What if Oz never left?

GATEGOD said:
A dead end.. haha sort of like they were in love, happy and content and could have been with each other forever dead end?
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I agree it had hit a dead end. Their relationship had gone stale and tbh i dont think the had anywhere near the same connection that Willow had with Tara.
 
It is hard to speculate on this but here is my thought. We saw that the "dark" side of Willow was kinda gay so I wonder if Seth was already indicating at that time that he wanted to jump ship. I loved the Willow/Oz dynamic and I have to tell you it broke my heart to see him go. Especially when Willow turns on the water works but at the end of the day I love that she goes to Tara for support. I am straight but a huge supporter of the rainbow parade so I say hooray Lesbians 🙂
 
I kinda liked Oz. He was different and quite amusing. The whole how he became a werewolf thing was a bit lame imo, but him being a werewolf, and Willow still accepting him was so great. The power of loooove.
I don't think Willow would have turned gay, if Oz hadn't left. They were the kind of couple you just knew would love each other forever. I like Tillow very much, but I still favor Willoz
 
I really liked Oz! He was sweet and funny and he was Willow's first real boyfriend and they were just a really cute couple. (I'm watching S2 right now)

When he left I was shocked and then when Willow chose Tara over him I kinda, well not hate, but I didn't like Tara. But then... Well you all know how their relationship grew and they really loved each other so I started loving them. But again... No happy end...

Anyway I think Tillow was the better couple but I liked the character Oz more. Probably also because he's a guy and I'm not into girls :happy06:
 
JCC said:
Xander would've been gay. That was the original idea in the first place, and would've been a lot better. Lesbians aren't that stigmatised any more (don't take this as me saying that they're not, but it's certainly more acceptable, and seems the backbone of the male heterosexual pornography market), Joss was still making an important point, but it was feeble in comparison to the statement than Xander being openly gay would've been.
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I couldn't disagree more, count gay male characters on tv and count gay female characters on tv... there are WAAAAAY more gay male characters, and they're protrayed really normally on a lot of shows.

If Oz left though, I don't know if they would've gone with Willow being gay, but I'm glad he left, because he kind of was done imo, and I didn't care much for his "taming the wolf" thing that was kind of happening to him.
 
i do think that willow would have still met tara through the wicca group and started to have feelings towards her that were more than friendly. Eventually Oz and willow would have broken up and went in their different directions, so all oz would have done by staying is delay tara and willows relationship. 🙂
 
WhiteHat said:
I just thought the whole "Willow suddenly goes gay" thing was a very cheap ratings ploy so typical for TV, esp. during sweeps week. And is there any info on WHY Seth had to leave??? It surely wasn't Robot Chicken! Some actors just can't take the day-to-day grind of TV shoots and yearn for the relatively leisurely pace of movie schedules, IMHO. Maybe that's it.
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Actually, I think Willow/Tara came long before every show started saying, "Oh, let's make a character gay for ratings!" And they were hardly the typical gay TV couple. The characters clearly did fall in love with each other (Willow certainly didn't just "suddenly go gay"), they used little if any gratuitous sex, and most importantly, their relationship was actually realistic. As for Seth's departure, I think he wanted to start doing movies, and eventually, he decided to make Robot Chicken.

Now, back on topic...as much as I loved Willow and Oz together, their relationship had definitely gone stale by the beginning of season 4. The end of their relationship was inevitable. I think if he hadn't left, they would have broken up and he would have just been one the Scoobies for the rest of the show, possibly finding a new love interest along the way.
 
Hmm. It seems to me that relationships never seem to go well for long in the Buffyverse. It's just the way of the world. Seems to me it's likely the two would have broken up anyway. Yet, I did love Oz, and it would have been great to keep him on as a main character. I'm sure they could have done something interesting with his character apart from being with Willow. Also, I heard he was sopposed to be on Angel too...don't know if this is true though.
 
If Oz had stayed and Xander turned gay?.
Considering how religious America likes to think it is, I'm wondering how two blokes kissing would have affected the ratings all those years ago.
At a rough guess the time slot would have been a lot later, a least a 10:30 start. So that probably would have ended the show.
Oz did the show a big favour by leaving (forcing the writers to re-think their plans). If he was aware of Xander turning gay, chances are he may have thought that scenario would have ended the show.
 
ILLYRIAN said:
If Oz had stayed and Xander turned gay?.
Considering how religious America likes to think it is, I'm wondering how two blokes kissing would have affected the ratings all those years ago.
At a rough guess the time slot would have been a lot later, a least a 10:30 start. So that probably would have ended the show.
Oz did the show a big favour by leaving (forcing the writers to re-think their plans). If he was aware of Xander turning gay, chances are he may have thought that scenario would have ended the show.
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I don't think that would have been the case at all actually. At the same time Buffy was on air there was Jack McPhee on Dawson's Creek that was openly gay, kissing other guys and it never affected that show, which was on the same network.
 
ILLYRIAN
ILLYRIAN
Aren't you the brave one? Comparing Buffy to Dawson's Creek.
All I have to say is I wouldn't want BtVS any other way. It's good he left, or as Joss says "Bailed on our asses".
 
ILLYRIAN agrees: Aren't you the brave one? Comparing Buffy to Dawson's Creek.
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I'm not at all comparing the quality of the shows. I do like Dawson's Creek and am not ashamed to own up to that but I wouldn't presume to claim its better than Buffy, lol. You just implied in your post that having Xander be gay on Buffy and him kissing other guys would have affected the show and its ratings in a negative manner. And I just pointed out I don't feel that would have been the case at all because at that same time another show on the same network and with similiar if not earlier time-slot was doing the whole gay guy storyline thing with no bad effects on ratings... so to say that having a male homosexual relationship portrayed on Buffy would have resulted in a drop in ratings and possible cancellation just paints a really bad portrait of Buffy fans as intolerant homophobes.
 
ILLYRIAN
ILLYRIAN
It's the people who decide what time it gets aired that are the pratts. In WA, Torchwood went from a 10:30 timeslot to a 11:30 timeslot after the ep when Capt Jack kissed a bloke.
Airam what you said about it paiting a bad pic that Buffy fans are homophobes just moved me in some way I totally aree with that statement!
 
I don't think having Xander be gay instead of Willow would have had any more of an adverse influence on ratings than having done so with Willow. First of all, in addition to Dawson's Creek, popular contemporary shows featuring gay characters included very gay-centric programs like Queer as Folk, Will & Grace, and the L Word. Let's not forget the incredible lesbian subtext in Xena: Warrior Princess, either. Furthermore, let's not forget that Xander's relationship with Cordy was long over and that his relationship with Anya was just beginning. The timing for a new Xander relationship would have angered fewer fans, as it would not have required the breakup of a popular couple. Given the plot and relationships current near the time of Oz's departure and the fact that enough viewers existed to sustain other shows with a much greater focus on gay relationships, I'm not sure either American audiences in general or Buffy fans in particular should be assumed to be skittish about watching Buffy if Xander had been gay versus the story that we got with Willow.

As far as Oz's departure goes, I do feel that it was rather rushed. He was an important part of the Buffyverse and I would have liked to have seen his departure contribute more to the overall arc of the season. If they only had a few episodes during which to address the Veruca issue, then I think Oz's story would have been better suited to the Initiative story. Perhaps he could have remained in Initiative custody for long enough to be traumatized or altered by the experiments, thus prompting his exit to find a way to control the wolf. It would even have been possible to tie the Veruca story in as an experiment in werewolf sexuality and/or breeding capabilities. as it was, his story seemed very rushed and not well-connected to the rest of the season. Even so, I really liked New Moon Rising, so I guess it was all worth it.
 
CordyCat said:
All I have to say is I wouldn't want BtVS any other way. It's good he left, or as Joss says "Bailed on our asses".
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lol! Bailed on our asses. I miss Oz. I liked him. Although it was pretty good he left. It would've been nice if he had a cameo in S7 or something
 
I'm glad we were spared gay Xander. It's better that Willow was the gay one if one of them was going to be gay. I personally relate to Xander the most as he's a young, straight somewhat nerdy dude. No one else really fits that bill, so I'm glad they kept Xander the way he was. Besides, for a gay male, we ended up getting Andrew (okay, so we don't see him kissing guys but we all know what's going on), so basically this way there were gay men and women on the show.
 
Seth staying would have meant a world without Tillow.

I'm too distressed to move on just thinking about that . lol
 
I honestly think Joss still would have continued on with the lesbian plot line, only because I remember him saying something about having complete writer's block when it came to Oz in late Season 3 and Seth Green agreed with him.
 
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