If Buffy Had Come Back Wrong

white avenger

white avenger

white avenger
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rome, georgia
Assume for the sake of discussion that Buffy actually HAD come back wrong at the beginning of the season. Willow's spell brought back her body, but her soul remained in Heaven. This would be something that the others wouldn't realize immediately. She's still human, still a Slayer, even, like Spike, still able to love and possessed with a rudimentary sense of honor and duty, but no conscience whatsoever, no sense of morality or compassion. Angel and Spike, for whatever reason, are the first ones to discover the truth.

So, what happens next?
 
I feel like everyone would notice pretty soon. Every one we saw on the show that doesn't possess a soul act in pretty evil ways (Angel, Spike, that kid on AtS). It wouldn't be long before they noticed something was wrong. Not sure what they would do after that though.
 
Presumable Buffy would be 'evil' then, or at least not wholey Buffy,
In that case Angel would probably try and 'put her to rest' permenantly (if and when he was told) and Spike (as he himself has admitted) wouldn't have been able to let that happen. He would've protected Buffy- she certainly would've asked him to.

Result: Angel and Spike fight over Buffy. Oh, the irony. 😉
 
Nothing. I mean, we get to see a soulless Buffy in "Nightmares". She's OK.

No, but seriously Buffy's still the slayer, soul or soulless, she still wants to hunt monsters. It's what she does. It's like breathing to her. World's not going to end any time soon. Scoobies are in no danger either 'cause she loves them but more importantly, she's smart enough to understand just how useful they are and how much she needs them. Forces of evil on the other hand are in some deep shit. No conscience, morality, compassion? Well, guess what happens to the trio? Or to the ex-rat and the dealer guy messing with her witch? Yeah, don't try to imagine that, Cannibal Corpse lyrics basically. Spike? She hates him, he gets stupid - poof, end of story. Money problems? What money problems? Buffy's swimming in cash, want, take, have baby. Angel? Tries to take her out, is slain. That's about it, I think.
 
YummySushiPJs said:
I never understood the explanation for why Spike could hit Buffy. She didn't come back wrong, but she had changed on a molecular level? What? Deep tropical tan? Talk sense, Tara.
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I think it means that, raising Buffy from the grave, putting her soul back into her rotting corpse, regenerating that corpse, the magic that was used to tie it all together, all of that changed Buffy's makeup on a genetic level, meaning that she didn't register as human to the chip anymore. It didn't change or affect her anymore severely than the equivalent of a deep suntan. Hence Tara's analogy.

As for the OP, I think it all depends on just how much a lack of soul changed Buffy. The soul has different meanings here than other shows (Supernatural springs immediately to mind) so I'm think that Buffy would have been very, very evil, on top of having super powers.

But I believe the question has already been answered in the show, by both vampires.

Angel is always willing to make the hard choices, killing Connor, killing Cordelia, killing Darla, Drusilla, whoever, he does it because he knows it's the right thing to do.

Spike knows that Willow and Xander and the Scoobies kept him out of the loop on bringing Buffy back because, if she came back wrong, Spike wouldn't have allowed them to take her away again. He would have done everything to keep whatever version of Buffy came back because, to him, she would have still been Buffy. Even if she was evil.
 
Lyri said:
I think it means that, raising Buffy from the grave, putting her soul back into her rotting corpse, regenerating that corpse, the magic that was used to tie it all together, all of that changed Buffy's makeup on a genetic level, meaning that she didn't register as human to the chip anymore. It didn't change or affect her anymore severely than the equivalent of a deep suntan. Hence Tara's analogy.
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I still don't get it though. A tan, or even a severe sunburn, doesn't change your genetic makeup, does it?

I guess I do understand that the chip doesn't recognise somebody who used to be dead and was magically brought back to life, I just don't think it's explained very well. I don't know why the writers couldn't have just had Tara say it that way, instead of writing something about Buffy being different on a molecular level, which surely, if anything, means she DID come back wrong.
 
It was an analogy. Tara wasn't saying that a sunburn changes anyone's genetic makeup. She was saying that the changes that Buffy DID go through have no more of an affect on her, as a person, a human, a Slayer, than a sunburn would have on a normal person. A sunburn doesn't affect a person, other than make them slightly uncomfortable for a little while, hence, Buffy's changes didn't affect her, either.
 
Lyri said:
It was an analogy. Tara wasn't saying that a sunburn changes anyone's genetic makeup. She was saying that the changes that Buffy DID go through have no more of an affect on her, as a person, a human, a Slayer, than a sunburn would have on a normal person. A sunburn doesn't affect a person, other than make them slightly uncomfortable for a little while, hence, Buffy's changes didn't affect her, either.
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Oh I see. Thank you Lyri. I understand now!

I still think the stuff about Buffy changing on a molecular level was uncalled for though, because it means she did come back wrong, no matter how small the effect. But anyway, sorry for going off topic
 
I think in the context of the show we are supposed to think that soul less equals evil, but then we have Spike who has been conditioned to be less evil. So Buffy would be like a merciless slayer. Like psychotic Faith probably. Or Wishverse Buffy maybe.

YummySushiPJs said:
I still don't get it though. A tan, or even a severe sunburn, doesn't change your genetic makeup, does it?

I guess I do understand that the chip doesn't recognise somebody who used to be dead and was magically brought back to life, I just don't think it's explained very well. I don't know why the writers couldn't have just had Tara say it that way, instead of writing something about Buffy being different on a molecular level, which surely, if anything, means she DID come back wrong.
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I think it has to do with the ridiculousness of the chip. How does the chip know who is human or demon. And who came back from the dead. I could see that Buffy coming back from the dead could confuse the chip into thinking she's a vampire or a zombie, which Spike can fight, but how does the chip distinguish who is what?
 
YummySushiPJs said:
I never understood the explanation for why Spike could hit Buffy. She didn't come back wrong, but she had changed on a molecular level? What? Deep tropical tan? Talk sense, Tara.
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Here's an explanation - Tara's lying. Why? To protect Willow, to protect Buffy and to avoid responsibility 'cause it's not just Willow that brought Buffy back - Tara, Anya and Xander did their parts as well. Remember, the spell was interrupted, it makes sense that Buffy came back wrong.
 
I think the point is that Buffy's "essence" in the Cartesian sense is the thing that remained intact and this is the thing that houses Buffy's sense of personal identity. I think that's what Tara was saying.
 
Fuffy Baith said:
I think in the context of the show we are supposed to think that soul less equals evil, but then we have Spike who has been conditioned to be less evil. So Buffy would be like a merciless slayer. Like psychotic Faith probably. Or Wishverse Buffy maybe.


I think it has to do with the ridiculousness of the chip. How does the chip know who is human or demon. And who came back from the dead. I could see that Buffy coming back from the dead could confuse the chip into thinking she's a vampire or a zombie, which Spike can fight, but how does the chip distinguish who is what?
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I think it's more like the soul is the equivalent of a conscience, the ability to distinguish right from wrong and for a basically good person to feel guilt or remorse for doing something considered wrong, hence the overwhelming feeling of guilt that both Angel and Spike initially felt upon regaining their souls.

As for the chip, not only would it prevent Spike from hurting a living human, it would even prevent him from pointing an inoperative gun at Xander, and remain functional for several years inside Spike's skull without ever needing to be recharged. That's literally miracle medicine in action.
 
Fuffy Baith
Fuffy Baith
That makes the chip sound even more ridiculous imo. But agreed about the soul part.
If all that came back was a soulless shell, Angel (and Giles, for that matter) would put her to rest. It would be the natural thing to do; walking dead is kind of an abomination against nature after all. I think Willow would lay her to rest as well, but would probably attempt to iron out the wrinkles and try again.

Ensouled Spike would do the same thing as the above parties. As he was in S6, he would attempt to protect the hollow shell of Buffy because that would be better than not having her at all. I don't think he'd get far though: a determined Angel, Giles and/or Willow (especially the latter) would take him out pretty quick.
 
Silverspike
Silverspike
Well they could try but I imagine an equally determine Spike would defend her to his last.
In "Forever 5ABB17". Dawn attempts to bring back her mother and we see the silhouette of a shuffling zombie-like person through the drapes, and this is what I would expect of someone who came back wrong. Buffy came back disoriented but not without her normal personality and character which took a few episodes to return.

What the chip recognizes as human and what we would recognize as human may be two different things. From the beginning with Sineya, the first slayer, the slayer was infused with demon essence and that continued throughout slayer history. The chip may not have recognized the reconstituted Buffy as human because the demon essence may have remained during the 148 days she was dead. The chip may have considered Buffy to be pure demon at this point because demon had survived Buffy's death and reanimation. As shown in "Afterlife 6ABB03", there was a hitchhiker entity that came back with Buffy and it seems that, in parallel with quantum mechanical terms, Buffy split into a "nearly Buffy" and a hitchhiker and the chip was fooled by the missing essence like a radioactive atom splitting into a different atom and a particle such as a beta particle (an electron) and a positive charge so the chip did not recognize it.
 
Quick question for those with a better memory than me. Does Spike ever actually attack Buffy while chipped and get the pain? I can remember Willow and Xander but I'm struggling to think of him going for Buffy and getting a headache. Is it possible that the chip doesn't work for slayers or do I just have a poor memory? 
Answered my own question. Spike got a headache grabbing Buffy in Fool For Love. Move along nothing to see here...
 
@Ethan Reigns You just confused me even more. If Buffy has demon essence cause she's the slayer then shouldn't the chip recognize that even before she dies? My question is how does the chip know the difference? Was that ever explained?
 
SiegePerilous02 said:
If all that came back was a soulless shell, Angel (and Giles, for that matter) would put her to rest. It would be the natural thing to do; walking dead is kind of an abomination against nature after all. I think Willow would lay her to rest as well, but would probably attempt to iron out the wrinkles and try again.

Ensouled Spike would do the same thing as the above parties. As he was in S6, he would attempt to protect the hollow shell of Buffy because that would be better than not having her at all. I don't think he'd get far though: a determined Angel, Giles and/or Willow (especially the latter) would take him out pretty quick.
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Don't count Spike out all that easily. People, including Buffy, have been trying to dust him for over a century, and he's managed to stay completely solid so far. He's good in a fight, and he has no problem running away if necessary.

And just let me say that all very encouraging, because I've come up with the idea for a fan fiction, the first that I've even attempted in years, for which I was looking for an unusual, even surprising twist, and absolutely none of you have even come close to what I had planned.

This may be even more fun than I had first imagined.
 
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