Xander Harris Has Masculinity Issues
- Thread starter sosa lola
- Start date
itssmiletime
Potential
"He's slut-shamed his romantic partners and female friends. He's been a judgmental jerk about his friends' lives. He's my favorite character on theumou show"
Thanks for sharing this article, it was a great read. As someone commented in the article, Xander goes through many changes. This article addressed Xander's abusive parents and his fears. I pretty much agree with all of it, and it was quite funny too- the kind of feminist meets pop culture humour. I enjoy seeing Xander grow.
I'm reading some of the other site's articles, and boy, are they good. Proof that the best analysts of a show are usually by fans themselves who aren't afraid to give a critical eye.
Thanks for sharing this article, it was a great read. As someone commented in the article, Xander goes through many changes. This article addressed Xander's abusive parents and his fears. I pretty much agree with all of it, and it was quite funny too- the kind of feminist meets pop culture humour. I enjoy seeing Xander grow.
I'm reading some of the other site's articles, and boy, are they good. Proof that the best analysts of a show are usually by fans themselves who aren't afraid to give a critical eye.
Robb Stark
King in the North
Xander is certainly not perfect and he drives me insane at times, but to say that he is a perpetrator of sexual assault is just not true. He was not, in any way, planning to assault Cordy or anyone else in the "Bewitched..." episode. Xander is a lot of things. Predator isn't one of them.
zobothehobo
Scooby
I'm rewatching the show with my best friend who is watching for the first time, and yesterday I had an argument on tumblr about this very point.
You can't blame Xander completely for The Pack, but it needs to be talked about or addressed... which it rarely is. There isn't a complex and ongoing fandom discussion about this event, because the fandom just accepts the story's decision to just not tlak about it again and that's that. But that's wrong. Xander wasn't 100% in control of his actions, but he wasn't 100% not in control of his actions. So it has to be discussed.
As for the article you posted, it's interesting to see all of this. It's no secret I don't really like Xander at all. I see his problematic behavior and I just... blech. But it always bothered me. Buffy is a symbolism of feminism to me, but I always felt Xander was the show's way of apologizing to a potentially hurt patriarchy and reaffirming them as right. While I am still not inclined in any way to listen to this stuff the author said and go "Ok, Xander was a misogynistic "nice guy" who wan't so nice because the patriarchy lead him to be, oh poor Xander how noble of you to have chosen these traits of masculinity" because I do think Xander should be blamed for buying into all this nonsense, just like I think every man who buys into it should be blamed.... I feel a level of understanding to and with Xander that I previously didn't. It was really hurting me during this watch.
I had told my friend that I had seen Joss say Xander was his favorite character because he wrote Xander in the image of himself... and she asked me "So Joss is really a womanizer at times? Does he, at his core, believe women are his property? That he controls them? Does he believe the women he is interested in are some how in debt to him and 'owe' him something? Does he believe as women we should all be careful not to be too strong or powerful as to not step on his masculinity? If so, he does a great job of covering it up." And this makes me feel better about all of that... while still not at peace. But I guess, I don't have to like Xander to try and understand him better, do I?
iShower4free
Scooby
About the episode "The Pack" I feel that while under the spell or what ever it was thigns were 100% out of their control. If they could control things at all I think it would have stopped them from becoming cannibals at least lol.
zobothehobo
Scooby
this works in theory, except Xander did control himself enough to attempt to (and succeed) fool Willow when locked in the library.
iShower4free
Scooby
Z
zobothehobo
I literally just rewatched it yesterday haha don't worry, I wouldn't have known that had I not JUST watched it
I have to disagree here. He performs a spell to make her love him. The spell doesn't work as he planned but what see is that it removes the ability to consent from those affected. For all intents and purposes Xander attempted to roofie Cordelia.
Z
zobothehobo
[No message]
Robb Stark
King in the North
From the episode:
I don't think he's planning to doing anything sexual with her. Yes, it's a dick move no matter how he plays it, but he makes it pretty clear throughout the episode that he's planning to break up with her to make her feel his pain. Wrong thing to do? Absolutely. Sexual predator/date rapist? No.
zobothehobo
Scooby
He still does something with her that is not consensual. He made her sexually and romantically attracted to him raping her mind. That was not her. It wasn't any of those women. That was a form of rape. He did something not consensual to make her in a relationship with him.
Robb Stark
King in the North
Ugh, there's no such thing as "raping her mind". "Mind-rape" is not a thing. If everytime someone gets their mind altered in BTVS/Angel gets classified as mind-rape (not saying you're doing that, but that that term gets thrown around all the time) then half the cast are rapists. I mean, Buffy essentially steals people's thoughts in "Earshot", they make it very clear they're not okay with her reading their minds. Is that mind-rape? Willow erases Tara's memory in a very creepy scene which leaves the possibility open that she's done it multiple times, and then actually has sex her with her. Is that rape? Amy alters her teacher's mind to make her think her homework is exemplary. Is she raping her teacher? Come on.
Rape requires sex. Warren wiping his ex-girlfriend's memory and then forcing her to give him a blowjob? THAT is rape. "Mind-rape" is not a thing.
zobothehobo
Scooby
OH my god, please. Right... Xander did something to the women of Sunnydale that made them do something sexual they didn't consent to, yes it reminiscent of rape. It is related to rape. It is not straight rape, but it is reminiscent to it.
Buffy didn't 'steal' people's thoughts in Earshot... But those powers weren't without their moral badness. Willow erasing Tara's mind was really awful. I mean no... can we just say that messing with other people's minds is not good? Like it is morally bad.
Robb Stark
King in the North
While I do see your point, Xander goes out of his way not to make it sexual. He had no intention of the spell taking over every female in Sunnydale, and when he realizes that, he isolates himself (or at least, tries to). Hell, he's incredibly attracted to Buffy and she's all over him. If he has the intention of rape, why doesn't he just let her proceed?
I think Giles was bang on when he discovered what was happening. Xander was incredibly foolish. He was beyond stupid. But he's not some sort of sexual deviant/predator. He screwed up, royally, but I don't think you can equate that to rape when there's obviously no intent and there's no sex.
zobothehobo
Scooby
I didn't say there was an intent to rape, nor did I say there was sex. I said Xander's actions were a form of non consensual relationship. Because they were.
Buffyverse Fan
* The 28th *
The rape issue aside, I disagree with just about everything from that paragraph.
On that note, both Joss & Nick have called BS on the rumor that Xander was under consideration to be gay. Joss said it was always going to be Willow, and Xander's general personality outline was himself--Joss is heterosexual.
Further deconstructing that borderline sexist claim, it's not that Xander cannot befriend men. One of his best friends was Jessie, who was killed by the Master. He was extremely close with Oz who left Sunnydale, and also had a close friendship with Riley until he was deployed.
I'm sorry, but all of that represents a weak, and arguably sexist argument. The problem it has, is in those situations Xander's reactions are quite normal.
In our modern society, is it really considered feminine for a man to be friends with women? Buffy is essentially a soldier who leads him into battle on a nightly basis. By that logic, would a marine be feminine if his commanding officer was a woman, whom he befriended and followed into battle?
On that note, both Joss & Nick have called BS on the rumor that Xander was under consideration to be gay. Joss said it was always going to be Willow, and Xander's general personality outline was himself--Joss is heterosexual.
Further deconstructing that borderline sexist claim, it's not that Xander cannot befriend men. One of his best friends was Jessie, who was killed by the Master. He was extremely close with Oz who left Sunnydale, and also had a close friendship with Riley until he was deployed.
That would be an invaluable observation... Except those particular women were both beautiful by most standards, and often physically stronger than him. In context, he's reacting the way 99% of other men would to the women in question.
He's sarcastic, and jokes about pretty much everything, both appropriate and not. And why wouldn't he want intimacy in intimate moments with pretty women whom he cares for? He's not a sociopath.
What patriarchy? Giles? All of them saw Giles as a paternal figure in some form, even Anya who's dramatically older than him.
I'm sorry, but all of that represents a weak, and arguably sexist argument. The problem it has, is in those situations Xander's reactions are quite normal.
Mr Trick
Scooby
It always seems to be forgotten when people knock Xander that for a good potion of the show that he was a teenager/young adult still finding his way in the world. Of course he had masculinity issues, just about every young male does at some point. Much of his joking about sex in high school are just that jokes, and if they are at anyone's expense its his own.