Question Do you Think Lindsay deserved to die?

[LondonDude]

Do you think Angel had the right to have Lindsay killed? Do you really think Lindsay deserved to die?

 

[Lyri]

No. Categorically and without question, no.

If we're going on the theory that he COULD have done something profoundly evil at some point in the future because of what he did in the past, then the same theory applies to Angel, Spike, Willow, Faith, Illyria, Andrew and Connor, and they should all be lined up and bumped off.

So, no, I don't think he deserved to be killed.

But then again, Lindsey is my favorite character, so I might be a little biased, lol.

 

[frankie]

No. Basically because of everything Lyri just said ^ except Lindsey's not my fave. He's close though.

 

[NY State of Mind]

No he didn't, but how many people deserve to die? If I was in Angels place then I would of took him out too just to protect my own neck. So I voted NO but agreed with the decision.

 

[BuffyElevated]

I understand Angel not trusting Lindsey and wanting to make sure he didn't turn on them in the big battle. But killing him? NO, he didn't deserve to die. That was not Angel's call to make, either.

 

[prophecygrrl]

I voted yes, if only because I wonder if Angel had other ulterior motives for killing Lindsey. The reasons weren't very clear, and Angel's usually the type to have a very, very good reason before taking a human life.

 

[Professor Walsh]

In my heart of hearts, I am incapable of feeling that any human deserves to be killed.

 

[GrrArghx]

No, but I fully understand why Angel did it.

 

[The Unspoken]

No. What ever happened to restraining people that pose a threat?

 

[brinkster130]

I voted yes. I always got the feeling that Lindsey only help Angel in the end because it was the convenient thing to do at the time, he was seemed to be only looking out for himself. Lindsey had multiple chances and he always seemed to pick evil, so I wouldn't be surprised if he would have turned on Angel the first chance he got.

Plus, like prophecygrrl said, I too wonder if Angel had ulterior motives and more information about Lindsey than he shared. I'm guessing it took something fairly concrete and serious to get Lorne to agree to kill someone.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

I wrote a long damn post and then it got deleted. God dammit.

To sum up;

Just re-read the transcript for the last three eps Lindsey are in.

Lindsey showed no sign of redemption until the last scene in Not Fade Away, and that wasn't enough to warrant him another chance. He was too dangerous, and that scene just showed that he liked the idea of belonging to a team, nothing else. I haven't watched it in forever though, just read the transcript, could be wrong. Doubt it though.

He was evil. He was a powerhungry bastard who had ever only shown kindness to children, Darla and that evil hand guy. He wasn't going to change.

He came back to join the Black Thorn through killing Angel, who he had no good reason to hate, or want dead. The Black Thorn are evil. They probably eat babies the lot of them.

It was creepy that Lorne killed Lindsey so easily. I couldn't tell if Lorne didn't believe he could change, or just didn't care either way. However, Angel could not be blamed for this. Lindsey had tried to kill him a few months/weeks earlier, probably figured he was willing to go through Angel's team to get to him, like he's done in the past. He knew Lindsey was the kind of guy who was addicted to power and would literary step over corpses to get to the top. Lindsey might not be the hands on kind of killer, but he has been proven to be very willing to go along with murder to get ahead.

No. What ever happened to restraining people that pose a threat?

So they would keep him looked up for the rest of his life? That seems risky.

No. Categorically and without question, no.

If we're going on the theory that he COULD have done something profoundly evil at some point in the future because of what he did in the past, then the same theory applies to Angel, Spike, Willow, Faith, Illyria, Andrew and Connor, and they should all be lined up and bumped off.

So, no, I don't think he deserved to be killed.

But then again, Lindsey is my favorite character, so I might be a little biased, lol.

That's not a good comparison. Angel, Spike, Faith, Illyria, Andrew and Connor showed signs of redemption. Hell, many of them are redeemed and shouldn't blamed for their past deeds (all except Illyria). Angel and Spike didn't have souls for most of the events. The only thing I'm really angry about with Angel is that he killed the demon slave. Faith and Andrew are home from the land of denial and are working for the good guys, no sign of that changing. Illyria should be killed, because she's too dangerous. But I bet everyone figures that she's useful now, and not a immediate threat. I disagree, but can't really blame them for not turning on her.

Lindsey, he's different. He's dangerous to everyone who's in his way for power.

 

[white avenger]

Whether or not Lindsey would eventually need killing or not, which is still questionable in my mind, especially when that final judgment is made by the man who "killed more people in Europe than the Black Plague," especially for the reason given. You don't kill someone because "sooner or later" he's going to slip back into his evil ways. If Angel felt that Lindsey couldn't be trusted, he should never have formed an alliance with him in the first place.

 

[Angelus Domini]

I kinda know what Angel is thinking and why he had to get Lindsey killed.

First off, Angel did not know that LA will be sent to a Hell Dimension or did he know that the W&H building would fall apart and then disappear. All he knew was that the Senior Partners will 'rain hell', figuratively speaking, on them for killing the Circle of the Blackthorn.

Angel promised Lindsey that he will be the new CEO of W&H after he kills the Circle of the Blackthorn. He indirectly said that to Lindsey. So what if Lindsey were to lead W&H? It would be pretty bad. If someone like Angel got somewhat corrupted by W&H, how much more Lindsey?

Angel expected that the night, Not Fade Away occurred, was going to be the night they all die. Had Lindsey survived his attack on the Sharvin clan, he would be the new LA W&H CEO. Again, Angel DID NOT KNOW any of the events that will happen in After The Fall. His vision/s was only up to killing the Blackthorn and the Senior Partners retaliating.

In his mind, he knew that Lindsey would make a bad CEO, and might even be much worse than whomever W&H can appoint as the new one, in case Lindsey wasn't chosen. That's why he needed to have him killed.

I was even surprised that he kept Eve alive. If I were Angel, I would have drank her blood. Eve isn't human after all. She's just like Marcus Hamilton, a spawn of the Senior Partners. Sure, she's not strong, but it might actually boost him or something.

 

[Taake]

In his mind, he knew that Lindsey would make a bad CEO, and might even be much worse than whomever W&H can appoint as the new one, in case Lindsey wasn't chosen. That's why he needed to have him killed.

I was even surprised that he kept Eve alive. If I were Angel, I would have drank her blood. Eve isn't human after all. She's just like Marcus Hamilton, a spawn of the Senior Partners. Sure, she's not strong, but it might actually boost him or something.

Personally I think he knew Lindsey would make a very good CEO. That he would become a powerful adversary because that's the kind of guy Lindsey was. We continously saw him strive for and grow under power. Power that he used to further the opposite side of the team (in the good vs bad fight.) Since Angel was on the side of good the opportunistic power-hungry Lindsey was a serious threat...

As for drinking Eve that would've been completely OOC for Angel to do. And it would frankly have been a rather awful thing to do, human or non-human.

 

[zobothehobo]

I never liked Lindsay. Actually I kinda hated him for being given a rather clear choice of good vs evil and choosing evil... but I still don't think he deserved to die. In the end, I think he was a guy who so desperately wanted to be "big enough" and "important enough" to get the kind of attention Angel got... and to be honest, who doesn't feel that way? I have a pretty impossible time believing any human could be so evil they should be killed. All people have kindness in their hearts somewhere. All you have to do, is find that kindness and help bring it to the surface in a constructive and productive way. Killing Lindsay was.... almost the easy way out... to me, it felt like cheating. So no, I do not believe Lindsay deserved to die. No human ever has and ever will.... even in fiction.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

I never liked Lindsay. Actually I kinda hated him for being given a rather clear choice of good vs evil and choosing evil... but I still don't think he deserved to die. In the end, I think he was a guy who so desperately wanted to be "big enough" and "important enough" to get the kind of attention Angel got... and to be honest, who doesn't feel that way? I have a pretty impossible time believing any human could be so evil they should be killed. All people have kindness in their hearts somewhere. All you have to do, is find that kindness and help bring it to the surface in a constructive and productive way. Killing Lindsay was.... almost the easy way out... to me, it felt like cheating. So no, I do not believe Lindsay deserved to die. No human ever has and ever will.... even in fiction.

Even if every human being has kindness in their heart, doesn't mean they shouldn't die. Because letting people like that live, is letting them commit crimes.

If evil people, rapists, murderers, don't get killed, that means that so many lives will be destroyed. For example, a child rapist will destroy loves of many chkldren, who might in turn grow up to become child rapists as well. It's a evil circle that needs to be stopped.

Lindsey would have gotten people killed to get to the top. By killing him, those potential-victims aren't hurt. It was a necassary death.

Kill one evil bastard who occasionally shows kindness to make the world safer. Seems like a fair exchange.

I respect the wish to not kill human beings, and imprisonment is the better option (of course, I'm unhappy with that abusers, murderers and rapists get off that easy), but in the case of Lindsey, that wasn't a option. He was too much of a threat.

 

[zobothehobo]

If evil people, rapists, murderers, don't get killed, that means that so many lives will be destroyed. For example, a child rapist will destroy loves of many chkldren, who might in turn grow up to become child rapists as well. It's a evil circle that needs to be stopped.

Capital punishment is wrong. A child rapist will destroy the lives of many children, unless he goes to jail. Killing someone is never ok. That's just that.

 

[prophecygrrl]

I am completely against capital punishment (in fact, I cheered out loud today when Illinois banned the death penalty! 😀 😀), but I don't think that's the case here? Like, I'm sure Lindsey isn't unrepentantly evil and I think in the real world no human being deserves to be killed, but on AtS the game is so, SO different from our world. It makes me wonder about the ethical choices in taking a life, when the stakes are so high that the value of individual lives is really questionable. Would killing Lindsey have saved thousands, or the world? What if killing Lindsey was in his own interest, like a mercy killing? Those possibilities, coupled with the idea that Lindsey deep down was expecting to die, make me wonder if Angel's decision was perhaps more understandable than we are led to believe.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

Capital punishment is wrong. A child rapist will destroy the lives of many children, unless he goes to jail. Killing someone is never ok. That's just that.

But what if you know someone's a child rapist, but there's no proof of it? Or at least not enough to put him away for life, just a few years?

You telling me it wouldn't be okay to spare lots of children unimaginable pain by ending a life?

Kind of the same situation for Lindsey; it was either death, or let him go free to cause damage.

 

[Taake]

But what if you know someone's a child rapist, but there's no proof of it? Or at least not enough to put him away for life, just a few years?

Kill one evil bastard who occasionally shows kindness to make the world safer. Seems like a fair exchange.

The question here becomes though - who has the right to judge that? Does Angel have the right to judge Lindsey so harshly?

Does anyone have the right to judge what another does or does not deserve?

Obviously this is a very complicated matter and I don't think that putting a label on someone such as 'child rapist' or 'murderer' helps the discussion along. Because then we're entering another precarious area of judgement - can you without the question of a doubt prove these labels to be correct? And if they are - does that automatically give you the right to condemn that person to oblivion? Wouldn't e.g. imprisonment be a better solution? Don't even people with these labels deserve the opportunity to better themselves? And if they don't - do you when you create a mistake, even if at a much smaller scale?


I don't believe Angel had the right to kill Lindsey. I don't necessarily think Lindsey deserved to die.

However I think Angel assessed the situation in a cost vs. benefit manner and since he could not guarantee his own surivival (and thereby his own abilities to ensure Lindsey's potential incarceration) he made a decision that he himself most definitely knew was in a very murky moral area.

Basically I think he knew that Lindsey didn't deserve to die. He just couldn't trust that he would be beneficial to the cause and the worldview that Angel himself was championing.