I get it now

[patriot1123]

I finished my first rewatch of BtVS last night -- and I finally get the Spuffy love. I won't say I'm a full-on Spuffy (my primary interest in the show is still Giles) but I do understand why their relationship works, and it was really beautifully developed in the course of the show.

I really always loved some of Spike's moments. I loved when he refused to give up Dawn when Glory was torturing him -- all the more so because, from his standpoint, Buffy would never know about his sacrifice. It was very pure.

I think previously I was unhappy because Spike became Buffy's stalwart standing fast in seasons 6 and 7, instead of Giles. But then I realized that it would be a natural progression for Buffy to distance herself to some extent from her father figure (Giles) and rely more and more heavily on a peer (Spike).

So that's another aspect of the show, now, that makes me love it.

ETA: and as for Bangel vs. Spuffy, it's absolutely no contest - Spuffy all the way.

 

[zobothehobo]

YAY! I love it when people get it! Welcome to the Spuffy ship! You've got a foot in and you are welcome!

 

[WileyDairyGnome]

Welcome new Spuffy. 😉

 

[wickedtiger86]

Yay! More Spuffy love. I do really love the progression of their relationship and you know, I never thought about it making sense that she distanced herself from Giles and turned to a peer. Of course it totally does.

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

Spike and Buffy are incredible, aren't they? As I say, perfect lovers-fighters-partners-friends.

Giles and Buffy's relationship was one of my favorite aspects on the show - until he tried to get Spike killed. I think Buffy distancing herself from Giles was more due to this than anything. That was a really bad call on his part.

 

[Chosen Enemy]

Your post made me smile. It's great that you tried and could see the beauty in there. You now see what we see!

 

[patriot1123]

Thanks everyone! I'm really happy to have discovered yet another thing to love about the show. I'm looking forward to paying closer attention to the evolution of their relationship on my next rewatch.

As far as Giles, I hated it when he tried to have Spike killed; but on this rewatch I was at least able to understand it a little better. From his standpoint, he truly believed that Spike was a danger and they needed to get rid of him. I still hate it, though. When it comes to Giles I just usually try to pretend that seasons 6 and 7 never happened.

Here's another interesting thought: Giles always disliked Spike. Some of the most dramatic moments, and some of the funniest, are between Giles and Spike. (I love the scene when Spike bursts into Giles' flat after being shot with the tracer by the Initiative, and the scene between them.) At least one reason was (IMO) that Spike wasn't "good enough" for his "daughter." Classic father attitude.

I read in a book that Jane E said that Buffy really did love Spike, and I think that's true. She didn't always understand her feelings toward him, and it's a very complex relationship, but I think she did love him.

 

[Goby]

How the hell did Joss and the writer turn the Big Bad of Season 2 in to Buffy's love interest in Season 6/7???? Holy cow!!! And they did it so slowly, so credibly, and so perfectly. Wow!!

For me Spuffy is much "deeper" than Bangel. And for me, Spuffy sex is not the essence of Spuffy. For me its the non-sexual stuff, with "End of Days" being the ultimate love scene in the entire Buffyverse.

 

[ticonderouga]

For me the whole Spuffy ship is far more subtle, its a ship that I only really got into after rewatching a few times and seeing the seeds of it beginning in season 4 and 5. I agree with Goby about the whole Spuffy sex. Season 6 is actually delays the true ship from emerging.

 

[prophecygrrl]

Aw, yay! 😀

I've always loved the scenes with Giles and Spike. They're so funny together and I love the banter. Randy Giles, anyone? 😉

On a more serious note, I actually LIKE that Giles is disapproving of Spike. Not that he tried to have him killed, but that he's protective of Buffy and is always thinking of the future. It's very realistic to me and I wouldn't expect anything less from Giles.

 

[patriot1123]

How the hell did Joss and the writer turn the Big Bad of Season 2 in to Buffy's love interest in Season 6/7???? Holy cow!!! And they did it so slowly, so credibly, and so perfectly. Wow!!

For me Spuffy is much "deeper" than Bangel. And for me, Spuffy sex is not the essence of Spuffy. For me its the non-sexual stuff, with "End of Days" being the ultimate love scene in the entire Buffyverse.

Pure genius, from the writers AND from SMG and James.

 

[Carrrrgh]

Awwwwwwwwwweh 😀

I'm so proud!

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

patriot1123, I agree with everything you'd said, about Giles and about Buffy loving Spike. Not only did Giles dislike Spike for totally valid reasons, he also - unlike everyone else - never forgot who and what Spike was - a demon without a conscience capable of anything. Giles acted in the only way he could and in which he was trained. I don't blame him and never have. That said, what he did damaged him and Buffy's relationship greatly perhaps beyond repair. Trying to get Spike killed behind Buffy's back made it all the worse. Spike was arguably Buffy's best friend at that point and her biggest source of support. Giles was deceptive and it was an insult to Buffy and her status as The Slayer. Giles was right that Buffy's judgement was clouded because she had feelings for Spike, Giles: There's a connection. You rely on him, he relies on you. But, he should have left it to Buffy to decide what to do regarding Spike. Anyhow, I guess it's a moot point now...

Spoiler

I only hope they were able to mend their relationship before Giles was killed by Angel.

 

[patriot1123]

[MENTION=3210]Joan[/MENTION], I agree with your entire post.

But, although their relationship was damaged, they had recovered from serious conflicts in the past and I think they did this time too. Their exchange in Chosen:

"I think it's bloody brilliant. If you want my opinion."

"Really do."

And the looks they exchanged there -- lingering with the smile for an extra beat -- established conclusively (IMO) that, once again, their relationship survived a crisis. I think they were okay again at that point. (I have to, or I get too depressed.)

If their relationship is fractured again in Season 8, I don't know, because I haven't read it yet (though I've heard some things).

Going back to Spike, Buffy was always right when she went against Giles to lobby for Spike. In Spiral and Weight of the World, Spike was pivotal, since only he could see that Ben and Glory were the same person. And then he ended up saving them all in Chosen. But, interestingly, in Intervention, it was Buffy who wanted Spike killed ("Let it have a dusty ending") and Giles and Xander who decided not to.

 

[Chosen Enemy]

Personally, I love everything that is spuffy, even the bad things (besides the AR that's way over the top at the spuffy story, can't like that), including the sex scenes (which aren't bad themselves, IMO)

 

[peaches71]

This show has a ridiculous amount layers and complexity to it, not the least of which is Spuffy! I discover some new aspect, or nuance about this ship every time I watch.

Sarah and James...they have such chemistry!

 

[zobothehobo]

Personally, I love everything that is spuffy, even the bad things (besides the AR that's way over the top at the spuffy story, can't like that), including the sex scenes (which aren't bad themselves, IMO)

Same. Except... I don't hate the bathroom scene.... It's a horribly sad terrible low point for Spike and for Buffy... but I don't hate it. I have an appreciation for it basted on what it meant for the two characters' development.

 

[patriot1123]

I've mentioned before that I have about a thousand clips from BtVS on my computer. I'm about to go make my first two Spuffy clips. Both from OMWF - when he stops her dancing; and at the end. Very sweet moments.

 

[kittenpoker]

Same. Except... I don't hate the bathroom scene.... It's a horribly sad terrible low point for Spike and for Buffy... but I don't hate it. I have an appreciation for it basted on what it meant for the two characters' development.

yes, I can see that... I think the lowest point for me is when buffy is hitting spike over and over in the face and telling him that he's nothing... can't remember the exact words but it's right after warren makes her think she killed his ex girlfriend and spike wanted her to try and cover it up. I really hate that part.

 

[KellGreen]

I know this is kinda random, but i was reading a quote of Emma Watson about Daniel Radcliffe and how he has helped her grow so much by how they always debate everything; how his challenges to her have helped her to grow and be strong. It totally made me think of Spuffy. (even though i know the former 2 here are like siblings).