Why did Buffy disrespect Spike so much in S5?

[Librarian Giles]

He was helping her out a lot of the time, but he never seemed to get credit for any of it. Yes, he was seeking credit and just wanted Buffy to like him, but the guy still has no soul, so it is a big thing for him to do any of this. For example in that episode with that troll dude, remember when he took out the second level of the Bronze and several people fell? Spike was tending to some of the people, not just to be nice, but to get Buffy's attention, i don't think she knew that though. So then she asks him rudely "what are doing?" Spike is basically harmless, so i don't know why she loathes him so much.


Just look at it this way, Spike has no soul, but he is helping out Buffy from time to time. It's a big achievement on his part to do this, and espcially more near the end of the season when it comes to Glory torturing him. Yet, he still gets no credit and gets pissed on from time to time from mostly Xander or Buffy. At least treat the guy with respect and thank him from time to time, you don't need to praise the guy and make him your best friend.

 

[Kean]

He was helping her out a lot of the time, but he never seemed to get credit for any of it. Yes, he was seeking credit and just wanted Buffy to like him, but the guy still has no soul, so it is a big thing for him to do any of this. For example in that episode with that troll dude, remember when he took out the second level of the Bronze and several people fell? Spike was tending to some of the people, not just to be nice, but to get Buffy's attention, i don't think she knew that though. So then she asks him rudely "what are doing?" Spike is basically harmless, so i don't know why she loathes him so much.


Just look at it this way, Spike has no soul, but he is helping out Buffy from time to time. It's a big achievement on his part to do this, and espcially more near the end of the season when it comes to Glory torturing him. Yet, he still gets no credit and gets pissed on from time to time from mostly Xander or Buffy. At least treat the guy with respect and thank him from time to time, you don't need to praise the guy and make him your best friend.

Because Giles trusted Spike about as much as Andrew could through him. Regardless of the help that Spike was giving Giles felt he had an alterior motive and that ultimately he was a savage dog on leash who would attack as so as he was free again.

 

[Karol]

Cause to love Spike is wroooooong.

I think it resumes everything. Looks wrong a soulless vampire helping, and a slayer together falling in love.

 

[atticus]

She doesn't trust him, the previous season he tried to kill her, her friends, he got chipped and still tried to break up the group by turning everyone against each other, he worked for adam, he tried to get the chip removed so he could kill again, chained buff up because she didn't love him, was going to shoot her. And made a sex toy in her image. Ha. He doesn't deserve her respect.
When he wouldn't give up dawn to glory, that's when, he earned her respect, doesn't mean she had to like him though. She invited him back into her home, and asked him to protect dawn, that's big deal. But she just couldn't like the guy.

 

[Spuffy78]

Buffy knew that although Spike had the chip and couldn't hurt anyone he didn't have a soul. Despite her feelings later on she couldn't admit to herself in a way giving Spike credit because I think she learned with Angel that evil isn't black and white but she was testing Spike to see if he'd turn back into William The Bloody.

 

[sosa lola]

Perhaps because Spike gets paid for his help. Buffy thinks he helps for money, not because he cares. It was only since Crush where Spike helps without taking cash from Buffy, the episode when she discovers that he's in love with her.

 

[fly on the wall]

Oh yes, because we're always respectful to the creepy serial-killer-on-a-leash who is obsessed with us while at the same time wanting to kill us 90% of the time.

It's hard I think, for us as the viewers to see Buffy's point of view when she's mean to Spike, because most of us adore Spike. Buffy doesn't though, and not for no reason.

Besides, when he didn't tell Glory everything, Buffy kissed him. I think that counts as giving him credit!

 

[Librarian Giles]

Oh yes, because we're always respectful to the creepy serial-killer-on-a-leash who is obsessed with us while at the same time wanting to kill us 90% of the time.

It's hard I think, for us as the viewers to see Buffy's point of view when she's mean to Spike, because most of us adore Spike. Buffy doesn't though, and not for no reason.

Besides, when he didn't tell Glory everything, Buffy kissed him. I think that counts as giving him credit!

Damn i forgot about that! Good point, that is much credit!

 

[Airam]

Yeah I was just going to say, that to Buffy's credit, I think once she saw the true sacrifice Spike made for her and Dawn in Intervention, from that point on she did start trusting him. Despite how thrown off she was by Spike's feelings for her at that time she was able to recognize that Spike's intentions were true... by posing as the bot she got proof beyond the shadow of a doubt that Spike honestly would do anything to protect them and that he wasn't just "acting" to get on her good side. And she told him, "What you did, for me and for Dawn, that was real, I won't forget it." I think that was giving him major credit and she gave it to him because he earned it, she couldn't deny it. As for the rest of the scoobies, they never fully let their gaurd down but I think bit by bit, they each gave him as much as credit as they could... progressively they all grew to trust him more as the season went on. Willow didn't give a second thought to channelling him to go up on the tower and protect Dawn, for example. And during the summer after Buffy passed they did all allow him in to their circle, worked along side him and trusted him with Dawn. Sure they all pretty much regressed again during S6 but, what can ya do, people can be fickle that way :silly:

 

[Kean]

Because Giles trusted Spike about as much as Andrew could through him. Regardless of the help that Spike was giving Giles felt he had an alterior motive and that ultimately he was a savage dog on leash who would attack as so as he was free again.

LMFAO...I just looked at this thread againa and couldn't figure out why my post made no sense..then I realised when I was reading the thread title and who posted it I read it as Why did Giles disrespect Spike so much in S5?

:blush:

 

[Relic]

I think he deserved no respect at the begining, so why give it to him....he comes as close to killing her as I think he ever has in "Out of My Head" when he thinks his chip is gone. In retrospect, I'm surprised that lack of respect did not manifest itself in him getting dusted.

He just doesn't lend himself to respect right away.

Latter though, she does show him respect, even kisses him for the truth that she got out of him when he thought she was the Buffy Bot and Buffy was tricking him into letting her know where he stands on matters of Dawn and Glory.

I think she doesn't show him respect because at first he did not deserve it. What she did show him is leniency, which I do think at the time, he did not deserve also.

pays off in the end though, no?

 

[Girl with Sword]

Though I love Spike, I can see Buffy's position in this. I hold grudges against people for much less. If someone tried to kill my friends, they'd never be forgiven by me. Buffy has a hard time trusting anyone as it is, least of all sombody who's tried to kill her. Her being mean to him sucks from Spike's position but makes sense.

 

[Perny]

Honestly...what was there to respect?
OK I am diehard Spuffy and Spike fan, but even I can see that Spike didn't do much to earn respect. At first he was bad, then he turned to the Scoobies, and helped them in exchange of cash... Hmm what respect do you get if you only help people cos of their money? And in the last part she was just a litle creeped out by the sudden "I love you" factor

 

[Urgent Power]

The thing that bothers me, and not only in season 5, is that in one second Buffy is nice to Spike, like a friend. Then, in the same episode, in another scene she's mean to him again.
In Intervention, Buffy promises to Spike that she would never forget what he's done for her and Dawn. Then, in season 6, it's like she did forget, and she's mean to him again. We see it alot in season 6. And I know it's season 5 section here, but nevertheless... there are many examples from this season. Like in "Normal Again", Buffy runs into Spike at the graveyard and Buffy tells him about the "wedding", filling him in like they were good friends. Then, later on in this episode, she tells him that he's not a part of her life, she doesn't want him in her life. I understand that she didn't respect him in season 5. Until Intervention. But then, even after he protected Dawn (and Buffy), and there came season 6, and it's like she forgot all the things he did for her.

 

[white avenger]

Buffy showed so little respect for Spike at the beginning of Season 5 simply because she was judging him by his past actions, which was, in defense of her, completely understandable. The Spike that she had come to know and respect as an enemy was changing, but neither she nor any of her friends saw it. When she looked at him, she saw William the Bloody, Slayer of Slayers. She simply couldn't accept that a soul-less vampire, for whatever reason, could change from a monster into a trusted ally and even friend. She only began to see Spike in that light after his being tortured by Glory.

 

[Pulse]

Okay I love Spike, but I can admit that maybe he doesn't deserve a lot of respect, but I'm more perplexed by the reaction of the gang especially Joyce, when they all find out that Spike loves Buffy. Joyce liked Spike and treated him normal, but even she wasn't happy about it. Everyone else was damn near angry, which makes no sense. I would never in my life be like "oh that person loves my friend? ARRRHGHGHHGHGH HULK MAAADD!!!". I mean it's weird, but I don't get why they start to treat him like shit. And they do start to treat him even worse than before, because even Xander sat and talked with him in the Bronze a couple episodes prior and they had a little chat. Honestly my initial reaction would be "oh good, now we really have an ally that'll do anything for Buffy...sweet"

 

[Revolver]

Because I don't think they believed he was in love with Buffy. Rather, they believed his "love" was just a different manifestation of his obsession with her. And even though Spike honestly believed he was in love with her, she would never have been able to return his feelings (at this point in the series, before her death and him getting a soul, etc.). So you have a monster on a leash in love with you, and you're not going to return the feelings of love. It stands to reason they'd worry a bit about this. Her rejection of him could easily have resulted in the opposite reaction from the monster, had that leash come off.

 

[Mazikeen]

Re:

He was helping her out a lot of the time, but he never seemed to get credit for any of it. Yes, he was seeking credit and just wanted Buffy to like him, but the guy still has no soul, so it is a big thing for him to do any of this. For example in that episode with that troll dude, remember when he took out the second level of the Bronze and several people fell? Spike was tending to some of the people, not just to be nice, but to get Buffy's attention, i don't think she knew that though. So then she asks him rudely "what are doing?" Spike is basically harmless, so i don't know why she loathes him so much.


Just look at it this way, Spike has no soul, but he is helping out Buffy from time to time. It's a big achievement on his part to do this, and espcially more near the end of the season when it comes to Glory torturing him. Yet, he still gets no credit and gets pissed on from time to time from mostly Xander or Buffy. At least treat the guy with respect and thank him from time to time, you don't need to praise the guy and make him your best friend.

I think in Buffy's shoes I would have acted similarly toward Spike. I mean, what reason did she have to show him any respect? He was her arch-enemy-turned-caged-animal and just because he wasn't capable of biting her any longer, who's to say he wouldn't have in a heartbeat had that chip been removed? Do you really think that just because he had a jonesing for her that he wouldn't have attacked her once that chip was removed? I can think of a handful of things that Spike did post-chip that would ring some bells. And does anybody remember in S6 when he THOUGHT his chip was malfunctioning and he tried to attack a woman in an alley? He was what he was because he had to be. It's like a dog with one of those electric fences? She showed him respect when he deserved it, for example the Glory situation and treated him like the vampire he was the rest of the time.

 

[Blaze]

Well, I just think that overall if we would make a comparison in real life, it would be like finding out that a serial killer is in love with you, but wait he is in prison (the ship in Spike's case). I would be just as freaked out prison or no prison and what happens if he ever comes out?? I think that if you see it that way, the gang had the right to be a little upset.

Adding to the fact that they tought his feelings weren't coming from the right place and he tried to kill Buffy a gazillion times priar to that.

It doesn't mean that Buffy was always right to act the way she did but some of the times yes. And he got the respect he deserves eventually after he redeemed himself which is whats really important in this case.

-Blaze-

 

[Pulse]

Well, I just think that overall if we would make a comparison in real life, it would be like finding out that a serial killer is in love with you, but wait he is in prison (the ship in Spike's case). I would be just as freaked out prison or no prison and what happens if he ever comes out?? I think that if you see it that way, the gang had the right to be a little upset.

Adding to the fact that they tought his feelings weren't coming from the right place and he tried to kill Buffy a gazillion times priar to that.

It doesn't mean that Buffy was always right to act the way she did but some of the times yes. And he got the respect he deserves eventually after he redeemed himself which is whats really important in this case.

-Blaze-

Excellent point, you've almost completely made me get why they were acting that way BUT my love for spike makes me try to rationalize a way around your argument. See it's not human nature to kill other humans, but it is in a vampire's nature to. Spike is foresaking things that are literally in his nature to be something for Buffy. Whats a little tricky imo is that a serial killer human is just messed up, but theoretically vamps have to have a completely distinct standard because of who they are, and therefore... its a little different?

But yea, I actually completely agree, if a serial killer was in love with me I'd be really fn freaked out, and I'd be afraid that rejecting him would be akin to giving myself the death sentence