Willow's Sexuality

[Airam]

I loved Willow and Oz together. I loved Willow and Tara together. I HATED Willow and Kennedy together.

I am big on gay rights, my brother is gay, I have tons of gay friends.... I don't think Willow was gay... I also don't think Willow was straight... and not neccesarily bisexual either. Basically it really bugged me that they had to define her in terms of sexual orientiation at all. Why couldn't Oz and Tara just be the people that Willow happened to fall in love with and the fact they were two different sexes, oh well, whatever, it didn't need to matter. It would be perfectly fine for her to have turnerd out to be just gay, but I just feel that just didn't ring true to her character. By the writers adding those little lines like, "Hello, gay now!" where they had Willow classifying herself as gay I feel that it really demeans the wonderful and real relationship she and Oz had. If Willow is just a lesbian now that means she was a lesbian during her realationship with Oz, she just hadn't realized it or was repressing it and that cancels out her relationship with Oz and that makes me sad. Until they had her saying stuff like that I felt it made sense for her character that she had this lovely very real and true relationship with Oz and when that ended she wasn't really looking for anytnhing else and then into her life stumbled this other beautiful person and they just fit together, Tara being a woman seemed irrelevant. Its the way they got together too, we never saw Willow struggeling with the fact that Tara was a woman, she just fell in love, it was beautiful. And I think it was really well handled in New Moon Rising too, it was like Oz got it too, he didn't make a fuss about Tara being a woman... the gay thing was kinda glossed over which I thought was great, it just made it about the people and the love which is what matters. You never got the sense that Oz felt his whole relationship had been a farce all of a sudden, he was sad and heartbroken, but he got it.

Have you guys ever seen Chasing Amy? Its about this girl who you think to start is just a lesbian but then she falls for a guy and you find out her outlook is to not limit herself with the gender thing while looking for love.

Alyssa: You know, I didn't just heed what I was taught, men and women should be together, it's the natural way, that kind of thing. I'm not with you because of what family, society, life tried to instill in me from day one. The way the world is, how seldom it is that you meet that one person who just *gets* you - it's so rare. My parents didn't really have it. There were no examples set for me in the world of male-female relationships. And to cut oneself off from finding that person, to immediately halve your options by eliminating the possibility of finding that one person within your own gender, that just seemed stupid to me. So I didn't. But then you came along. You, the one least likely. I mean, you were a guy.
Holden: Still am.
Alyssa: And while I was falling for you I put a ceiling on that, because you *were* a guy. Until I remembered why I opened the door to women in the first place: to not limit the likelihood of finding that one person who'd complement me so completely. So here we are. I was thorough when I looked for you. And I feel justified lying in your arms, 'cause I got here on my own terms, and I have no question there was some place I didn't look. And for me that makes all the difference.

Thats exactly how I saw Willows choice when she went from Oz to Tara, that she was open to love, not automatically defined as gay because she started dating someone who happened to be a woman.

So I guess the point of this post is that it just bothered me when they started clearly defining her as gay and threw Kennedy immediately on her lap right after Tara, kinda like to remind us, Willow's gay now. I don't like that it seems to take away from what Willow and Oz had. And Kenneddy felt forced to me. She was SO beaneath Tara, so unlike Tara, it didn't make sense thats who Willow would chose to follow the love of her life..

I think I'm rambeling now. But I'm interested to see what everyone else thinks about this....

 

[white avenger]

If you remember in "The Killer In Me" I think, when Kennedy asked Willow when she knew that she liked women, Willow said, "It wasn't women, it was one woman: Tara." That's the way I always saw it. Two lonely people falling in love. That's why, to me, Kennedy just never belonged with Willow for more than a few episodes.

 

[hazzard]

i agree with you--i always saw willow as loving oz and then loving tara, not really paying attention to the fact that one was a male and the other a female. (of course i noticed since i myself am gay haha but...). i also liked how the show dealt with it, like you said--they just had willow choose tara the person not the "gay" lifestyle. and i don't think that kennedy will be the future for willow, but i think it was interesting to have kennedy--kennedy brought willow more into the gay scene, which made the audience realize that she hadn't really been defined as actually "gay" yet. kennedy was an interesting step and joss has said that they used her because she was so different from tara. they didn't want to hurt the memory of tara--they wanted someone completely different. and willow did say it wasn't women, it was one woman. in my head, i kind of pictured willow and oz getting back together in the future, once willow and kennedy were finished.

 

[LadyLavinia]

I loved Willow and Oz together. I loved Willow and Tara together. I HATED Willow and Kennedy together.

What do you know? We're in complete disagreement.


I could not stand Willow and Oz. Willow and Tara bored me completely - except when they were fighting. But I really enjoyed Willow and Kennedy.

 

[Airam]

Right, I did forget for a second about when Willow said, "It wasn't women, it was one woman, Tara." And thats great, cause thats how I always felt Willow saw it. So maybe Willow kinda latched on to Kennedy cause she came on so damn strong and she figured why not try it? But yeah I never saw a future in them either, I hoped there wouldn't be a future in them, they were so mismatched, and not in the good opposites attract kinda way. And i also thought it seemed right for Oz to show up sometime in the future and have them re-kindle their love... still hope this happens maybe in the comics... (I'm still behind so neither give me hope or crush it please 🙂 )

So I'm thinking that maybe this was a case of different writers writing Willow differently, cause it still doesn't seem to me that the same girl that said the thing about only one woman, Tara, would have said the, "hello, gay now," comment.

 

[Perny]

I'm so in with the "Oz and Tara love, but Kennedy naw!" thing.

I can't stand Kennedy! Either Tara should have lived, or Willow would wait some years, and then buzz back to Oz 😀
A girl can dream right?

 

[Fake Shemp]

 

[Perny]

OMG! That's soo GREAT!

No need to worry little red girl....You won't 😀 (but do act sad when you guys aren't together )

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Come on.. if they hadn't used the term gay with Willow you would have lost countless jokes. All the "Willow, you are a gay woman" "Willow, gay me up" and "Hello, gay now" and the best Willow gay joke was in the Angel episode where Harm visits Cordy.

 

[hannahfngrl26]

Come on.. if they hadn't used the term gay with Willow you would have lost countless jokes. All the "Willow, you are a gay woman" "Willow, gay me up" and "Hello, gay now" and the best Willow gay joke was in the Angel episode where Harm visits Cordy.

Agreed. I love how Williow is all I have a girlfriend. Too funny. Oh Fred.

 

[itsxpaperdoll]

I actually quite liked Kennedy. She was way more, I dunno, womanly than Tara (Don't get me wrong, I loved Willow and Tara, I just also liked Kennedy. Maybe because she was only there for a couple of episodes) But she's different than Tara, less sweet, indeed. But not that bad. And I don't think she and Willow would grow old together or anything, I don't even want to because they're both so young, but for the moment, she was nice.

 

[JCC]

I'd like to address something in the previous post that is consistently annoying amongst everyone I ever encounter:

What is 'womanly'? I mean, how can you define what it is to be a woman, beyond XX?

 

[eponinethen]

Personally I don't believe that you are gay or straight or bi or anything for else for that matter. I think you can identify as such though. I see myself as a lesbian, not because I think I was born to only like women, but because I've grown to only like [what we in this society call] women. My point is, it doesn't matter what I or we think about Willow's sexuality. She decided that she's gay now, therefor she is. Maybe some day she'll be bi, or straight, or decide not to define her sexuality at all.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I actually quite liked Kennedy. She was way more, I dunno,

BUTCH

than Tara

that I can agree with

 

[Joyce Summers]

Airam, you have pretty much covered the thoughts I've always had on Willow's sexuality. I never saw her as gay, if anything I saw her s a straight woman who happened to fall for another woman. To be honest, I always had a inkling that if the Kennedy of the season had been a guy and not a girl I would have, weirdly enough, been more okay with the relationship as it would have preserved the specialness of the Tara and Willow 'ship, and also reinforced the fact that Willow isn't restricted to gay or straight; she loves/likes who she loves/likes.

I mean "New Moon Rising" seemed to show this concept more than anything. I mean if Willow was in fact "Gay now!" there would have been no struggle for her. It would have been 'sorry, Oz, but for amny kinky reasons we can only be friends. Buh-bye'. Or something to that effect. But it wasn't. She was torn in two trying to decide which one she loved more- and I don't think she would have ever been able to choose as she loved them both equally. The wolf in Oz was what prompted her to make a choice I think.

 

[elmo]

Oh ho ho! I dunno where to begin with this. I really liked Willow and Oz... it's true that they were in love and they had a very special relationship and I don't think Willow identifying herself as gay has ever taken away from that. Ever! In my mind it is still possible that Oz will come back and they will get back together (if their personalities still click and all because people change). Like epo said, if Willow says she's gay then she is. There are no 2 way about it, I loved Tillow. Loved! And I hated that Tara died but the fact that she did opened Willow's character so much and I can't help but think it was a stroke of genius. Now, getting to Kennedy (and I think I've said this before), I liked her. I thought her and Willow were a good idea. It wasn't about her finally really coming out... not at all. It was about her being able to move on after all that had happened. It doesn't mean that Kennedy is the one for her and I never thought for one minute that she was. It just means that Willow was able to come out of her shell and realise that life goes on and she was still worth loving when she thought she was worthless. I thought Kennedy was a good choice because she was someone who identified as gay and that was something new for Willow to discover and play around with. I don't think it negates her feelings about her sexuality it just allows her to explore and feel more comfortable in herself.

 

[hazzard]

i completely agree with elmo about kennedy. kennedy was a great character for willow's development. it doesn't mean she negates or even compares to what willow had with oz and tara--it just lets willow move on to a new stage. kennedy was so completely different from anyone she had had before.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I loved Willow and Oz together. I loved Willow and Tara together. I HATED Willow and Kennedy together.

I am big on gay rights, my brother is gay, I have tons of gay friends.... I don't think Willow was gay... I also don't think Willow was straight... and not neccesarily bisexual either. Basically it really bugged me that they had to define her in terms of sexual orientiation at all. Why couldn't Oz and Tara just be the people that Willow happened to fall in love with and the fact they were two different sexes, oh well, whatever, it didn't need to matter. It would be perfectly fine for her to have turnerd out to be just gay, but I just feel that just didn't ring true to her character. By the writers adding those little lines like, "Hello, gay now!" where they had Willow classifying herself as gay I feel that it really demeans the wonderful and real relationship she and Oz had. If Willow is just a lesbian now that means she was a lesbian during her realationship with Oz, she just hadn't realized it or was repressing it and that cancels out her relationship with Oz and that makes me sad. Until they had her saying stuff like that I felt it made sense for her character that she had this lovely very real and true relationship with Oz and when that ended she wasn't really looking for anytnhing else and then into her life stumbled this other beautiful person and they just fit together, Tara being a woman seemed irrelevant. Its the way they got together too, we never saw Willow struggeling with the fact that Tara was a woman, she just fell in love, it was beautiful. And I think it was really well handled in New Moon Rising too, it was like Oz got it too, he didn't make a fuss about Tara being a woman... the gay thing was kinda glossed over which I thought was great, it just made it about the people and the love which is what matters. You never got the sense that Oz felt his whole relationship had been a farce all of a sudden, he was sad and heartbroken, but he got it.

Have you guys ever seen Chasing Amy? Its about this girl who you think to start is just a lesbian but then she falls for a guy and you find out her outlook is to not limit herself with the gender thing while looking for love.

Thats exactly how I saw Willows choice when she went from Oz to Tara, that she was open to love, not automatically defined as gay because she started dating someone who happened to be a woman.

So I guess the point of this post is that it just bothered me when they started clearly defining her as gay and threw Kennedy immediately on her lap right after Tara, kinda like to remind us, Willow's gay now. I don't like that it seems to take away from what Willow and Oz had. And Kenneddy felt forced to me. She was SO beaneath Tara, so unlike Tara, it didn't make sense thats who Willow would chose to follow the love of her life..

I think I'm rambeling now. But I'm interested to see what everyone else thinks about this....

I completely agree with everything you said.... I think it's a wonderful idea that Willow was just open to love. I, personally, loved her with Oz the most. Just because I thought Aly's chemistry with Seth was AMAZING.... I did love Willow and Tara, though, 'cause how can you not love how cute they were? 🙂 But I hated Kennedy. I thought she was way too pushy and her character got on my nerves.

 

[luckystar]

it is possible to discover your sexuality at a later age, there are some people who get married young with their highschool sweetheart or whatever and thats pretty much all they have known and then they could just meet someone and in that very moment it could strike a feeling in them deep inside that hey how come i never felt this before, its real love, its a part of themselves they could never discover for whatever reason and i believe this is the case with willow, yes she loved oz but as she herself said she changed and like she said to xander its a good thing i realised i was gay, its a big realisation which you have to discover for yourself, when tara came into willows life it put things into perspective for her she probably always had these crushes on women and never developed it or thought anything more until this once person came along and she seen that that was what was inside her all along the true willow, tara changed it all for her and she really was her true love its the way she is and i quote buffy bot "willow fixed me, shes gay"

 

[Airam]

it is possible to discover your sexuality at a later age, there are some people who get married young with their highschool sweetheart or whatever and thats pretty much all they have known and then they could just meet someone and in that very moment it could strike a feeling in them deep inside that hey how come i never felt this before, its real love, its a part of themselves they could never discover for whatever reason and i believe this is the case with willow, yes she loved oz but as she herself said she changed and like she said to xander its a good thing i realised i was gay, its a big realisation which you have to discover for yourself, when tara came into willows life it put things into perspective for her she probably always had these crushes on women and never developed it or thought anything more until this once person came along and she seen that that was what was inside her all along the true willow, tara changed it all for her and she really was her true love its the way she is and i quote buffy bot "willow fixed me, shes gay"

Sure its possible to discover or rather realize and accept to yourself that you're gay later on in life. But the way you're arguing the case for Willow exactly illustrates my point that her waking up one day, finding Tara and deciding okay I'm gay now, she's shown me the light, completely discredits her relationship with Oz. Because to say that that is what happened with Willow is to say that her relationships with men prior to Tara were a farce wether she was aware of it at the time or not. And that whole line of thinking is what I'm not cool with because I don't feel for a second that what she had with Oz wasn't true love. Thats why I wish they hadn't used exact terms to define Willow's sexulality. I think Willow was just open to love regardless of the person's sex.