supposed to do. Now, everybody's working some kind of angle or trying to advance their own agenda. It's like the old song, "Where Are The Heroes?" We just can't accept the fact that good guys are guys that are good, with no qualifiers, and no hidden missions.

Maybe that's why we have so few real heroes left.

 
Seriously, though, maybe I'm just getting too old for all these new fangled ideas and plot twists, but I remember, and truly miss, the days when a hero was a hero simply because that was the right thing to be, and if he had super powers or enhanced abilities, he used them to help those weaker than himself for no other reason than that's what a hero is supposed to do.
You haven't read the comics in a LONG time have you? LOL.
 
You haven't read the comics in a LONG time have you? LOL.

When I was reading comics, Nick Fury was a white Army Sargent in World War 2, Barry Allen was the Flash, Hal Jordan was Green Lantern, nobody had ever heard of Wolverine, and Dick Grayson was Robin. There were only 5 X Men, 7 members of the JLA, and no alternate Earths.

Yeah, I've been out of the game for quite awhile, and my only connections with them these days are the Whedon books and the movies.
 
Mr. Pole: He still is white. Except for the Ultimate edition which they created because of the Sam Jackson role.

Yeah, but when I was reading about him, he wasn't the director of SHIELD, he was the Sargent leading the Howling Commandos in World War 2 Germany and Italy.
 
Skanky Vamp
Skanky Vamp
He still is white. Except for the Ultimate edition which they created because of the Sam Jackson role.
I can't speak for hardcore political types who have to warp everything through their ideological lens, but when I saw the CA: the Winter Soldier (which I only saw at the insistence of a friend of mine and was surprised that I did enjoy it as a popcorn flick), I didn't see Hydra as Republican. My understanding is that they'd have agents in both major parties, and also among those who spoke out against both major parties, and would have them among law enforcement and terrorists both. That Captain American and friends worked for SHIELD strikes me as Homeland Security, and HS strikes me as more Republican than progressive, and as was shown, there were heroes and villains both in the agency.

I'd see the politicians the same way, some would oppose Hydra, others would be secret agents of it (and they'd have to be secret because otherwise they'd be drummed out--granted, secret Hydra agents would be among those to drum them out, but only to protect their own secret and thus minimize the damage to Hydra's assets, heck, Hydra agents could frame someone else as being with Hydra, that sounds right up their alley). Hydra is a conspiratorial organization that remains in the shadows, and according to the movie they'd given up in trying to convince people through either conversion or force, but rather to manipulate people into demanding their dominion in the guise of the fronts that already exist which Hydra has secretly infiltrated (in which case they'd probably still stay in the shadows using their various front organizations on both sides of the law as convenient). To think that Hydra could be identified by party affiliation strikes me as silly since that would defeat the entire point of Hydra.

As for Hydra succeeding so well so that they took (momentarily) full control of SHIELD in CA: The Winter Soldier, that's just standard storytelling, and plenty (like the X-Files) are even based on it (the exception is when the threat is so vast that the government itself becomes beleaguered, such as in the movie Independence Day). There's got to be a reason why you can't just call the authorities, and/or for the heroes of the story to stand on their own (happens in Buffy and Angel quite a bit as well). It happens everywhere, it even happened in the Star Trek series (from the episode Conspiracy to Section 31 to the movie Insurrection ), but that's hardly a political agenda at work, just an old way to tell an exciting story where the heroes shine.
 
Just thought I'd add, whether intentional or not, Captain America (in what little I've seen of him, from CA: The Winter Soldier to Avengers) makes me think of someone who strongly missed the speeches of JFK, which would make sense. And JFK would be very out of place today with his speeches that were thoughtful, compassionate (but not touchy-feely), and respectful. That is, I don't mean he'd be out of place for his views, but more for his attitude and appealing to the better parts of humanity rather than the lowest common denominator (often with rhetoric as shallow and meaningless as a bumper sticker slogan) as seems to be the case today (at least in the USA). Both Captain America and JFK (given what I've seen of both) just couldn't fit into the modern system today.
 
But the Captain America in the comics is completely different than the one shown on screen. Just like Civil War, Winter Soldier, Ultron storylines all were changed. You cant really compare what is happening in the comics to the movie universe at all. They are two different things.
 
That Captain American and friends worked for SHIELD strikes me as Homeland Security, and HS strikes me as more Republican than progressive

Strangely, most of my friends, predominantly Republicans or at least conservatives, refer to Homeland Security as the equivalent of Obama's Gestapo. I guess it's just a matter of perspective.
 
But the Captain America in the comics is completely different than the one shown on screen. Just like Civil War, Winter Soldier, Ultron storylines all were changed. You cant really compare what is happening in the comics to the movie universe at all. They are two different things.

Yeah, I've always considered series, movies, and comics different. And if the series reboots then that's different, too. I'm actually that way about Buffy (movie, comics, series, all different, even if Joss says the comics are canon).
 
Strangely, most of my friends, predominantly Republicans or at least conservatives, refer to Homeland Security as the equivalent of Obama's Gestapo. I guess it's just a matter of perspective.
What did they call them before Obama?
 
What did they call them before Obama?

It never really came up before Obama, actually. I guess, to be fair, they would have been Bush's Gestapo back then. But in a nicer way.
 
Both Captain America and JFK (given what I've seen of both) just couldn't fit into the modern system today.

And, ironically, we are now hearing that JFK wasn't all that nice a person, either, with his mistresses and drug abuse and the possibility that he even had a few people murdered. The whole Kennedy family was corrupt, from Joe, sr right down to JFK jr.
 
I pretty much expect everyone to have skeletons in their closet, with JFK being no exception. His message and delivery are still very different from typical politicians today (and maybe even in his own day, as I've only listed to JFK's speeches).

As for Homeland Security, I remember a gun range I used to belong to. Long story short, there was a group of vocal conservatives (*) who were more emotional rather than rational who loved everything Bush did, and got upset when I reminded them that one day a Democrat would be POTUS. And then when Obama won, suddenly the things they supported under Bush was a terrible power Obama would use against them. (* I want to make clear that I don't think of all conservatives being like them, and I get along with conservatives, and many other political persuasions, as long as they don't get too crazy or obnoxious over it.)
 
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