Feminist Germaine Greer says most rape is just ‘bad sex’

[thrasherpix]

Btw, I just read this recently...I knew rom-coms were disturbing, but this shows it's worse than I realize:

6 Romantic Movie Gestures That Can Get You Prison Time

That includes things men do to women and women do to men (and how the culture perceives it). It makes me wonder if the Buffy writer (one of the women) who tried to force sex on her boyfriend to make him get back with her saw movies or read books like that. (Btw, I know there was at least one man whose defense of rape was that the woman he raped loved 50 Shades of Grey ...you can read about it here if you're inclined, and it includes links to those who believe 50SOG fosters rape culture and those who do not, and I do think it's tied to what Greer said about "bad sex.")

As a companion piece, this is on men raped by women and how he was told he should've liked it (or been able to stop it) very similar to women in the same sitch, but he did not, showing cultural expectations didn't shape his reaction, though cultural expectations do dominate the narrative. I also put that up because like how his girlfriend acted as if he cheated on him matches up with one of the "rom-coms" described in the first link. Though while I'm at it, I'd like to point out something that I think gets overlooked by too many feminists AND MRAs:

Articles written about the plight of female rape victims in no way detract from my own experience. Those victims deserve a voice and to have awareness raised about their situation. Likewise, this article shouldn't detract from what female rape victims go through. This is not a contest.

It is, in reality, entirely possible to feel sorry for more than one group at once. Pointing out that women suffer in one way is not the same as insisting men don't. Empathy is not a zero-sum game in which we're all competing for a limited resource. As a society, progress means becoming more empathetic to everyone, and if your knee-jerk response to a victim's heartfelt testimony is, "But what about MY group's suffering?" you're doing it wrong.

For instance, in a group discussion about a book called Tampa about a female sexual predator who escapes justice, I commented, "It's a shame that men get no legal protection." The whole room fell silent, and after a moment, an incredibly smart woman whom I highly respect told me, "Yeah, but women have it worse, so don't play that card." That was crushing. To have someone you trust and admire completely invalidate your experience in a single stroke of ignorance is horrible, and it's born from the same attitude that treats female-on-male rape like a joke.

And, right about here is where waves of men's rights types are waiting to come storming in to the rescue. It's a powerful lure -- you feel betrayed by people you thought were your friends, so maybe you stay up all night mindlessly scrolling through Reddit and stumble upon one of the endless men's groups haunting that website. Suddenly, you've found a place where people are sharing their stories about being attacked by women, and no one's making fun of them. There's nothing but support as you let it all out, raging about a culture that thinks it's funny when women shove dildos into helpless, pleading men, and confessing that you can't even cry about what happened to you because it's been hammered into your head all your life that grown men aren't allowed to cry. They'll nod, they'll sympathize -- and then they'll say, "Can you believe women think they're the ones who are oppressed?"

It's the same dumb mistake, made in the other direction -- the idea that we can be sympathetic only to one group or the other. Never both. That if we want empathy, we have to take it away from someone else.

Well, I'm a male rape victim who has no problem acknowledging that men have dominated every position of power in the history of modern society -- who do you imagine is responsible for creating a culture that ridicules men who cry, get overpowered by women, or otherwise assume a role normally inhabited by women? The Department of Justice isn't run by feminists -- who do you think created the law that, until just recently, insisted that female-on-male rape was literally impossible? All of this ignorance, every single bit of it, stems from the same culture that thinks the harshest way to insult a man is to call him a woman.

But here are the facts: men are rape victims in huge numbers around the world. Studies of male political prisoners held in concentration camps by their governments find startlingly high levels of sexual assault: 21 percent in Sri Lanka, 76 percent in El Salvador, and 80 percent in Sarajevo. However, it's all but impossible to get any of them to admit it openly, because men are supposed to be sexually dominant, and being forced to submit puts you in the role of a woman. If you live in a society where the patriarchy is such a given no one even thinks to name it, being a "womanly man" is shameful. When we stop perpetuating antiquated gender roles, male victims will be taken more seriously. But let's be perfectly honest -- those gender roles were created by men.

So for me -- or anyone else -- to decide that my story is proof that men are the "real" victims of the modern world and that women/feminists are thus the enemy, is nuts. All victims are real. All victims should feel like they're able to speak up without being dismissed or ridiculed. If a movement -- regardless of what it represents -- ever feels like it's losing ground by showing empathy, then something has gone seriously ****ing awry. And if you ever feel a knee-jerk urge to dismiss the story of a victim because it doesn't fit with what you believe about the world, stop and ask yourself if maybe what you believe about the world happens to be wrong.

I underlined the comment about the subconscious belief many seem to have that one can only be sympathetic to one demographic group because I think that type of thinking (without actually thinking) is rampant all through society that screws it up for everyone (even one's own side), including many feminists and MRAs (Men's Rights Activists).

 

[Mr Trick]

[QUOTE="Fool for Buffy, post: 1343370, member: 14357"]I'm really not sure what feminism is anymore that's for sure.

Long story short she's going out of her way so far to make a point that she was disrespectful to the group she was trying to speak for.[/QUOTE]

Think this sums up the problem. A lot of modern feminism is out of date and actually stands in the way of the progress that has been made, but does little to suggest how we move forward. The sad thing is we probably need a strong feminist movement now more than ever.

I respect Greer as a personality and think she has had a important influence on feminism and how we think about gender relations. But I do think a lot of her opinions are outdated now. In this case I think her comments were taken a bit out of context. I think she was making a point about how there is still an un-balance in the act of sex and how women are still expected to give a man sex whenever he feels like it etc... But I do agree that her point got lost a bit because she was looking for a sound bite.

 

[November]

Ever been raped? Ever felt the fear? Ever heard of fight or flight? Been in every persons situation that has ever been raped and know how it feels?

Yep, I've been raped, both violently and non violently. And its NOT the worst thing that can happen in a womans life. Sick of women being taught to play the victim and hold trama for things that are not all that traumatic, and basically a fact of life.

Violent men wont change, they wont dissapear no matter how much women cry. Its time for women to become as violent as they need to be and fight back IN THE MOMENT. Strong like an amazon, not this notion that we are to be coddled because we are weak. We are targeted because we are seen as weak. I duno why we cant change that part instead of holding men to standards they cant possibly maintain (on a whole). Its a losing battle to expect sexual abuse to be wiped out with a hashtag.

Its teaching women to be victims and I am bored to death with it.

Are women most affected by rape the most privledged to not have to endure worse?

 

[Mr Trick]

I think the way forward is for the laws to be tougher on rape and for the media to play their part. The whole Chad Evans case was a disgrace. The way the victim was treated and how easily his conviction was over turned.

 

[Evil Seal]

Strong like an amazon, not this notion that we are to be coddled because we are weak. We are targeted because we are seen as weak. I duno why we cant change that part instead of holding men to standards they cant possibly maintain (on a whole)

the way forward is actually to live in a less sexist society

I think a good dose of both is what our society needs. There is definitely way too much sexism and we have to continue to fight to change the world's perception of women. Heck, my sister just realised that she unconsciously assumes men are more interesting than women when meeting them for the first time, that's f***ed up!

 

[The Bronze]

I think the way forward is for the laws to be tougher on rape and for the media to play their part. The whole Chad Evans case was a disgrace. The way the victim was treated and how easily his conviction was over turned.

Easily over turned? He spent years in prison and lost his career over what was obviously a dubious verdict. Police pushed for rape charges when the accuser was looking for a lost phone and the jury decided that she'd been too drunk to consent to sex with one man but not the other.

 

[Mr Trick]

Easily over turned? He spent years in prison and lost his career over what was obviously a dubious verdict. Police pushed for rape charges when the accuser was looking for a lost phone and the jury decided that she'd been too drunk to consent to sex with one man but not the other.

I'm talking about the victims sexual history being used in the case. That has nothing to do with it, and such things should not be used to shame someone or as part of the defence for the other side. The reason I say easily over turned, is because his conviction was only over turned because of her sexual history being introduced. There was no fresh evidence besides that and yet suddenly the court changed their mind. I don't agree it was dubious. If someone is too drunk to consent and you have sex with her anyway to me that's a form of rape. Evans comes off even worse when you consider he had his mates set up the whole thing.