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Gunn and relationships

Cordeliagirl

Oh, Buffy, we're sisters! With different hair.
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Sineya
@Mr Trick @Taake I'm another minority! I really enjoyed Fred and Gunn. It was unexpected. I thought they were going to go the Fresley route, but I'm glad they didn't at first and wished they never did later. I really disliked Fred and Wesley together. Nothing wrong with having a lot in common, I just felt that Wesley idolized her more than he actually loved her.

So for Gunn, I totally want him with Fred.
But if I can't have Frunn: I'd take Cordy and Gunn or Faith and Gunn.
I think Funn would have been more about intense sexual tension- so could get toxic quickly.
But pre-s3 Cordy and Gunn actually could have had a solid relationship. I think this relationship would have been more stable.
You mean Cunn/Ghase/Gordy/Gordelia?

But i perfer Gunn with Aura: Gaura/Aunn or Gunn with Anya-Ganya/Aunna
 

Taaroko

Gunner of the USS Buffy/Angel
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I didn't mind Fred/Gunn. They were cute together, and if I were in Fred's shoes, I totally would've fallen for Gunn because his wooing was totally swoon-worthy and Wes was too busy being extremely British to make a move. But in the end I like Fred/Wes way better. I would've loved to see Gunn/Anne, for the same reasons WhiteAvenger mentioned. (Holy crap, did WhiteAvenger and I just agree about a ship?)

While I don't really have much of an objection to Fred/Gunn in principle, I definitely think it was part of what made S3 so weak compared to S2. One thing that majorly bugged me about S3 was how the wonderful group dynamic from before devolved into two love triangles, and the friendships barely got any attention anymore. Wes and Gunn were awesome in S2, and they were both awesome with Angel, but S3 was all about Wes/Fred/Gunn and Angel/Cordy/Groo. I wonder how much more compelling it could have been if Angel, instead of being part of a love triangle, had been reduced to status of fifth wheel, if Cordy/Gunn and Wes/Fred had happened with relatively low angst. Angel's still trying to fully reintegrate into his team after the events of S2, but they're pairing off and leaving him behind, including Cordy, his oldest friend of the group, and Fred, who he had such a sweet bond with from Pylea. Most of us can probably relate to the feelings of loneliness and jealousy (and guilt over said jealousy) when our friends date people and don't have time for us anymore. I'd much rather watch that than a load of forced, unconvincing Angel/Cordy stuff.
 
BuffyBot22
BuffyBot22
Now that I could have got on board with

white avenger

white avenger
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Reading over this thread has gotten me to thinking. Post Season 5 Gunn would be a totally different character than the homeless,streetwise, dropout demon fighter we all got to know in the earlier Seasons. He's not only a quite capable lawyer, but the only ex-vampire in the Buffyverse. He might very well be dating some of the hottest starlets in Hollywood. Why would he even want, or need, a single steady girl?
 

AnthonyCordova

Earth Invasion Taskforce Unlimited
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Sineya
Yeah, Gunn and Fred lacked any spark or passion. The lack of spark was on Gunn's part too, if I had to isolate and diagnose the problem. And I agree with @Blaze that I want Fred ultimately with Wes: THEY had that spark.

He was better suited for Gwen I would say, or Anne. Both of those felt authentic, whereas his spark for Fred didn't really show.
 

thrasherpix

Scooby
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I never really thought of Gunn and Anne, but now that I do I can see that one working...and I think I actually LIKE that ship (as opposed to just accepting it). Again, this is my just now thinking about it, and as I think deeper on something my mind tends to change.
 

Meliza

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Who knows if Faith/Anne would be a domestic disaster in real life but I think the ship would take off on screen, both have hardscrabble back rounds and very different personalities. Anne is nurturing and empathetic like Faith needs (if she doesn't know it) and looks like Buffy, testosterone types are attracted to their opposite.

I buy emotionally closed off Wesley and Lilah, I don't so much buy two equally macho male and female pair like Gunn and Faith.

Cordelia is strong and independent and would play off Gunn's hard headed stubborness in a frank outspoken, hard truths, squabbling beatrice and bennedict style.
 
Thanks. We know Gunn likes sexy and confident so he pairs off with Winfred Brickle? though it didn't work out.

Cordelia is confident in her sexuality, Gunn has his "whatever my woman wants, my woman gets" Cordelia is kind of old fashioned"If you're gonna be gone for the week at least buy me diamonds" pull out my chair etc

Sometimes they would butt heads, point their fingers at each other and burst into smoochies.

Faith was always telling Buffy they weren't so different because underneath she wanted to be loved by Buffy (as a sister or otherwise)
Anne has grown into her own since "Anne" but she would still be attracted to a protector type, Faith's "All I ever wanted was something to love"
she would appreciate some one seeing in the good in her and depending on her.
 
AnthonyCordova
AnthonyCordova
good points

Spanish Flame

It's Not Easy Being Green
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I have never thought of Funn before and I like it so much not only for their name but also because it would be interesting to see those together.... and Faith having a nice guy by her side and that's Gunn , which I love.

Anne and Gunn... maybe.... but for some reason I don't see that much as my Funn :p

There are many other possibilities and in Season 5 Gunn changed so much that I agree @white avenger he might end up with some hottie from Hollywood that Lorne could introduce him since he is in the Fun department (Not "Funn" department!).:D
 

Ethan Reigns

Scooby
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Sineya
Another vote for Faith and Gunn. They are both street smart and they are on the same wavelength. Besides, their first exchange when they met was:

Gunn: I hold my own.
Faith: That's a shame.

meaning instant attraction.
 

Fool for Buffy

I'm just being a big nerd again
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Sineya
Yes, Faith and Gunn would be acceptable. They have some good limited on screen chemistry. But Faith is too good for him. He's so constant. She's always evolving and becoming more fantastic.
 

Meliza

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Yes, Faith and Gunn would be acceptable. They have some good limited on screen chemistry. But Faith is too good for him. He's so constant. She's always evolving and becoming more fantastic.
He had less of a dimensional arc then the others and the show make inside jokes about this by him self defensively referencing himself as 'the muscle" of the group or just the body guard, in retrospect I am absolutely fine with him being kind of the vanilla one of the group. In life there those types who are hobbit like, they don't take from the world nor add to it either. Gunn is just swell guy like Xander and Riley who has given so much to the people around him, as he was laying in a hospital bed broken and despairing it broke my heart, I don't want to see him end up like Wesley, he has well earned a white picket retirement. I wouldn't have minded him with Carpenters pregnancy, Cordelia and Gunn riding off into the sunset together for that retirement.Of course this is in hindsight, wish fulfilment, we didn't know how bad it could get until it did Cordy, Fred, Wesley were heroes I don't want more sacrificed for the cause, I want Gunn to be with someone he can lay down his sword with. So he is well wrong for Faith. I don't think she is finished having a twlight of the soul adventures with Angel.
 
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DeadlyDuo

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Gunn and Anne seem like they could work (at least for a little while) though really I just want to see Gun introduce Anne to Spike, especially if he didn't know that Spike nearly killed her in "Lie to Me".

Maybe Gunn and Anya?
 

Meliza

Scooby
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I would have killed to see that scene too.

Anya is dead but if she weren't I wish she became the man she wanted to marry. A CEO of a large company, wealthy, single or with a husband who works from home and takes care the kid. Maybe that could be Gunn, he deserves a white picket retirement.

Edit: For some reason I can also see Anya running a popular sex advice podcast ha ha
 
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nightshade

Your grandfather is a cat
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Black Thorn
When I think Gunn and relationships I don't think season 5 Gunn, I'm not sure who would work better with him then.
 

Sweet Dreamer

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Did Gunn need a romantic partner?

I vote for yes because how can this pure soul live without love? Why should he?
He deserves love like everybody else and even more than everybody else.
Not only he is deprived of family love - he grew up as an orphan and lost in the most heartbreaking way his sister whose was the closest person to him - but for a long time the dangerous life that he lived in the streets as a vampire hunter prevented him from forming strong (new) bonds. Even after joining full time AI, he still had to be ready at any time to kill his close ones (like his friend George) and got no one with who to share the emotional fallout that comes from those losses (he didn't talk about it with the AI team). In term of loneliness, i think he comes in 2nd position after Angel.
To sum up he is the one who is always giving all the time without getting anything in return. He's also the one who has nothing outside the mission.
He leads the fight since he is 12, that means his life has been entirely dedicated to saving the members of his homeless community and crew, and later with the AI team he's on every mission of protection to the point that it feels like all he's done was sacrifice. He has no possibility to study, to travel, to create something that will last or require him to develop new skills, nothing to compensate.
So, the idea that he could also on top of everything else been denied romantic love too is unbearable.

I think the writers were aware of this risk to push too far the character to complete despair. They allowed Gunn to complain few times about his loneliness. That's why he made the move so easily on Fred once she expressed her feelings, he was more than ready to start a new relationship. He was so impatient, he gave himself fully. His need to love and be loved was so powerful that he almost lost his soul in the process.
It was moving for me to watch him at one point dream of creating his own family with Fred, to imagine the house in which he could move in with her. It was mostly his dream, not Fred's (she wouldn't have left Angel) but i can't erase totally the hope (though the odds are slim) that he would have done it one day with his real soulmate (if such a thing exists on ATS).

Speaking of soulmate, my preference goes to Anne. Their relationship is a dream come true for me because everything flows between them so easily, so naturally like a stream.
The foundation for a great love is definitely here. They share more than a deep friendship, a mutual admiration and trust, they are also in my view the closest thing to soulmates that the show ever had because of who they are and how they become who they are.
They became their actual better selves by leaning on their skills and their moral. They chose their path. The absence of parental figures and the necessity to take care of themselves at a young age didn't make them competitive or greedy for money, instead they used their experience to help the ones who are helpless like they used to be. They created their own communities (Anne with the shelter and Gunn with the vampire hunting gang) and took the leadership to show the way.
Who they are is two everyday heroes, quiet champions without super powers, both on a mission to do good, with their motivation fueled by their desire to do the right thing. They show a similar level of dedication, firmness, responsability and patience in the defense of their cause.
They also have both big hearts.
I love the bright smiles and big hugs whenever they see each other. Did anyone else noticed in The Thin Dead Line that they couldn't kept their hands from each other back's during their 1st scene when Gunn introduced Anne to Wesley and Cordelia? They continued to hold each other for seconds, more than necessary, after their hug.
I love how they can talk so comfortably about anything and express freely their worries, from pratical stuffs like paying bills or dealing with cops to supernatural fights or ethical/philosophical problems (what if the good can never win?).
Did i say that they look incredibly good together?

I have my doubt on the fact that the writers would have made them canon, even for a short time because it's a perfect couple that could have seriously compete with Fred/Gunn and outshine them, and i'm pretty sure that the writers didn't want Gunn to love anyone else more than Fred.

On Fred and Gunn, i think that the show needed this relationship for various reasons:
  • it was the only possible interracial ship between lead characters at the time/during season 3 and as clumsy as the writers were on trying to deal with racial issues, i think they were sincerely eager to show an interracial couple. And they did a good job, Fred and Gunn's happiness, problems and break up were never about race but about them. It normalized the idea of a mixed couple.
  • The writers had no other choice than to write a romance between Fred and Gunn once they changed their mind on who should have joined Holtz and gave this dark storyline to Wesley (maybe to suit the actor who was more experienced and was in the show for longer, and was also possibly tired of being the comedy relief). There wasn't enough ideas to give everything to the same character.
  • I have the impression that the writers didn't like, didn't see the chemistry between Amy Acker and Alexis Denisof. Even after the break up between Gunn and Fred, it took them almost one complete season to make Fred and Wesley a full relationship and it lasted two episodes. There's nothing in the plot that can justify it. They had already kissed and expressed their attraction. Even if Fred was irked by Lilah, after the reset at the end of season 4, it shouldn't have mattered: Lilah was dead, they were working for their enemy, and they were more lonely in Wolfram and Hart than in another place in. There was no reason for Wesley to not make his move except for the decision of the writer to not let him.
I think it was a very positive romantic relationship for Gunn despite its flaws. Sure he loved Fred largely more than she loved him but it didn't matter because he also totally blossomed during their romance: he was happy, he opened up to his feelings, showed a willingness to share them, to express them that is spectacular for a man who has such a stoic attitude usually.
Her love (she was in love because she was severely hurt when he broke up with her and in total panic when Angel played with Gunn's soul) allowed him to consider a future for the 1st time in his life. It expanded the world for him, gave him a new purpose, something to look for everyday that was entirely centered on him and his needs (but in good way) instead of the greater good, and filled him with positive sensations.
This relationship became stable and balanced because It was a mutual effort.
I loved that their chemistry was real and natural, that they looked like the kind of couple that we could meet in real life. Young, urban, relaxed with a bright and easy going, feel good vibe. They were completely normal, doing normal things like going to cinema, eating at restaurants, having fun at amusement parks or going to the beach and yet they were dreamy because there was so much attention, care, tenderness between them, their communication was so open, they were so supportive of each other. Everything about them screamed healthy romance.
And the fact that they lasted so long (one season) is a testament to the fact that they were right for each other.

Also the passion was absolutely here: the impressive amount of food that they eat together is the best evidence that they loved each other intensely. When desire is burning, couples do that: eat and make love. And those two birds were high on both. The celebration sex in Supersymmetry after Fred got her article published was one the sexiest scene in the show and left no doubt about it.

However i don't regret their break up: they were not meant to be a life time couple considering the baggage that Fred brought with her in their relationship. She never got to treat correctly what happened to her in Pylea and it inevitably explosed when she learnt that her professor did to her. Once she realized that it created a void between her and Gunn, she turned to Wesley because she refused to consider that she was wrong and Wesley told her exactly what she wanted to hear ( it's more complex but it's too long to explain here).
Gunn was jealous and hurt (which was a normal reation) but he stayed mature most of the time. It never stopped him to work with Wesley or to protect Fred and Wesley. The most important moment for him was the official break up in Release, he decided to not hold on the past and rejected Fred's plea to go back to what they were. He was definitely the most perceptive and balanced, mature emotionally and their break up was the best opportunity for him to show it.

And to end this too long post, few words on Faith and Gwen. They are definitely hot girls with whom he has plenty of chemistry but a man with his personality and his values doesn't look for sex only, he needs a strong emotional connection that a one stand night can't give him.
Also both girls have trust issues and are deeply damaged (Faith was supposed to return in prison for murder) and it's not his mission to fix them.
 
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