Bangels-- About Spike

white avenger

white avenger
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Obviously you support the other relationship, but without the Buffy issue entering into the assessment, do you actually like or dislike Spike as a character? Feel free to either elaborate or not, your choice.
 
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Nice thread idea!
I like Spike in s2 of Buffy when he is an evil badass with the sarcastic comments and his feelings for Dru. They make a great evil couple. I like his fights with Angelus. In s4 of Buffy I still like him. I do not consider him one of my favourite characters, he is not my hero, but he was a nice evil, humourous addition to the show.

In s5, he wakes up one day and decides that all of the hatred he had for Buffy had turned into lust, obession and love. I don't like him as the "slayer's puppy". I never thought it was in his character to steal her clothes or underwear, stalking her and chaining her up, threatening Dru's life to prove his love.

Being with Buffy,the fact itself, in terms of relationship, wouldn't bother me if his character was not changed. He became pathetic, IMO, and I didn't like him anymore. I start liking him again in s5 of Angel.
 
I like Spike in s2 of Buffy when he is an evil badass with the sarcastic comments and his feelings for Dru. They make a great evil couple.

(I swore to myself that I wasn't going to post any more ov my views here, but I have to say this)

The contrast in Season 2, with Spike's total, evil, ruthless character being, nevertheless tender, loving, and protective of Dru was, I thought, the perfect illustration of the ambiguity of the character and whai I always liked most about him.
 
T
thevikingsgirl
[No message]
D
dan k
[No message]
E
Eleftheria
I like the fact that the only time he seems to be tender and loving is with Dru...the rest of the time he is evil! I liked that!
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
[No message]
I enjoyed him right up until the point where he was being billed as the most misunderstood vampire in history. Once that kicks in I find him annoying and more than a little pointless. He had no purpose other than to do Buffy's bidding. Any personality he had was stripped away.
 
Adored him in season 2. He was pretty funny in season 3, well that one episode. I loved him in season 4. In season 5 he was ok. Hated him in season 6. Had no feelings or opinion about him in season 7.
 
He has never been one of my favourite characters. I preferred him in season two and four enjoying the big bad and comedy side of him.

From season five onwards I just don't care for him at all. It's not even that I hate him, I just kind of wish he wasn't there so much, lol. I had interest in his journey and found his position as a permanent character detrimental to the characters I loved.
 
K
kndizzle
PREACH.
I've always liked Spike, will always like Spike. I even like him together with Buffy (though I do find Seeing Red unforgivable and s.5 cringe-worthy most of the time)

I think Spike and Buffy are great together during s6-7, I simply don't see fat grandkids in the offing there so to speak.
 
I loved his character in the earlier seasons, season 4 is was still funny and then through season 5, I think they destroyed his character!
 
Like the Bangel and Spuffy ships so don't know if you want my view but Spike throughout the show was always one of my favourite characters. I agree with what White Avenger in that Spike offered such a range of emotions which was great to watch.

In season 4 for me Spike is the star of the show constantly making me laugh with his witty comments and just hilarious attitude in general.

I just watched the season 3 episode Lovers Walk and immediately he brings something to the show after being away for so long. His scene with Willow where at first he is a scary badass vampire and then suddenly he turns into this whimpering fool who seems completely lost is great to watch. Then you had the scenes with Buffy and Angel where he is crying on the park bench and it is just great entertainment, i don't find it pathetic at all.

That leads on to season 5 where people are always moaning about Spike becoming pathetic and just drawn to Buffy. I suppose in one sense that is true but i liked how it unfolded. Just like with Dru he became besotted with Buffy and he couldn't think about anything else. This lead to James and Sarah having numerous scenes together which for me was great because they complimented each other well.

I never got bored with Spike because i understood the character. Spike didn't change a lot throughout the show. The thing that changed was his love for Dru then transfering onto Buffy. His actions of a desperate and lonely figure in season 6 where the same characteristics seen in "Lovers Walk".
 
T
thevikingsgirl
Great points :)
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Joan the Vampire Slayer
Nice comments :)
white avenger
white avenger
[No message]
I love Spike! Easily one of my favorite characters, no doubt about it.

He's like the total package 😛 Funny, sarcastic, witty, intuitive, and a total badass to boot 😀

I can't even think of one moment (Seeing Red aside) I don't like Spike. Yeah, that includes Spuffy too. I dislike their relationship, but not them 🙂

Obviously I wish Spike had never fallen in love with Buffy, but I still loved him anyway. I never thought he lost what made him Spike, though. Some things did annoy me, like him offering to kill Drusilla, which I just think is OOC, although I can understand what the writers were trying to do at that point.

S2 is the best Spike. S3 is probably my favorite Spike, lol, just for how funny he is. I love S4 Spike too. S5, S6, and S7 he's a little less funny, but I still love him.

And he's one of the main things that makes me love Angel Seasn 5 🙂

So, yeah. I'm a huge Spike fan. He's gotta be in my, at least, top five, easily. 😀
 
Can I ask a question which sort of relates to this, white avenger?

So, it seems like it's pretty much tied with the Bangels either liking or disliking Spike, his relationship with Buffy aside. Also, quite a few of you think that falling for Buffy ruined his character. My question is; is this the sole reason you think his character was destroyed? If the writers hadn't chosen for Spike to fall for Buffy, what other direction would you have liked his character to explore? Would you have liked him to leave with Dru and never come back? Get staked by Buffy? Or, something else?

Also, it is arguable if Spike was "good" before he got his soul. Do you think he was or do you think he had to get a soul to be good? Why or why not?
 
white avenger
white avenger
Feel free to ask anything you want. Your comments and observations are always welcome
If the writers hadn't chosen for Spike to fall for Buffy, what other direction would you have liked his character to explore? Would you have liked him to leave with Dru and never come back? Get staked by Buffy? Or, something else?

It's hard to say, really. I definitely don't want him to be staked or leave forever 😛 But, I'm not good with coming up with scenarios like this, lol.

I'd probably just enjoy him continuing to help Buffy. I liked watching them fight side by side 🙂

Also, it is arguable if Spike was "good" before he got his soul. Do you think he was or do you think he had to get a soul to be good? Why or why not?

I think he was trying. And, I respect that about him. But, I don't think he would've been able to be *truly* good until he got his soul.
 
Can I ask a question which sort of relates to this, white avenger?

So, it seems like it's pretty much tied with the Bangels either liking or disliking Spike, his relationship with Buffy aside. Also, quite a few of you think that falling for Buffy ruined his character. My question is; is this the sole reason you think his character was destroyed? If the writers hadn't chosen for Spike to fall for Buffy, what other direction would you have liked his character to explore? Would you have liked him to leave with Dru and never come back? Get staked by Buffy? Or, something else?

Also, it is arguable if Spike was "good" before he got his soul. Do you think he was or do you think he had to get a soul to be good? Why or why not?

I wouldn't like him to go with Dru, or to get staked. I would like that he got that chip out, and had a hard decision to be bad again or to help scoobies, because he spend so much time with them. Or that he never got chiped, that he tried to kill Buffy from season to season but never succeeded, and I would like to get Dru back 😀 But I don't like his character after he fell in love with Buffy. He wasn't so funy anymore.
 
I'd argue that Spike falling in love with Buffy was the right decision because on reflection what else could they have done with his character?

If he didn't develop this love for Buffy then what would be his reason to stay in Sunnydale? His obsession with Buffy meant it made sense for him to stick around. If that wasn't there then surely Spike would have to leave?

If he stayed evil then there is only a certain amount of encounters with Buffy he could have had before you wondered why Buffy hadn't just staked him. In terms of being solely evil if Spike remained like that then i think the character would have eventually became stale and boring. In what other evil direction could they have taken with him?

If you look at the storylines in season 5 there was no room for him to be evil anymore. If his relationship with Buffy didn't occur then i'd assume he'd either have to work with Glory which wouldn't have worked or most likely have played second fiddle to Glory and became a worthless character who only made cameo appearances.

If Spike was to have a meaningful role in the show then he had to change. Pairing him up with Buffy made sense. It gave him a reason to stick around longtime and in doing so play a crucial role in the storylines.
 
white avenger
white avenger
I never really thought about that, but you're right. Spike had to have a reason to stay in Sunnydale, and falling in love with Buffy provided the perfect reason
I absolutely adore Spike and I'm a bangeler. But I just feel like Spike was a better, funnier character when he was evil (before he was in love with Buffy).

But I never stopped loving him as a character, not even in s7. It's interesting to get to know him better as a character.
 
Can I ask a question which sort of relates to this, white avenger?

So, it seems like it's pretty much tied with the Bangels either liking or disliking Spike, his relationship with Buffy aside. Also, quite a few of you think that falling for Buffy ruined his character. My question is; is this the sole reason you think his character was destroyed? If the writers hadn't chosen for Spike to fall for Buffy, what other direction would you have liked his character to explore? Would you have liked him to leave with Dru and never come back? Get staked by Buffy? Or, something else?

Also, it is arguable if Spike was "good" before he got his soul. Do you think he was or do you think he had to get a soul to be good? Why or why not?

I really don't mind him falling for Buffy, I just kind of wish it would have been done differently.
Like he could have fallen for her but kept his balls.
I definitely don't want to see him staked (and I would have preferred for him to not threaten to stake Dru for Buffy)
 
Can I ask a question which sort of relates to this, white avenger?

So, it seems like it's pretty much tied with the Bangels either liking or disliking Spike, his relationship with Buffy aside. Also, quite a few of you think that falling for Buffy ruined his character. My question is; is this the sole reason you think his character was destroyed? If the writers hadn't chosen for Spike to fall for Buffy, what other direction would you have liked his character to explore? Would you have liked him to leave with Dru and never come back? Get staked by Buffy? Or, something else?

What I would have liked was Spike going with Dru when she turned up during S5, gotten his chip out thanks to W&H and caused some mayhem in LA. Come season 6 I would have liked he and Dru to return and try to finish what they started in S2 and be that seasons Big Bads.

Joan said:
Also, it is arguable if Spike was "good" before he got his soul. Do you think he was or do you think he had to get a soul to be good? Why or why not?

Honestly, the only way I can even tolerate him in S6 is by believing he is evil throughout, however, that is hard to do when he is often shown to be an "enlightened" vampire for all intents and purposes so mostly I find mysel thinking that he is the cruelest S.O.B. we ever encountered in the verse. To feel for this person and to do the things he did...I just can't reconcile that with "Good Guy".
 
white avenger
white avenger
Then I take that to mean that you don't like him, right? You're always so ambiguous on the subject )))
Firstly, I agree with a lot of what you'd said. More specifically:

I'd argue that Spike falling in love with Buffy was the right decision because on reflection what else could they have done with his character?
I actually agree with you here. Basically, Spike had - for three seasons - played the villain and comic relief part. He had to change, to evolve, in order to stay interesting. So, why not have him fall in love with the lead character? So, he became the Slayer's ally. Then, the love interest. Then, the friend. It was a genius way to guarantee his involvement in the series. Having the Initiative put a chip in his head was a great plot device to jump-start his eventual desire to redeem himself. And of course I believe it was a good move for Spike to fall for Buffy. Spike had played so many roles on the show. He's the show's Chameleon. He fits everywhere, with everyone, and in every situation. He can adapt to his environment. It's just part of the characters brilliance.

Anyhow, I find it really interesting that fans dislike Spike falling for Buffy. It makes no sense to me. His love for her was so important to his personal journey and to the show's finale. Remember; it was his love for her that inspired him to improve himself, which in the end, inspired him to sacrifice himself and save the world.

If he didn't develop this love for Buffy then what would be his reason to stay in Sunnydale? His obsession with Buffy meant it made sense for him to stick around. If that wasn't there then surely Spike would have to leave?
Exactly. The reason he came in the first place was to use the healing powers of the Hellmouth to treat the ailing Drusilla and to kill the Slayer. Falling in love with Buffy made perfect sense. It could only go on so long with him being the 'bad guy.' It was a logical progression for the character. He fell in love with someone who was truly good, and as a result, was inspired to be the kind of man she deserved. It's beautiful, really. Uh-oh, I'm on a tangent again...

If he stayed evil then there is only a certain amount of encounters with Buffy he could have had before you wondered why Buffy hadn't just staked him.
Exactly. When he got his chip, she no longer thought it was right to stake him because he was defenseless. Makes perfect sense, considering Buffy's moral beliefs.

The fans who think Spike should never have been written to fall in love with Buffy are the ones who thought his character should have stayed a Big Bad, staked, or left.

In terms of being solely evil if Spike remained like that then i think the character would have eventually became stale and boring. In what other evil direction could they have taken with him?
Exactly. Pure evil is boring. Ambiguous, layered, complicated, contradictory - now that's what makes a character interesting. That's what makes Spike interesting; that he's not perfect. In fact he's quite flawed. The writers saw potential in Spike, the fans liked him, so they did what they could to keep him on the show. Simple as that. Spike explored the theme of the gay area and evil. The idea that a character who was "evil" and still commit good deeds was a new thing when he arrived
[quoteIf Spike was to have a meaningful role in the show then he had to change. Pairing him up with Buffy made sense. It gave him a reason to stick around longtime and in doing so play a crucial role in the storylines.
I completely agree. In fact, I like Spuffy best when they're allies, and fighting side by side on the side of good. They compliment each other so well.
 
Bangels--Do you like Spike?

This thread was inspired by white avenger's thread Spuffies--Do You Like Angel? which I think generated some good discussion.

So, have at it. Supporters of Bangel, do you like Spike as his own character, his relationship with Buffy aside? Why or why not?
 
I don't know which side I favor..I don't consider myself either but how can you not enjoy Spike especially when he entered in School Hard...I need answers lol
 
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