If you could change one thing in the verse

I also wish the instances of sexual assaults on men we witnessed had been addressed more properly, especially Faith's attempted rape (and murder) of Xander : they're always treated as a joke or ignored altogether, and it's a bit skeevy.
 
Bite-me
Bite-me
I wonder how they would have conveyed that, Xander masks his insecurity/vulnerability with humor but at least one scene of him inquiring after Faith and her blowing him off, and a begrudging appreciative thank you to Angel would have worked well.
Hi all,

I was wondering if you could change one thing in the verse that is currently canon what would you change? I know it's hard to choose one so we can have one for Bts and one for Ats. Here are mine:

BTVS: No AR. I would change it to Spike almost killing Buffy instead of raping as I think she would get over that more easily and S7 Spuffy would be more convincing. I mean, he did try to kill her a lot before and it would still be a very intense scene.


Buffy: I agree with the No AR scene on BTVS and your idea is much better.

Angel: Have Faith join the main cast.
 
I also wish the instances of sexual assaults on men we witnessed had been addressed more properly, especially Faith's attempted rape (and murder) of Xander

Faith never tried to rape Xander, she tried to strangle him in an attempt to shut him up/possible thrill-kill.

Now the whole thing with Faith and Riley? That should've been handled better, by everyone involved.
Still, that's not the worst sexual assault screw-up on the show's part.
 
Faith never tried to rape Xander, she tried to strangle him in an attempt to shut him up/possible thrill-kill.

Now the whole thing with Faith and Riley? That should've been handled better, by everyone involved.
Still, that's not the worst sexual assault screw-up on the show's part.
Maybe I should've said sexually assaulted him, as we don't know what might have happened afterwards . We can agree that she did that, right ?
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@thetopher There's a very sexual component to the whole encounter and she's definitely forcing herself on him in one fashion or another. If the genders were reversed there would be little doubt about that.
 
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thetopher
thetopher
Yes. Strangling is bad. Faith was a bad slayer.
Buffy: I agree with the No AR scene on BTVS and your idea is much better.
[/QUOTE)





I have an idea. Maybe Spike could try to kill Buffy and trun her into a vampire to be his eternal love. That would be as intense as an AR but easier for Buffy to get over after he got his soul.
 
Bite-me
Bite-me
Yes that would have been plenty horrendous and unforgivable, and a violation from someone she trusted, its works as analogy without the sexual assault optics well by passing the problematic saint Buffy trope of S7 forgiving that POS. Sorry lol
@MarieVampSlayer

What would your S7 Buffy be like? How would she be different?

Not wanting to derail, I'll be brief. I'd like Buffy to see her friends as her allies that she needs as much as they need her rather than her flunkies, and not be so blinded by the wonder that is Spike (unless they changed Spike as well, the less said the better for keeping this thread on track). This is the only season I actually dislike Buffy as a person, and I don't want to feel that way.

They could also remember that while Buffy does feel she is the Slayer, she has always seen that as making her uniquely obligated to face threats rather than ordering others to risk their lives (in the past she frequently forbid others from doing so, and felt responsibility for their safety when they did come with her). While she has led the Scoobies, and even the graduating class of 1999, into battle before, she always had a plan rather than simply raid and ruin the day of the Big Bads. She did recon and prepared special (and often very creative and resourceful) tactics in previous seasons, sometimes getting special weapons (she'd definitely make strategic use of that rocket launcher that she had...Olaf's Hammer might also be worth using, or explaining why it's no longer around).

My criticism on season 7 is aimed solely at the show, not the people who enjoy it, so please take no offense if you actually like it. This is just my own opinion. This is such a heated topic that can easily derail a thread that I almost didn't answer it, but then thought if I don't answer it because of the people who take offense then I might as well leave BB completely since I can't really say anything without it possibly rubbing someone the wrong way.
 
MarieVampSlayer
MarieVampSlayer
Thanks for sharing! It's important to state your opinion and don't worry as far as I am concern you can't really offend me :)
BtVS: Last scene of Empty Places as well as all of Touched. S7 should be about patching up, not tearing down.

AtS: Angel and Cordelia should have stayed friends. Cordelia should have kept some of her sass, maturity made her dull.
 
MarieVampSlayer
MarieVampSlayer
I agree about Cordy. A lot of people I know are sassy AND mature! It's possible!
Buffy: there are ways in which I like Spike and he made his fair contributions to the show and canon, but spare us already and just dust Spike at some point in the later seasons, before laying the groundwork for Spuffy.

Angel: I like RachM's idea of making Holtz unsuccessful in stealing away Connor. The difficulty would be in portraying a growing Connor, but maybe they could make the seasons closer in time (having subsequent seasons only progress a few months at a time for example). As long as we still get Illyria I'm good.
 
Buffy: S4, fast forward the college years, instead of dropping out season after season, first half light hearted adjusting, enlists shiftless Giles into exploration dark slayer origin that is calling to her, the drifting of core four, Spike gets chipped, Buffy's depression arc with existential realization she can never have a normal life, dropping out, sleeping with a enemy who is a actual enemy and not neutered. Basically have season four be the dramatic season six. Well, it is sleeping with the enemy (very dramatic) its none of the later creepiness. B is a depressed nineteen/twenty year old adjusting to the real world with a real minimum wage job, not like returning from hell, quasi suicidal and abandoning her family and friends etc etc etc its all very dramatic but less dark in effect, because instead of "BTVS the college years" it makes complete sense for S4 to be the major transitory period for the show into the real world. I think fans would be accepting of this plot arc if it came first.


Angel: Going into it, I would have kept the vampire with soul as recovering alcoholic analogy, recast Kate and kept the noir detective set up. Usually in this genre the anti hero detective has someone on the inside providing them with information which is the role Kate was suppose to play. Instead of Kate as cop seduced into drugs during a undercover prostitution sting (her original conception) paralleling Angels' addiction metaphor, I'd have the character possibly be male, well the alcoholic detective is a cliche, it discard the Angel and Kate as a will they or won't they Mulder and Scully parody, having the Scully also be male, counter intitutively works as a subversion, as well as fulfilling the buddy cop traditional set up. Cast Whistler as Doyle. Keep Cordelia as herself, have Faith join the team.
 
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Hi all,

I was wondering if you could change one thing in the verse that is currently canon what would you change? I know it's hard to choose one so we can have one for Bts and one for Ats. Here are mine:

BTVS: No AR. I would change it to Spike almost killing Buffy instead of raping as I think she would get over that more easily and S7 Spuffy would be more convincing. I mean, he did try to kill her a lot before and it would still be a very intense scene.

ATS: A real realtionship between Fred and Wes. I just can't get over that they only has ONE DAY!!!

What are yours?

First, the impossible - Angel staying on Buffy after season three but us still getting Angel the TV show as it was so great! (They'd have had to clone David Boreanaz or something given his work schedule)

Second, the abstract - keeping the vibe of Seasons one and two and kind of three rather than making it much lighter and less interesting season four onwards.

Thirdly, just remembered - Giles still being more "British" and "formal" like he was in the first two seasons with Buffy rather than what we got which was a watered-down attempt at a relaxed, cool and occasionally funny guy. The serious guy kept the episodes tight in terms of exposition and structural dynamic. After two he kind of fell by the wayside into a bit-part player.
 
Buffy: I can't decide ... I dislike Spuffy for several reasons and Dawn annoyed me so much ... I choose: Spuffy should not have happened.

Angel: I wished there were more actions of Wesley and Fred instead of Gunn and Fred. But I decide that Connor should not exist. That boy was so needless and I was quite pleased when he were out of the picture. But grr Wesley brought back all those memories.
 
Buffy: I can't decide ... I dislike Spuffy for several reasons and Dawn annoyed me so much ... I choose: Spuffy should not have happened.

Angel: I wished there were more actions of Wesley and Fred instead of Gunn and Fred. But I decide that Connor should not exist. That boy was so needless and I was quite pleased when he were out of the picture. But grr Wesley brought back all those memories.
I love Spuffy and don't really dislike Dawn so I don't agree withe the Buffy part. But I agree with the Angel part. I don't hate Conner so much, but he's defenitely not my favourite character. And I LOOOOOVE Fred/Wesley! So I totally agree that we should have had way more Ferd and Wesley scenes!
 
And I LOOOOOVE Fred/Wesley! So I totally agree that we should have had way more Ferd and Wesley scenes!

They were sooo beautiful together. ONE MUST SIMPLY LOVE THEM 🙂
A hole in the world is my #1 heart-wrenching episode. Just thinking about it gives me the feels. They way Alexis and Amy embodied them was perfect, they had some chemistry. And his grief in S5 was so powerful. Lucky him, he could see her beautiful face before his lights dimmed.
 
Willow Tara
Willow Tara
Amen! Oh my god I couldn't have said it better! This is so true!!!
A hole in the world is my #1 heart-wrenching episode. Just thinking about it gives me the feels.
Lucky him, he could see her beautiful face before his lights dimmed.
I cry everytime I watch Freds and Wes' death 🙁 😢😭😭!!!
They were sooo beautiful together. ONE MUST SIMPLY LOVE THEM 🙂
They way Alexis and Amy embodied them was perfect, they had some chemistry. And his grief in S5 was so powerful.
Agree 100%!!!
I loved them since the scene in Fredless when... Oh I already mentioned that in a post:
OMG Fresley. They had one fr*cking day!!!! They deserved SO MUCH MORE SCREEN TIME!!!! imo. I shipped Fred & Wes since this scene in Fredless: Fred: I belong here. Un-unless I don't. Which if - if you all don't wanna put up with me, I completely understand... Wesley: Let's put it to a vote, shall we? All in favor say "aye". Aye. Motion passed. Good. You're staying.
I shipped them since then and it took sooo long until they finally... okay need to stop. And when I am talking about since when I loved my OTPs, I loved Tillow since the first time we saw Tara in Hush (even before the scene with the hands) when she looks at Willow. (No joke. I loved them since then.)
I couldn't find an image for the scene that I mean, but this is an image from the same episode. And I loved them since that episode (Fredless):
tumblr_m8tu55PKKC1qcah0ho3_250.gif
I love them so much! ♡♥️♡
 
I just want more Wesley and Illyria. The biggest tragedy of Angel's cancellation is that their utterly fascinating relationship got cut short.
Yeah I liked their relationship, but tbh I actually think that's mostly, not completely I really think they're interesting, but I guess I mostly love them because I miss Fred and Fresley so much that anything with Amy and Alexis makes me happy 🙂 And also because of what @MrsEssmich said:
They way Alexis and Amy embodied them was perfect, they had some chemistry. And his grief in S5 was so powerful.
When Illyria says: "Wesley's dead. I'm feeling grief for him. I can't seem to control it. I wish to do more violence." (idk if I spelled that word correct) tumblr_nu6k1e6QvC1urerp6o1_250.gif
And those scenes:
c7360c1ecc071d8afed931af30419003.png
92fe704b3b260a9638956f7b96a82afe.jpg
And also the one where Illyria says these lines: "You still grief for a single life." "She can't return to you." And "But there are fragments. Memories. 'Please Wesley, why can't I stay?'" (I didn't find an image for that scene)
 
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