I'm not sure if he was at that point or not. And the Slayer fights threats to protect people. She's not also their babysitter
Buffy coming back “wrong”
- Thread starter Joan the Vampire Slayer
- Start date
-
- Tags
- buffy
I'm not sure if he was at that point or not. And the Slayer fights threats to protect people. She's not also their babysitter
thetopher
Member of the Church Of Faith
Then that goes for Dawn too. Not actually her sister, just The Key she was charged with protecting from Glory. She should've said 'not my monkey's , not my circus' I guess.
Or, to put it another way, if the Big Bad wants to kill/use something for its evil scheme it is, in fact, Buffy's job, to protect the thing (The Key, Potentials) from said evil scheme.
If The First Evil wants all potential slayers dead then its not only the morally imperative that Buffy keeps them safe, not only is it in her best interests (given she's rather invested in the slayer line and the world continuing to exist) it is actually her job to be a babysitter.
...Also she doesn't exactly treat them like a babysitter would; hence training, crypt of death, long speeches, bringing them into battle, little stuff like that.
hoponlilmama
Scooby
- Joined
- May 8, 2023
- Messages
- 2,284
NotASlayer
𝕮𝖍𝖔𝖈𝖔𝖑𝖆𝖙𝖊 𝕻𝖗𝖎𝖓𝖈𝖊𝖘𝖘 🍫 👸🏻
hoponlilmama
Scooby
- Joined
- May 8, 2023
- Messages
- 2,284
NotASlayer
𝕮𝖍𝖔𝖈𝖔𝖑𝖆𝖙𝖊 𝕻𝖗𝖎𝖓𝖈𝖊𝖘𝖘 🍫 👸🏻
You just know you will hear him narrating about the Slayer in her natural habitat next time you watch now...
No! Nothing about what we're talking about. Buffy attitudes regarding suicides, why would I bring up the rest of the show when we're talking about a very specific thing, and the phrasing I used was very plainly
other people's headcanons for her attitude require some mystical failing. She's not been brought completely back or something like that. Mine just requires a blindspot
I've always felt that Buffy made the wrong choice in the Gift But also those monks did feel the need to force fake memories into Buffy's head as thought they didn't think the Slayer would just take care of the former Key
while it's certainly right that she take care of them, the Slayer's job is technically just to fight. I think she would have been within her rights to insist Giles find someone to deal with the non-fighting stuff
Yeah, you definitely didn't specify that and if you can't provide canonical evidence for your headcanons then it's hard to take said headcanons seriously.
Actually, there is more evidence for others' interpretation than yours (all of Buffy's previously established behaviour, which shows how OOC she is in these seasons, which lends weight to the belief that she "came back wrong"). Meanwhile your headcanon isn't a "blindspot" but an interpretation based on "evidence" that doesn't canonically exist. Therefore it's just your own whim and doesn't hold weight as an argument.
thetopher
Member of the Church Of Faith
Nope, its not just in 'The Gift'; according to your reasoning as soon as Buffy knew what Dawn was she should've had nothing more to do with her- not her job, she's not her sister just a 'something' to be kept from the baddies, which isn't in her remit. She's just a fighter.
She should've shipped her off to the Watcher's council and be done with her.
Technically just there to fight the forces of darkness and not to stop bad/evil things happening to innocent people?
...'Kay.
Do you understand that it not Buffy's character. In fact almost every season she has to save an innocent person that she cares about from a Big Bad? (S2 Giles, S3 Angel, S4 Riley, S6 Willow, S7 Spike) Why would she bother if that's 'technically' not her job?
Wow, I'm sorry but this is a damning admission. In trying to defend S7 Buffy's mindset you're saying that all previous iterations of Buffy were wrong.
Basically by saying that Buffy was 'wrong' in S5 for her choices but defending her mind-set in S7 you are arguing that she came back RIGHT, and that she wrong before.
In reality Buffy is called 'the last Guardian of the Hellmouth'. Generally speaking good people/heroes with the power to prevent bad things happening to those they care about- even in abstract- are morally required to do that, moreover they would want to do that.
That is who Buffy is.
sorry, you and i go about life differently it seems. Just because I don't think something is someone's job doesn't mean I encourage it to be ignored.
the job needed to be done so it's right Buffy did it, but with the extra unwanted responsibilities it had put on her she had more than earned the right to be upset about it. The potentials were a burden and she's sure as hell under no obligation to make them think otherwise
You know there's tons of movies and shows about people being stuck bodyguarding others when it's not their remit and the bodyguard isn't happy about it. These usually end up with some affection between the protector and protectees but then they're usually at least somewhat more pleasant and more grateful in the end than the potential Slayers
she's there to stop bad things happening to innocent people by fighting the forces of darkness. People do already acknowledge there's a limit to her calling, otherwise, they'd be insisting she do things like learn ancient languages so she wouldn't be limited by the loss of a Watcher
Last edited:
thetopher
Member of the Church Of Faith
Yeah, that's pretty obvious at this point. I genuinely don't know why you're a fan of pre-S7 Buffy; it's baffling.
What unwanted responsibility? I've already demonstrated that Buffy had been protected people for the previous 6 years of the friggin' show and now, because these people are, what, strangers/innocents, she gets to bitch and moan about them 'not doing enough'- which btw you have not demonstrated this as fact.
Buffy had not, in fact, been 'carrying' them all this far, not when she's dodging the things she should've been doing to indulge in personal errands.
Again you could apply this twisted thinking to Dawn and all her own friends; 'oh god Dawn you're such a burden! You're not even my sister, you're just The Key!'
What a fun show that would be: Buffy as written by Ayn Rand.
Well, yeah. The difference is between a strict 'do the bare minimum kill the bad thing' like S3 Faith or 'basically sacrifice all autonomy and die like a good soldier' S2 Kendra. Buffy had found that balance and now decided to change it all up and become 'Watcher/General' Buffy; wanting/demanding others to act in a way that she had never had; 'shut up and do as I say'. Jesus.
I'm not a fan. The behavior of everyone is obnoxious as a viewer. I just consider it justified
Feeding, housing, training, occasionally actively having to track them down to bring them in. She's doing a hell of a lot more than just defending them
The burdens of having a couple dozen relatively clueless ungrateful people in your 3 bedroom 2 bath house
Last edited:
Buffy coming back "wrong".
What is actually going on thru S6 is Buffy processing the trauma of resurrection and being ripped out of Heaven without help from her friends while being manipulated and abused by Spike. No one is actually helping Buffy.
So she goes through a season of Pergatory before kinda figuring out how to help herself on her own. That kind of abandonment, by everyone in her life, is probably why she reacts so ooc to the stress of S7.
So..... Buffy didn't actually come back wrong. Buffy come back. She had a huge amount of trauma to process and no one to help her. Her new life went completely off the rails and, without help, it took the entire season to start really healing.
Personally, I think Buffy's S6 arc was very badly done. Her arc ended up being boring and forgettable. Badly done and boring and forgettable pretty much applies to all of S6. And, given how 90% of S6's storylines were completely abandoned in S7, I think Whedon and Co agrees.
What is actually going on thru S6 is Buffy processing the trauma of resurrection and being ripped out of Heaven without help from her friends while being manipulated and abused by Spike. No one is actually helping Buffy.
So she goes through a season of Pergatory before kinda figuring out how to help herself on her own. That kind of abandonment, by everyone in her life, is probably why she reacts so ooc to the stress of S7.
So..... Buffy didn't actually come back wrong. Buffy come back. She had a huge amount of trauma to process and no one to help her. Her new life went completely off the rails and, without help, it took the entire season to start really healing.
Personally, I think Buffy's S6 arc was very badly done. Her arc ended up being boring and forgettable. Badly done and boring and forgettable pretty much applies to all of S6. And, given how 90% of S6's storylines were completely abandoned in S7, I think Whedon and Co agrees.
NotASlayer
Buffy had a S6 arc? I did not notice. Given how irrelevant she was as anything other than a Spike motivator. Rather like S7, only she caused less damage to others in the process.
hoponlilmama
Scooby
- Joined
- May 8, 2023
- Messages
- 2,284
Just curious - what did you expect to happen?
Shove all the potentials in a separate house and leave them to defend themselves? A bunch of human girls with no superpowers, no experience, facing an apocalypse?
Not even Giles would be on board with that. Heck, I think even Xander and Willow would've questioned it.
Kind of her job as the guardian of the Hellmouth. You know the whole, 'one girl in all the world..' bit.
Post automatically merged:
I'm reminded of the exchange between Buffy and the Monk:
Monk: She's the Key.
Buffy: You put that in my house?
Last edited:
It is very interesting to me how no one seems to realize that just because bearing the burden is the right thing to do doesn't make it an easier.
As to the comparison with Dawn, she has several advantages. There's only one of her, years of implanted memories, any training she gave was strictly optional.
Also thinking about it when Dawn was the target of the week she frequently found Buffy's behavior towards her unbearable
How does the requirement to bear the burden make it easier to do so?
As to the comparison with Dawn, she has several advantages. There's only one of her, years of implanted memories, any training she gave was strictly optional.
Also thinking about it when Dawn was the target of the week she frequently found Buffy's behavior towards her unbearable
Post automatically merged:
How does the requirement to bear the burden make it easier to do so?
@NotASlayer - Buffy did have an arc, you just need a microscope to find it!!!
Reason: Grammar & Spelling
hoponlilmama
Scooby
- Joined
- May 8, 2023
- Messages
- 2,284
Buffy's always had help over the seven years. She's never really done anything alone, otherwise, she'd be dead already.
The coven/Giles was responsible for gathering the potentials - I assume Buffy had given the OK to bring them to her home...
Post automatically merged:
And for all the Riley haters...he was the one who actually helped her find her way back to the light. Or the start of her journey back towards Buffy feeling like herself again.
The first three showed up without her knowing what the hell was going on. From there I doubt Buffy would have refused.
Just because you don’t refuse doesn't mean you like the experience
And at least once Buffy and or the Scoobies had to bring in a potential. It was the one who had stopped like right next to the town at a motel and they found her body and that the First had been impersonating her for days at the house
hoponlilmama
Scooby
- Joined
- May 8, 2023
- Messages
- 2,284
I just checked to make sure:
Buffy the Vampire Slayer season 7
The seventh season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer originally aired on UPN from September 24, 2002 to May 20, 2003, premiering earlier, but ending later, than the fourth season of Angel. It was the last Buffy season before the series continuation in comic form. As Buffy accompanies Dawn on her first...
buffy.fandom.com
Episode 8 (Sleeper) Summary: Off in England, another young girl is murdered by the cloaked figures and Giles arrives too late to help her.
Episode 10 (Bring On The Night) Summary: Giles returns to Sunnydale, bringing three slayers-in-training with him.
Buffy's always had the weight of the world on her shoulders, being the Slayer. Unfortunately, this is no different. I actually looked up the scene, and you are right, Giles turns up unexpectedly with the three potentials in tow, (thank you for correcting me there!), and explains what exactly is going on and what they're up against.
She's never technically liked what she has to do (not like she chose to be a Slayer on purpose! 😉), but it is her duty. It falls to her because, as Giles says, she's the only one with the strength to take it on.
She states The First is hurting her friends and she's going out to try and find it/fight it. And then Giles shows up, she knows she has to protect these girls. She can't abandon them. None of the Scoobies could - they know how serious the situation is. This would wipe out the Slayer line - her included.
Can't exactly leave them alone to be picked off by the Bringers.
thetopher
Member of the Church Of Faith
Wow. You're the first person who basically accused Buffy being out-of-character in every single season but the last. Amazing. She is simply in-character because she's doing/behaving how you would.
Astonishing, and you're still dodging the fact that she lectures everyone about being a burden, not just those useless young women targeted by the ultimate evil.
To be honest I think all of that is simpler than fighting off monsters.
And she has help with the terrible burden of...shopping. And having some girls sleeping on the floor in other rooms because they were chased across country by assassin-priests. Oh wow, think of Buffy and not the predicament of the people targeted for violent death who don't have those pesky burdensome superpowers.
And this has nothing to do with her attitude of 'You're all doing nothing, I'm doing everything' which is snotty and borderline delusional within the context of the last few episodes.