Why the Xander hate?

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mayfever

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Inspired by another discussion over in the Confessions thread, and the current abundance of "Why the ... hate" threads, I thought I'd start one on Xander. While I don't really hate him as much as I hate other characters, I have some big time issues with him, especially the way he gets away with a couple of truly despicable things that are never addressed again. Very basically, my reasoning in the other thread was:

Let's see... he's jealous, judgmental, interfering, stupid and often enough just plain nasty. I never forgave him for the "kick his ass" line in "Becoming Pt 2".
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The Unspoken disagreed with me, and kindly allowed to drag her post over here to fuel the new discussion:

The Unspoken said:
Xander stupid and interfering? Yes, which is why he was the one to chase after Buffy and bring her back from the dead ('Prophecy Girl'), as well as stop Willow from destroying the world ('Grave'). He was also so stupid that he's one of the few main characters not to murder people or be tempted by the dark side at some point.

Xander's hate of Angel and Spike is understandable, seeing as how her relationship with them typically corresponds with an emotional low in her life (running away to Los Angeles and season 6 respectively).
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While I agree with the first part (I wasn't saying that Xander is a bad person, merely giving reasons why I dislike him, and I love love love that powerful scene between him and Willow at the end of season 6), I have to disagree with the second. Xander disliked Angel from the moment he met him, because he was jealous of his effect on, and later relationship with, Buffy. Even when he was dating Cordelia, he still entertained fantasies about Buffy becoming disillusioned with Angel and turning to him instead. The "Kick his ass" line wasn't born out of concern for Buffy; he wanted Angel gone good and proper because he still viewed him as a threat to his quest to win Buffy's heart.

His attitude towards Spike is similar even though he wasn't really interested in Buffy anymore, and it doesn't bug me as much because a) I agree that his and Buffy's "relationship" is unhealthy and b) unlike Angel, Spike is a match for Xander in the snarky department and their verbal sparring makes for hellishly good television 🙂
 
Why I don't like Xander? Cause he's a douchebag! I'm not going to get to much into numbering specific reasons why I don't like him. I've done it way to many times in the past 3 years or so and it just seems unnecessary for me to keep saying why I don't like him. Also, the Xander fangirls are a little weird around these parts, so I find it best to just keep my mouth shut!

Anyway. I dislike Xander because I don't like him. Haha. Pretty simple. Yeah he's not an evil dude or anything. I just personally dislike his personality. Every time I've had this discussion in the past it has basically come down to the fact that different people like different qualities in people. I don't like certain aspects of his personality that other people think are okay. Whatever. There's no point in me sitting here and trying to convince someone that their basic morals are incorrect.

Oh, and one more thing... I don't think he ever once made me laugh. Seriously. Considering he was supposed to be comic relief I really thought he was entirely unfunny. So that's definitely another reason he annoys me. I just know that in real life he would annoy me with his lame jokes.
 
caitaintdead said:
Oh, and one more thing... I don't think he ever once made me laugh. Seriously. Considering he was supposed to be comic relief I really thought he was entirely unfunny. So that's definitely another reason he annoys me. I just know that in real life he would annoy me with his lame jokes.
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I think they tried to make him TOO funny and simply resulted in making the character a big joke.. he did make me laugh, but it was the subtle things when the writers were not playing for the joke of it. No, I was not overly fond of the character either. Would not say I hated him but, he was for the most part a waste.

---------- Post added at 08:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:11 AM ----------

caitaintdead said:
I just know that in real life he would annoy me with his lame jokes.
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In real life he would have got beaten up ALOT in High School...
 
Scobro said:
I think they tried to make him TOO funny and simply resulted in making the character a big joke.. he did make me laugh, but it was the subtle things when the writers were not playing for the joke of it. No, I was not overly fond of the character either. Would not say I hated him but, he was for the most part a waste.
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I agree a lot with that. I think he shares a lot of character essentials with Ron Weasly from the Harry Potter series, who is one of my favourite characters of all times, and to me that proves that Joss could have done a lot more with Xander than what we got to see in the series. I often find myself preferring fanfic Xander over canon Xander...
 
Skanky Vamp
Skanky Vamp
But I think that is the problem with ALOT of the characters on both Buffy and Angel.
I love fanfic Xander! Especially when he's slashed! I feel the same way. It could have been an interesting character but I just didn't feel like much was done with it. He'd be nothing for 2 years and then it felt like Joss would go 'oh no, have to remind the fans that he's here for a reason'. Pow - "he can give Buffy mouth to mouth. That's cool." Boom - "Lets have him save the world by smiling and not doing anything in The Zeppo. Awesome!" Bingo - "Xander can tell Willow that he loves her! Excellent stuff Joss!"

I would have preferred a more rounded out character from Xander for sure. Someone a little bit more realistic of the type of person people spend time with. (I'm just speaking for myself and my circle of friends/acquaintances of course)
 
Isn't it telling that many people list The Pack as one of their favorite Xander episodes? An episode when he is being decidedly 'un-xander'
 
T
thevikingsgirl
That's my favorite Xander episode.
Scobro said:
In real life he would have got beaten up ALOT in High School...
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Well, I told a big bunch of lame jokes too.

But I was acing every exam (mostly)... EXCEPT MATHS. So, oh well. I was actually trying to RUN AWAY from people who were chasing me... so they could hear me spin a outrageously colorful story. Which usually involves LGBT, BDSM, etc.

Oh well. I guess he has this kinda "dad" sense of humor. But try beating THIS.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-lIDYQrrY0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-lIDYQrrY0[/ame]

And that's supposed to be New Zealand's Prime Minister.
 
Skanky Vamp
Skanky Vamp
So you admit if you were not as FAST you would have too! hahaha
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prophecygrrl
LOL that video!! :D
Scobro said:
Isn't it telling that many people list The Pack as one of their favorite Xander episodes? An episode when he is being decidedly 'un-xander'
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I don't mind The Pack, but I love The Replacement. I think uber-goofy useless Xander is kinda charmingly funny and the suave Xander is, while still not entirely likeable, kinda more likeable than normal Xander. I guess it was nice to see him act like a grown up!
 
No, the Replacement was a turning point where he (Brendon) started to get actual storylines.
 
I don't hate Xander, but I hate how he can be pretty hypocritical at times. That's my only real beef with him.

EDIT: And when he broke Cordy's heart. I felt so sad for her at that moment. 🙁
 
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prophecygrrl
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Sommers Summers said:
Cordy deserved it at that time - she was a snob.
Besides, the rich get over these things faster than the rest of us, by spending money to for self-gratification.
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Seriously? Granted, I don't like rich snobs (I grew up around some), but that scene made me really sympathize with Cordy. She was hurt by what Xander did and money wasn't going to make her get over it that quickly.
 
StarSlayer said:
Seriously? Granted, I don't like rich snobs (I grew up around some), but that scene made me really sympathize with Cordy. She was hurt by what Xander did and money wasn't going to make her get over it that quickly.
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It would have been the other way around if Cordy had her way - the Cordettes would have told her that sooner or later.

In that case, it would truly be crushing, potentially fatal for Xander, given his background.
 
Sommers Summers said:
Cordy deserved it at that time - she was a snob.
Besides, the rich get over these things faster than the rest of us, by spending money to for self-gratification.
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She didn't deserve to be cheated on, snobbery and wealth doesn't come into it.

Anyway, I've both liked and disliked Xander at times, and the reason why I disliked him at times can be summed up with one word: selfishness.
 
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prophecygrrl
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The "Kick his ass" line wasn't born out of concern for Buffy; he wanted Angel gone good and proper because he still viewed him as a threat to his quest to win Buffy's heart.
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Says who? This only makes sense if Xander is really dumb. He couldn't have foreseen that Buffy would basically ignore his words in the aftermath of Becoming - Buffy might have easily started to hate Xander because of his lie. Also, in early S4 when neither Buffy nor Xander have significant others he doesn't make a move and in early S3 he is torn between Willow and Cordelia despite not knowing about Angel's return which to me indicates that his "quest to win Buffy's heart" was over.
 
M
mayfever
well a) I think Xander *is* really dumb and b) if Buffy had known about this lie she *would* have hated him.
On the whole, I find Xander quite likable, even admirable and heroic and all the rest of it at times. But then there are some things that just make me want to smack him.

I'm a Mormon, so his uncalled for and uninformed Mormon joke in "Ted" seriously rankled. Fortunately, it was the only time that ever happened on either show.

Not telling Buffy that Willow was trying to restore Angel's soul was despicable. And the fact that he got away with it and still felt like he had the right to take the moral high ground with Buffy when it came to Angel later on just makes me angry.

Cheating on Cordelia with Willow for weeks (or maybe months), then blaming Cordelia for catching him at it. Seriously? At least he sort of made up for that one when he bought her the prom dress she wanted without telling her.

Despite his hatred for and distrust of Angel, he has a relationship with Anya, who not only had a soul when she was a vengeance demon, but felt no remorse for the havoc she wreaked until "Selfless", which was months after they had broken up. Way to not be a hypocrite, Xand.

Summoning Sweet in OMWF. And not telling anyone about it until the very last minute, when Dawn was about to be spirited away to be Sweet's hell queen. He didn't admit it once it became clear that living in a musical had some serious downsides, like, for instance, people dancing until they burst into flames and died. And his confession at the end was played for laughs. He didn't feel guilty, he felt sheepish. Which is horrible. Surely there could still have been a way to get the full musical episode even if he confessed what he had done and what he knew about the situation early on?

Okay, now I'm having trouble understanding why I like him. :/
 
caitaintdead
caitaintdead
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mayfever
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There were only two times I really liked Xander: The Zeppo and the end of Grave. He's so irritating. Anya put it right when she said something along the line "Yes, make another joke so you can hide the fact that you're a sad scared little boy." (that's not the actual quote but it's close). And let's not forget the obnoxious judgement!
 
I love Xander, but the boy has some issues and most of them stem from immaturity. He annoys me sometimes and I'm fan (for the most part). Just when you think he is starting to grow up, he runs right back into his immature ways.

Leaving Anya at the alter is the culmination of him needing to grow up. He should have been able to talk to her earlier on about all of this issues, but he didn't. She had doubts too, but she never doubted that she wanted to marry him. He even says he loves her, but isn't ready for marriage after he leaves her. That's the kind of thing you bring up before the wedding. So while they both really needed to discuss their problems before hand, Xander shouldn't have been the one to let it all bubble up and burst on him. He needed to man up and discuss his feelings.

He's also a bit judgmental and rarely looks outside himself, but I tie that back to his immaturity problem.
 
ashsummers
ashsummers
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