Buffy appearing in Angel

I agree that there was room for debate when it came to Buffy's feelings for Spike. When she looked at Angel you could see the love in her eyes. It was similiar to how Spike looked at her. It was almost palpable. It was clear that Buffy found it hard to define what she felt for Spike and could admit to "feeling for him" or "having feelings for him" and said "he's in my heart" but it wasn't until Chosen that she stated "I love you".

I would have found the B/A parody done by Cordelia and Wesley to be funny if it had been Willow & Xander. I didn't feel like Cordy and Wes were that big a part of Angel or Buffy's life or saw the whole picture pre-GD#2.
 
crazysoulless said:
The writers admitted they made a mistake with trying to pair Angel/Cordelia together
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Link/source?




It is really sad when you watch Angel or The Prom and hear Angel telling a fertile human Buffy he can never give her kids when the second year of his series he knocks up his barren demon ex.
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It's not like he tried to get Darla pregnant.
 
I used to have the links but got rid of them after I befriended several Cangel shippers (we bonded over our Spuffy love).

While he never intended for it to happen it doesn't change the fact that it did. He was lying to Bufy but it does bring a level of sadness and irony to the comments he said to Buffy. I doubt Buffy would be any less hurt to know that Darla got to carry Angel's child.
 
I agree that Buffy herself found it hard to determine what her feelings were for Spike. Throughout season 7 she has a chance to confirm her love for him but she's hesistant and i think that's because she's unsure what she feels.

The "I love you" speech in Chosen is slightly annoying for me aswell as even at that moment you are unsure whether she means it. That would never be the case in Bangel and i can't see how anyone would argue with that. The fact that Spike says "no you don't" and she doesn't respond suggests she doesn't love him, as if she did surely she'd confirm her love for him to make him feel better before his death? This is another thing i change my mind about on a regular basis.
 
I liked the Angel episodes with Buffy...And I felt that they wanted to bring Buffy in one episode per season to show that the connection is always there. For example in s2, we don't get to see Buffy there, but Willow brings the bad news in the end...I feel that Angel shines in his own show but the bangel story is sth that goes on forever. It will always be there, Buffy and Angel know that. I like the fact that she is mentioned. In s3 I like the part where Angel says to Cordy that all those years one person mattered.

As much as I love "you;re welcome"(it brought tears in my eyes) I would like to see the Buffy version without the spuffy vs bangel fight of course. I would like to see her, coming in, giving his the courage she once gave in Amends. The courage to go on.As for Connor, I know that Faith and Willow met him, and it seems quite strange to me that Faith didn't say anything to Buffy in s7 when she got back to Sunnydale(perhaps it was useless to the plot to mention Connor) but it doesn't matter now, since Angel wiped the memory of Connor, right?

But as it is said here, crossovers were not allowed. I missed Angel in s6 of Buffy, more than I missed Buffy in Angel's show.

And about the defining love in each ship. Bangel is love.It is, it will be , it always has been. Part of why Bangel worked was that Sarah and David could actually make that love come alive on screen. They both believed in that love. With spuffy, it is toattly different. I can see many other emotions but not love or romance.
 
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dan k
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That's a good point you raise about Sarah believing in Bangel. I think it is known that Sarah herself thought Buffy's true love was Angel. Probably the reason why Bangel was so believable on screen.
 
crazysoulless said:
While he never intended for it to happen it doesn't change the fact that it did. He was lying to Bufy but it does bring a level of sadness and irony to the comments he said to Buffy. I doubt Buffy would be any less hurt to know that Darla got to carry Angel's child.
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If Buffy had gotten hurt over a mystical pregnancy that almost no one could have foreseen she'd have become more annoying than I thought could be possible. 😱

I'm glad Buffy never 'actually' showed up after Sanctuary. The show could stand on its own with only the occasional crossover from BtVS.
 
Wishing Oceans
Wishing Oceans
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I don't see why it would make her annoying. To find out that the person you used to dream about having kids with and still love had a child with someone else is hurtful. Even if it wasn't planned and he didn't do it to hurt her (obviously) it still would sting. It hurt Angel (he nearly cried, his voice was shaky) when Spike told him about Parker and Faith told him about Riley. He was jealous as hell when he found out she was involved with Spike. He nearly cried again when Andrew tricked him into thinking she was dating The Immortal.

Oh, and I meant to say that he wasn't lying to Buffy when he said he couldn't have children.

The issue really wasn't whether AtS could be its own series without interaction with BtVS. It was the same universe. The characters were connected. Angel, Spike, Anne, Faith, Cordelia, Darla, Wesley, Oz, the Watchers Council hitmen, Harmony, Willow, Drusilla, The Master, Andrew. They all originated on BtVS. What affected the world in AtS affected the world in BtVS and vice versa.
 
So why do you think there were so few cross over episodes in both series? Don't you think it was to try and separate the two shows?
 
I agree that it was to give AtS its own identity and then because they were on different networks but I don't think the shows should have been treated as if they were not linked. They are different shows but are in the same Buffyverse. They share over a dozen characters. When I think about whether or not Buffy Summers should have been a part of the AtS storylines I think of it in terms of how her character related and had a history with and still had life parallels with Angel and the AI team. She still is the first person Angel ever loved, the reason he stopped living in alleyways covered in rat filth, the way he discovered the loop hole in the Gypsy curse, etc. It was living in Buffy's skin that started Faith's journey back to the "good side". Wesley's ties with the Watchers Council were broken because Buffy declared her independence from them. Anne is still using Buffy's middle name. The reason Spike could compete with Angel as the PTB Champion and vampire with a soul was due to his love of Buffy transforming him.
 
I loved when Buffy went over to Angel. But I loved all the crossovers, Buffy and Angel had great reactions during their crossovers because they didn't break up because they stopped loving each other, so seeing each other with other people was always fun.
 
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Eleftheria
I like when Buffy says "thank you" ironically in The Yoko Factor. It's like they are using a code when they are talking!
I wonder how Darla would react towards Buffy knowing that the Slayer killed The Master, Darla's sire. And the fact that Darla was staked by Angel for Buffy.
 
crazysoulless said:
I wonder how Darla would react towards Buffy knowing that the Slayer killed The Master, Darla's sire. And the fact that Darla was staked by Angel for Buffy.
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From the episode Judgment:

(in Lindsey's office)
Darla hums along with the music: "Hmm, the prelude."
Lindsey inhales: "In C-minor. The preludes and the nocturnes."
Darla: "So much better than the waltzes. - He had consumption."
Lindsey: "And died way too soon. A lot of that going around."
Darla breathes deeply: "Hm. He's here."
Lilah: "Chopin?"
Lindsey: "Angel. He's here in town. You can feel him."
Darla: "Always could."
Lindsey: "He hasn't been much of a help to us."
Darla: "He killed me. (Laughs) I remember now - with a soul in his heart."


So she remembered. She probably wouldn't have been too happy about what happened to The Master but I don't think a reaction was shown on-screen or anything.
 
I would say that practical behind the scenes problems like scheduling conflicts, budgetary concerns, having to sync the Buffy and Angel storylines, the whole two different network thing, etc., was the biggest reason why there weren't more crossovers.

My guess is that if Buffy had remained on the WB and the two shows had ran their course "naturally," with no behind the scenes problems, then there would have been more crossovers later on and the two shows would have ended together with a big crossover arc, or at least Buffy would have ended with a big crossover arc.

However, the sheer logistics of weaving stories between two shows would have been pretty complex since there were so many opportunities for crossovers so there was the potential for the shows to become too convoluted for newer and casual viewers while "spoiling" the fans and raise our expectations for more crossover arcs. As interesting as it would have been to have Angel help the Buffy fight Glory or the Scoobies search for Cordelia and Angel when they were missing or Jasmine to go up against the First, it would have been a pretty risky experiment and after they do it once, the fans would expect them to do it more later.
 
I agree with a lot that has been said here. I would have liked more important cross-overs. But the biggest thing for me would have been for Buffy to find out Angel had a SON! I mean, come on! Was it just too much to ask for Angel to mention it in Chosen?
 
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