Faith, and the Fitzgerald sister theory.

[Jill_Valentine]

I noticed this recently...

Faiths fans tend to be extremely hardcore. We side with her rather than Buffy, we rant in her defence given the slightest provocation, and we wanted her to take Buffy's stupid preachy head off like the lid on a Yop bottle when she punched her outside the Bronze. But it seems to go deeper than regular old Fandom...

From various forums, mini surveys and websites etc, I've noticed that the overwhelming majority of Faith's fans are girls between 16 and 19, which isn't remarkable in itself, since that's Buffy's core fanbase. But what makes them distinct is that 95% of them seem to be girls between 16 and 19 who have a strong bond with a sister around 4 years or so older than them. In other words, just enough of an age gap to create a sense of age hierarchy, but not enough to prevent them getting along well.

So is that it? Is that why we like Faith? Do we see her as the cheated little sister? Do we identify with her because we're secretly bitter little sis's outselves?

 

[Jenny]

Hmm this is interesting. There may actually be something there.

I am an older sister, actually I'm THE older sister (there's two of us) and I am a hardcore Buffy supporter, not Faith. In my eyes, Buffy can do no wrong. And I tend to see Faith as the ungrateful slayer who turned her back on people who were trying to help her, understand her, be friends with her. To me, Faith turned her back on Buffy and the Scoobies.

Is that because as an older sister, I identify with Buffy?

Very interesting thread!!!

 

[Willow Rosenberg]

Same here..I'm the older sister (well oldest, there's only two of us) and I tend to identify more with Buffy and feel that she chooses to make just decisions (just my opinion...I can completely understand the Faith argument side 😀 )

I'm interested to see where this thread goes...glad to see someone thinking on a higher level 😀

 

[Jill_Valentine]

Ah, maybe we can use the two to further international Little/ Big Sister relations...

(BTW, part of the reason I still find the end of GD 1 disturbing is the likelyhood that Buffy is one or two years older than her Bostonian counterpart. Somehow an 18 year old stabbing a 16 year old is that little bit more grotesque.)

From Faith's point of view, Buffy is holding her back, whether she intends to or not. All Buffy has to do is not die and she's preventing Faith from being the One she was Chosen to be. Nothing Faith does will ever be good enough because Buffy will already have been there and done it. From Buffy's POV Faith's a potential usurper there to claim Buffy's place in the world, but from Faith's POV she's just trying to claim what the Universe says is hers anyway. Buffy won't just die to be polite, which is fair enough, but it leaves Faith devoid of an identity of her own to cling to, which is why she flings herself off on such an Un-Buffy course of action. It's a persona, one of the three we see her try for size in her various bids for attention. But despite their mutual resentment, there is a powerful bond between them that makes them so close for half a season. Who didn't giggle at Faith's revenge on Buffy's behalf at the Homecoming dance? Oddly similar to Dawns threats to Spike...?

How much of that applies to me (and fellow little sisters the world over) is debatable, and personal, but hey : Big Sisters- Next time your little sister does something stupid or exaggerates her own behaviour just to have a distinct identity, just bear in mind that sibling rivalry isn't a barrel of laughs for us either. And deep down it's probably your respect we're after, as a rival if not as a buddy you'd like to hang out with...

 

[Faldor]

hmm guess im in the minority just liking her for being a hot chick who gets sweaty...

 

[Jenny]

(BTW, part of the reason I still find the end of GD 1 disturbing is the likelyhood that Buffy is one or two years older than her Bostonian counterpart. Somehow an 18 year old stabbing a 16 year old is that little bit more grotesque.)

Interesting, I never really thought of the age difference between the two..but you bring up a good point.

From Faith's point of view, Buffy is holding her back, whether she intends to or not. All Buffy has to do is not die and she's preventing Faith from being the One she was Chosen to be.

So sort of a competition thing to be THE slayer. Faith will always feel like she's standing in Buffy's shadow as slayer was Buffy's title first.

From Buffy's POV Faith's a potential usurper there to claim Buffy's place in the world, but from Faith's POV she's just trying to claim what the Universe says is hers anyway.

She does mention that when we first see Faith in the picture, that Faith is honing in on her life, her friends, etc. and we see her do just that in Who Are You, living as Buffy.

Next time your little sister does something stupid or exaggerates her own behaviour just to have a distinct identity, just bear in mind that sibling rivalry isn't a barrel of laughs for us either. And deep down it's probably your respect we're after, as a rival if not as a buddy you'd like to hang out with...

Just so you know...there is hope, now that we're older, my sister and I are each other's best friends...I guess it's easy when you each have your own families and don't share the same living space anymore 😉

 

[Hero]

I side more with Faith and I'm the youngest one in my house. This is a very interesting thread!!!

 

[Jill_Valentine]

I really think that had Buffy been (properly) dead by the time Faith took on the title, things would have turned out differently for her. But that's a Lengthier Rant.

Myself and some of my friends were having a similar discussion the other day. Initially I was wondering was it some sort of odd maternal instinct that made Faith fans so protective of her. Aside from the rather weird implications, (Eliza Dushku is five years my senior) it sort of made sense. We (The viewers) are the only people who've seen all the sides of Faith, so we're more likely to spot the cracks in her careful personas. We've seen her dreams, so, like my sig says, we know for a fact that all she wants is what the scoobies take for granted. We'd like to see her get a spin off, because we want to see her do well and stand on her own two feet. But it didn't quite fit, because even when Faith was rollerblading all over the blurry line of morality, we still thought she was kinda cool, as opposed to sternly disapproving like a good parent... Which was when the Fitzgerald sisters came up.

 

[SlayerFaith89]

I noticed this recently...

Faiths fans tend to be extremely hardcore. We side with her rather than Buffy, we rant in her defence given the slightest provocation, and we wanted her to take Buffy's stupid preachy head off like the lid on a Yop bottle when she punched her outside the Bronze. But it seems to go deeper than regular old Fandom...

From various forums, mini surveys and websites etc, I've noticed that the overwhelming majority of Faith's fans are girls between 16 and 19, which isn't remarkable in itself, since that's Buffy's core fanbase. But what makes them distinct is that 95% of them seem to be girls between 16 and 19 who have a strong bond with a sister around 4 years or so older than them. In other words, just enough of an age gap to create a sense of age hierarchy, but not enough to prevent them getting along well.

So is that it? Is that why we like Faith? Do we see her as the cheated little sister? Do we identify with her because we're secretly bitter little sis's outselves?

you are right about the age thing.....most faith fans i have met are older than i am.......like well usualy from 16 to 19.......i'm 14 and i havent found many other faith fans

 

[Jill_Valentine]

I guess that would also be why I resent big sis' Buffy. I can't help feeling that she let Faith down big time by failing to protect her from the big bad world. It's arguable Buffy agrees, since she's so frenzied in her later defence of Dawn...

 

[faiths5x5]

So is that it? Is that why we like Faith? Do we see her as the cheated little sister? Do we identify with her because we're secretly bitter little sis's outselves?

hm...i fit in on the age thing, but...im the oldest sister. course then again i am just weird...but. i..see her cheated...adn..misguided...and..not always making the right decisions but...i think buffy needs to loosen up a lil. tho...im sorta like her in that respect. hm..but...good thread and ideas...hm...i like faith..cuz..overall attitude and depth and...it dun hurt she's quite attractive. :angel:

hm..i'll think some more on this.

 

[Jenny]

Well I just watched Touched again..and when Spike comes in and finds out Buffy had been booted out and Faith is now in charge...they start fighting and he says to her "you finally got what you've always wanted..." meaning she always wanted to be in Buffy's shoes. Thought it was intersting as I interpret it as her wanting to be in the 'big sis' role as opposed to the little sis.

Is this something little sisters want? Is there some kind of importance or respect they feel the big sisters get that they wish they had?

 

[Jill_Valentine]

Well I just watched Touched again..and when Spike comes in and finds out Buffy had been booted out and Faith is now in charge...they start fighting and he says to her "you finally got what you've always wanted..." meaning she always wanted to be in Buffy's shoes. Thought it was intersting as I interpret it as her wanting to be in the 'big sis' role as opposed to the little sis.

Is this something little sisters want? Is there some kind of importance or respect they feel the big sisters get that they wish they had?

Definitely. It's stupid, and irrational, but some part of me will always consider me the Silver medallist sibling. Who remembers the second guy in space? Everything I do, I imagine to be comparable to something my big sis has done before. If I dye my hair, I wonder if its because she did once. When I got a tattoo, I went out of my way to get something different to hers.

Faith has to leave Buffy, and indeed, Buffy's show, before she gets to be a person (and heroine) in her own right, instead of just a shadow of her predecessor.

 

[Jenny]

Wow I'm learning so much from this. Honestly I had no idea. Why? Because I've always thought of my sister as her own person, admired her for her own accomplishments. An equal.

Perhaps this is how Buffy felt when Faith first entered into the scene, she was jealous of her experiences (croc wrastling!!!) yet couldn't help but respect/admire her for them too.

 

[Jill_Valentine]

Wow I'm learning so much from this. Honestly I had no idea. Why? Because I've always thought of my sister as her own person, admired her for her own accomplishments. An equal.

Perhaps this is how Buffy felt when Faith first entered into the scene, she was jealous of her experiences (croc wrastling!!!) yet couldn't help but respect/admire her for them too.

It never once ocurred to you that your little sister might be trying to compete with your achievements, consciously or otherwise? Whoa. I mean, I know it's different for every family, but still. We're learning through play, folks!

 

[ChosenOne]

i prefer willow to faith and buffy
although willow and buffy together....

 

[mire]

i'm 18 and i'm the youngest sister by 13 years apart..so i guess i fit th e profile 😛
but since she appear i always liked faith better than buffy, coz i always seen faith as just a lonely girl looking for someone to love her and respect her (hence the post incident and the mayor) she always seem to want a parental figure
and i disliked Buffy a lot during s3, mainly coz she said a couple of times that she should hang more with faith (too much alone time can be bad, or something like that) but w e never actually seen her trying to be friend of her.
and a thing that bug me was why didn't any adult (Giles or Joyce) worryed about a minor (we don't know her exact age but problbaly 16) living alone in a sleezy motel?
so i guess even when she was 'evil' i still liked more Faith coz in my opinions the scoooby gang never really gae a chance to Faith to fit in it.. coz besides slaying did they evr tryed to reach her?
well it probably didn't make any sence but..just some thoughts that always confused me.

 

[Jill_Valentine]

I wonder is it coincidence that the Fray sisters have an older straight laced blonde and a traumatised younger badass?

 

[Xin Rong]

I side with faith more but i'm different, i'm currently the oldest but i was once the youngest, this sounds impossible you say well its simple really, when i was 2/3 my dad got a new girlfriend who had 2 daughters, who where like my sisters so i was youngest but then they left and im the oldest off my brother and sister, also i liked faith back when i was the youngest but i still like your theory

 

[eponinethen]

I'm the only child so I guess I don't fit anywhere in this theory, but I still like it.. It probably works on other people than me. I feel I have a lot in common with both Buffy and Faith.. I know I could react like Buffy in some situations but I still always feel Faith's the one who's "right".. Like her a lot more, maybe that's cause I can recognise things in Buffy that I don't like about myself..

Well I just watched Touched again..and when Spike comes in and finds out Buffy had been booted out and Faith is now in charge...they start fighting and he says to her "you finally got what you've always wanted..." meaning she always wanted to be in Buffy's shoes. Thought it was intersting as I interpret it as her wanting to be in the 'big sis' role as opposed to the little sis.

I always thought that's what she wanted, I mean she did.. But still, in that situation she didn't want to take Buffy's place.. She got scared perhaps. But the most important thing is that she cared too much about Buffy (a lot more than Buffy cared about Faith) to throw her out (she wasn't the one who did that..).