Angel with Buffy: Abusive Boyfriend?

JCC said:
Holy shit.

"Hey I'm not an abusive partner, I only hit her twice!"
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LOL. Come on, you know as well as I do, that you can't treat this sort of thing the same way in the Buffyverse as you can in real life.

Buffy's abused most of her boyfriends too. Actually, all of them in fact. She's a serial domestic abuser 😉
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
True that. She beat Spike to a bloody pulp.
Angel and Spike were definitely different in their respective relationships with Buffy. Angel was more of the "I'll be here for as long as you need me," type, holding her hand and giving her comfort and support at Joyce's funeral. Spike was more of a "I've got your back, let's go kill some bad guys." (then maybe trying to lure her down to the cellar for a little private strategy session) type. But I saw only encouragement, support, and a genuine concern for their Slayer's welfare in either approach, never any abuse. Angelus, in Season 2, certainly was abusive, though I saw more respect for a worthy adversary in Spike's attitude at that same time (by their own admissions, Angelus loved the torture and suffering of his victims, while Spike was "more about the kill") but if you view the two in their respective ensouled states, I saw no abuse, either physical or mental (let's don't get into "I Will Remember You" here), coming fron either vampire.
 
Flannen
Flannen
Nice post :)
B
BillyidolwannaB
[No message]
Well yeah, I can see where this is coming from. I don't think Angel was abusive, but in a way his relationship with Buffy was unhealthy. But pretty much all of Buffy's relationships were sort of like that.
 
I never considered it an abusive relationship, but I felt it was an unfair one. To me it was a very one sided relationship, mainly with Buffy doing all the work. Angel just seemed to demand all of Buffy's attention, and even in her weaker moments of self doubt, Angel nearly always related her problems back to his own. He loved her dearly, but I never thought he showed it properly. I think him leaving was probably the first time he really showed his true love for her, a shame it hurt her so much, but she needed that freedom.
I do think they are meant to be together, just not at that time. They both needed to grow up, uh, well as much as a 200+ vampire can grow up that is. 😀
 
I can see where certain aspects of the relationship itself might be construed as abusive, simply because of the fact that it involved huge amounts of stress and trauma, and was shared by two individuals who, by all common logic, should have each been trying to kill the other and took place in an atmosphere of almost constant warfare against the forces of evil. That's all the abuse that I can find there, and I think that both people involved handled the situation pretty well.
 
I must have been missing something that every-one else saw. To me those relationships were still vampire and vampire slayer.
Did a vampire slayer ever locate a vampire, follow the vampire for as long as was required?
Did a vampire ever locate a vampire slayer, follow the vampire slayer for as long as was required. Abusive? mental cruelty?
Having a soul does not stop the killing. Not having a soul does not mean you become abusive; Clem, Whistler.
 
WishingOceans i have to say i disagree with you but i respect your different opinion...although i have hard time to understand it!
Do you really think that if Angel showed up to the 16-year-old Slayer who was trying to avoid her destiny and hated vampires...and told her he was a vampire who wanted to help,would she believe him?she would probably stake him right away...he needed time...to tell her who he is...and he wasn't stalking her for God's sake...he was trying to protect her if sth bad happened!
If you think that Buffy had nothing to do with Angel's destiny then you have to rewatch the 3 first seasons of Buffy...in "Amends" Angel wanted to give up and Buffy was there to stop him...she did and Angel lived on...Buffy helped Angel when he was back from Hell,she was trying to make him feel more comfortable back to Earth...Angel had the potential of being a hero,but it was because of Buffy that he wanted to fight evil and be a defender of good...IMO

and frankie...i do believe that Angel helped Buffy a lot...

and finally...spuffy healthier than Bangel???well really i can't elaborate on that...you already know my opinion
 
Eleftheria said:
WishingOceans i have to say i disagree with you but i respect your different opinion...although i have hard time to understand it!
Do you really think that if Angel showed up to the 16-year-old Slayer who was trying to avoid her destiny and hated vampires...and told her he was a vampire who wanted to help,would she believe him?she would probably stake him right away...he needed time...to tell her who he is...and he wasn't stalking her for God's sake...he was trying to protect her if sth bad happened!
If you think that Buffy had nothing to do with Angel's destiny then you have to rewatch the 3 first seasons of Buffy...in "Amends" Angel wanted to give up and Buffy was there to stop him...she did and Angel lived on...Buffy helped Angel when he was back from Hell,she was trying to make him feel more comfortable back to Earth...Angel had the potential of being a hero,but it was because of Buffy that he wanted to fight evil and be a defender of good...IMO

and frankie...i do believe that Angel helped Buffy a lot...

and finally...spuffy healthier than Bangel???well really i can't elaborate on that...you already know my opinion
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Good point. I actually hadn't thought of that before. 🙂

Still, though it was essentially for Buffy's own good, if Buffy didn't want anyone helping her, then I think that they should have respected her opinion, even if it was a rash decision.
 
Wishing Oceans said:
Good point. I actually hadn't thought of that before. 🙂

Still, though it was essentially for Buffy's own good, if Buffy didn't want anyone helping her, then I think that they should have respected her opinion, even if it was a rash decision.
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Buffy didn't want anyone helping her? What do you mean?

I never got the impression she didn't want help. Even though she tells Angel this at the start of season one, she clearly doesn't mean it. Angel's tips in the first few episodes and him appearing just in the nick of time helped Buffy a lot and even she couldn't deny that.
 
Wishing Oceans
Wishing Oceans
I meant that she didn't want to be the slayer, or anything to do with slaying
I so don't agree she never wanted any help. I'm just watching first season again, and the look at her face everytime she sees him. Especially in the end of the episode Angel. And then in Prophecy Girl. And how many times he saved her life? He saved her from the three, from Darla, she saved him to a lot of times.. like in What's My Line and when Faith tried to stake him. If that is abusive in your eyes I really don't know what to say.
 
Even though I completely disapprove of the Bangel relationship, I have never thought of Angel as an abusive boyfriend. Sure, some of his actions may have been seen as 'over-protective', but what would you do if the love of your life was wandering the streets alone at night with a wooden stake? I know, she is the Slayer, but still... especially when you have that much strength and experience, it's hard not to have the desire to help the helpess, as proven later on in his own show.
 
Wishing Oceans agrees: I meant that she didn't want to be the slayer, or anything to do with slaying
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Ahh, I see what you mean. But the only problem there is that they kind of couldn't actually give her respect. It was her calling, she HAD to be the Slayer. The only thing they/Angel could do was try to help her in her battle.

Or have her killed by the Watcher's Council so someone else could become the Slayer.
 
I agree with PrincessB and Willow-Tree...

You know, when you love someone,even if that someone is the Slayer and she possesses superhuman strength...she still needs protection in your eyes...because she is the most valuable thing in your life...i bet that's how Angel felt...he always tells her to watch her back...because he loves her so much and nothing can change that!Love,protectiveness,care are not abusive behaviour...it's not like he chained her down in his house and told her never to go out again or sth like that!!!LOL

and seriously abusive behaviour is relevant in Buffyverse...considering that it is a different world...where Slayers and vampires exist...Bangel was never abusive,it was the sweetest love i have known
 
I don't really particularly like Buffy and Angel together (I really didn't start to like Angel at all until his own show), but abusive? I don't think so, at least not in the ways you've suggested. Perhaps the idea of a guy that much older sleepig with a 16 year old is abusive by itself, but I don't think Angel (with his soul) ever intended to hurt Buffy and I think abusive is a term that shouldn't be thrown around lightly. If you define abusive as acting selfishly or thoughtlessly, then almost all of us would qualify.
 
Just so you guys know, I don't actually think that Angel is abusive, either. 🙂 I merely thought that some of his actions were somewhat questionable, and decided to raise the question to see what you guys think. 😀
I don't really particularly like Buffy and Angel together (I really didn't start to like Angel at all until his own show), but abusive? I don't think so, at least not in the ways you've suggested. Perhaps the idea of a guy that much older sleeping with a 16 year old is abusive by itself, but I don't think Angel (with his soul) ever intended to hurt Buffy and I think abusive is a term that shouldn't be thrown around lightly. If you define abusive as acting selfishly or thoughtlessly, then almost all of us would qualify.
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I agree, but the part of Angel never intending to hurt Buffy is debatable. Things that come to mind are IWRY and that episode where Angel told Buffy to get out of his city.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
I think this is a great and interesting topic. I'm glad you brought it up ;)
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