"You're the one who sees, aren't you..."

[Ripper666]

"You're the one who sees, aren't you..."
Caleb sais this sentence to Xander before he took one of his eyes. I saw that there aren't any new threads last time so here is something which you can discuss about! What do you think he meant with this statemant?

 

[BuffyElevated]

Xander's theme for the season was that he was always the one standing off to the side, watching the action from afar. He tells Dawn in "Potential" that he knows what it's like to not be special or "Chosen", and I think that his theme for the season was that he felt sort of like an outsider by that point. Like he said to Dawn, he had stood by for years watching his friends gets stronger and stronger, and he continued to stay the same.
As far as Caleb gouging his eye out... His speech to Dawn foreshadows this event, and it is always heartbreaking for me, during rewatches of the season, to watch. Even though Xander wasn't doing much as a fighter by the time Season 7 came around, Caleb struck Buffy emotionally with his attack on Xander. At that point, hitting Buffy emotionally was another huge blow to her self-esteem. She was already fragile physically, and to attack Xander the way he did was pretty much a way of him telling her "You can't stop me from killing all of you if I want to." He was trying to psych her out.

 

[dexeded]

I personally thought that was out of place, because I never saw Xander as the seeing person. I always felt that that role was more of Spike's or Giles' thing. That said, he does fit the bill in S7 more than the other seasons. (I loved his scene with Dawn in Potential.)

 

[Ripper666]

I personally thought that was out of place, because I never saw Xander as the seeing person.

Really? And what about his speech to the potential slayers in the view about Buffy? Didn't he see how strong Buffy really is? Didn't he see that the hole house is going to go crazzy if he doesn't do anything? Didn't he see how Dawn is breaking after she knew that she isn't one of the potential slayers? Didn't he help Buffy with Riley, didn't he see that the relationship will brake if neither Buffy nor Riley will do anything? And who was it who rescued Willow from the edge? Who believed in Anya all the time even if Buffy allready decided to kill her? And if I remember right he was the only one who saw how poor Cordelia really is after her father went to prison. But he never told anyone, instead he helped her by buying her this expensive dress! So is this really out of place??

 

[sosa lola]

I personally thought that was out of place, because I never saw Xander as the seeing person. I always felt that that role was more of Spike's or Giles' thing. That said, he does fit the bill in S7 more than the other seasons. (I loved his scene with Dawn in Potential.)

I've always thought it was something he gained over the years and not something he was born with. I can see Spike being someone who saw into the Scoobies' fears and desires because he was an outsider looking in, but I never really thought of Giles like that. Giles only saw what he cared to see, there was a lot of things he failed to see on the show.

 

[dexeded]

Really? And whats about his speech to the potential slayers in the view about Buffy? Didn't he saw how strong Buffy really is? Didn't he saw that the hole house is going to go crazzy if he doesn't do anything? Didn't he saw how Dawn is breaking after she knew that she isn't one of the potential slayers? Didn't he helped Buffy with Riley, didn't he saw that the relationship will brake if neither Buffy nor Riley will do anything? And who was it who rescued Willow from the edge? Who believed in Anja all the time even if Buffy allready decided to kill her? And if I remeber me right he was the only one who saw how poor Cordelia really is after her father went to prison. But he never told anyone, insead he helped her by buying her this expensive dress! So is this really out of place??

Yes to all your examples, and I love him in those. But there are so many other instances where he's blindly prejudiced, i.e. Spike, Angel. He also kicks Buffy out of the house in Empty Places. In earlier seasons, he's extremely mean to Willow, considering her feelings for him, and if he's the one who sees, then wouldn't he have known? He has his moments, the ones you've stated, but I believe that to be the one who sees, he has to be much more consistent and perceptive than what was shown.

---------- Post added at 10:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:22 PM ----------

I've always thought it was something he gained over the years and not something he was born with. I can see Spike being someone who saw into the Scoobies' fears and desires because he was an outsider looking in, but I never really thought of Giles like that. Giles only saw what he cared to see, there was a lot of things he failed to see on the show.

This I can partially agree with. As I said, it did seem more fitting to Xander in S7, or even just the later seasons when he gets a stable job and stuff. Not sure about Giles seeing what he only chooses to see, though... But I think they should have cemented Xander's perceptiveness more than just a few (though shining) moments in the series.

 

[Ripper666]

He also kicks Buffy out of the house in Empty Places. ... but I believe that to be the one who sees, he has to be much more consistent and perceptive than what was shown.

I see most of your arguments but just two things: Firstly yes he kicked Buffy out in Empty Places, this was wrong and not excuseable for me, but I give him the little excuse that he has lost his eye and was pretty shocked and didn't want to fight again so far! In my eyes that is the reason for his oppinion change, remember before he lost his eye, he stood absolutly behind Buffy and the things she did! And secondly if not Xander is the one who sees, who is it then, if there is a person who sees everything in your eyes?

 

[Cast No Shadow]

I see most of your arguments but just two things: Firstly yes he kicked Buffy out in Empty Places, this was wrong and not excuseable for me, but I give him the little excuse that he has lost his eye and was pretty shocked and didn't want to fight again so far! In my eyes that is the reason for his oppinion change, remember before he lost his eye, he stood absolutly behind Buffy and the things she did! And secondly if not Xander is the one who sees, who is it then, if there is a person who sees everything in your eyes?

In "Empty Places" I don't think it was because he was "shocked" about losing his eye, I think it was because he couldn't believe Buffy wanted to go back into battle, and he believed it a reckless thing to do, considering the amount of loss they had just suffered.

 

[dexeded]

I see most of your arguments but just two things: Firstly yes he kicked Buffy out in Empty Places, this was wrong and not excuseable for me, but I give him the little excuse that he has lost his eye and was pretty shocked and didn't want to fight again so far! In my eyes that is the reason for his oppinion change, remember before he lost his eye, he stood absolutly behind Buffy and the things she did! And secondly if not Xander is the one who sees, who is it then, if there is a person who sees everything in your eyes?

Mm, I don't think there's a character that sees everything, but I think Giles is the most perceptive of the Scooby Gang. Tara too, even though she didn't have a very big role.

 

[Ripper666]

but I think Giles is the most perceptive of the Scooby Gang. Tara too,

I agree with Tara, because I think she saw more than the others thought that she knew! Let's have this Spike example in the kitchen! But I disagree(again 😀) with Giles. Giles is an impressing character but I don't think he saw more than Xander. At least because he wasn't there in the season 6. He missed so much... Even if he saw some problems, he ignored them or hide himself befor them! For example he left Buffy when she needed him or he never helped Dawn in a way he should do as a watcher, as an adult!

 

[Ripper666]

Out of the Thread "Allegations..."/Everybody critizises Buffy for her plans in the end of season 7. (https://www.buffy-boards.com/showthread.php?t=57306)

I don't understand everyone's criticisms at all...

I can't watch this episode without getting really, REALLY angry at what happened.

I think it was because he couldn't believe Buffy wanted to go back into battle, and he believed it a reckless thing to do, considering the amount of loss they had just suffered.

So the ones who accuse the other members of the Scoobie Gang for critizising Buffy so hard in "Empty places" when everybody turned against Buffy, do you excuse Xander for "not beeing on Buffys side" because of his "injury". Or did he missed to see a breakdown of the group(again)? Or did he do the right thing and safed the group while showing Buffy that she overcrossed a line?

 

[zobothehobo]

Out of the Thread "Allegations..."/Everybody critizises Buffy for her plans in the end of season 7. (https://www.buffy-boards.com/showth...st don't think he can see it. (Pun intended)

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

I think that Xander is more thoughtful and attentive than fans give him credit for. By gouging out his eye, Caleb meant to cripple Xander's "gift" - his ability to "see" beneath the surface of things, or his "heart."
Like removing Willow's power, Buffy's strength, or Giles' knowledge.